King of Nothing Posted June 24, 2011 Report Share Posted June 24, 2011 [quote name='Passions of the Flame' timestamp='1308897176' post='5307005'] There is more slavery in the bible than there was in the Confederate States. Animals don't cause genocide like what happened to the Armenians. [/quote] What about natural selection? Sometimes, animals will infact hunt off an entire group because that group isn't adapt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Posted June 24, 2011 Report Share Posted June 24, 2011 [quote name='King of Nothing' timestamp='1308896849' post='5306998'] I'm pretty sure people would still discriminate on sexual orientation without religion, as with everything else. For a time, religion was what was stopping slavery. People had to "bend" what religion stated in order for people to accept the slave trade, in which they used the Story of Ham. And I'm still holding to my point that most people just use religion as a scapegoat in order to get land or money. I'm not saying that there has never been a war based on or using religion ever, I'm simply saying that without religion humans would still find ways to fight. It's instinct. Animals don't have religion and they fight. And, if it's optional, and nobody is forced to say it, why is it so bad to let people who want to say the pledge of allegience with "under God"? I can't possibly see how it's hurting anyone, or offending anyone, since it doesn't say "Under the Christian/Catholic God", just "under God". I'm not an Atheist, so I don't understand what does and doesn't offend atheists, but I'm pretty sure that if Atheists and atheist sayings don't offend me, mentionings of a higher being shouldn't offend them. Also...don't we pretty much just use the pledge at military events now? It's not used at school anymore (at least where I am) and it's not mandatory anywhere... Why can't you just let religion have this one? [/quote] People actually fighting over this expecting anything to get done are retarded. Our government has seventy million other things to worry about, so regardless of what anyone wants, religion is going to have this one. It just irks me that back in the twentieth century we [b]changed[/b] the pledge to include "under God" because society was afraid of atheism taking over or some bullshit like that. I personally don't care since I don't recite the pledge anyways, but I will never understood how retarded this country could be to change it when they knew it would result in discussions like this. Like, seriously, did we not have other things to worry about then? Two animals fighting over a piece of meat is different. Religion allows organized groups of people to fight. I'd much rather have two Japanese fighting fish kill each other than have two [b]schools[/b] of Japanese fighting fish kill each other. Granted, the latter would be cooler to watch, but what if those fish were human? Religion keeps everyone in sects or groups of people so that if Christianity fights against Islam, 90% of all Christians will fight against 90% of all Muslims. Also, touching on the topic of religion in public schools, it absolutely should not be tolerated. I don't care if people silently pray before a test if they think it'll do them any good, but it is simply unacceptable for people to publicly recite prayers in a setting where it could instigate a fight or lead to discrimination or "religious wars" in school. School is a place for facts, and I honestly don't give a rat's ass if your religion doesn't like evolution, you will still learn about Darwin and the [b]facts[/b] he discovered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JadenxAtemYAOI Posted June 24, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 24, 2011 [quote name='King of Nothing' timestamp='1308906506' post='5307131'] What about natural selection? Sometimes, animals will infact hunt off an entire group because that group isn't adapt. [/quote] Survival of the fittest /=/ genocide with religious reasoning Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King of Nothing Posted June 24, 2011 Report Share Posted June 24, 2011 [quote name='Dark' timestamp='1308944464' post='5307782'] People actually fighting over this expecting anything to get done are retarded. Our government has seventy million other things to worry about, so regardless of what anyone wants, religion is going to have this one. It just irks me that back in the twentieth century we [b]changed[/b] the pledge to include "under God" because society was afraid of atheism taking over or some bullshit like that. I personally don't care since I don't recite the pledge anyways, but I will never understood how retarded this country could be to change it when they knew it would result in discussions like this. Like, seriously, did we not have other things to worry about then? Two animals fighting over a piece of meat is different. Religion allows organized groups of people to fight. I'd much rather have two Japanese fighting fish kill each other than have two [b]schools[/b] of Japanese fighting fish kill each other. Granted, the latter would be cooler to watch, but what if those fish were human? Religion keeps everyone in sects or groups of people so that if Christianity fights against Islam, 90% of all Christians will fight against 90% of all Muslims. Also, touching on the topic of religion in public schools, it absolutely should not be tolerated. I don't care if people silently pray before a test if they think it'll do them any good, but it is simply unacceptable for people to publicly recite prayers in a setting where it could instigate a fight or lead to discrimination or "religious wars" in school. School is a place for facts, and I honestly don't give a rat's ass if your religion doesn't like evolution, you will still learn about Darwin and the [b]facts[/b] he discovered. [/quote] I believe in evolution and natural selection. Why do you think I used it as an example? Also, Christianity, Catholicism, and everything else in the Christian branch has already accepted Evolution and Natural Selection to be a fact under the Intelligent Design theory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Posted June 24, 2011 Report Share Posted June 24, 2011 [quote name='King of Nothing' timestamp='1308945083' post='5307802'] I believe in evolution and natural selection. Why do you think I used it as an example? Also, Christianity, Catholicism, and everything else in the Christian branch has already accepted Evolution and Natural Selection to be a fact under the Intelligent Design theory. [/quote] Intelligent design implies that humans did not evolve from lower life forms, and also implies that we could not have shared a common ancestor with apes. Unless I'm misunderstanding what the "new" intelligent design theory is. And I don't care what "Christianity" claims to believe in when you still have ~30% of conservative Christians who "don't believe in no damn evolution" and are ignorant and retarded in their beliefs. I don't care how liberal you are; don't speak for your entire religion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King of Nothing Posted June 24, 2011 Report Share Posted June 24, 2011 [quote name='Dark' timestamp='1308945387' post='5307812'] Intelligent design implies that humans did not evolve from lower life forms, and also implies that we could not have shared a common ancestor with apes. Unless I'm misunderstanding what the "new" intelligent design theory is. And I don't care what "Christianity" claims to believe in when you still have ~30% of conservative Christians who "don't believe in no damn evolution" and are ignorant and retarded in their beliefs. I don't care how liberal you are; don't speak for your entire religion. [/quote] Actually, I'm a conservative. I just believe that god created man to evolve, and for that soul purpose. And if I can't speak for my religion, neither can you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Posted June 24, 2011 Report Share Posted June 24, 2011 [quote name='King of Nothing' timestamp='1308946143' post='5307837'] Actually, I'm a conservative. I just believe that god created man to evolve, and for that soul purpose. And if I can't speak for my religion, neither can you [/quote] I didn't mean conservative as corresponding to "Republican", but rather conservative/liberal can be applied to how strongly you hold your beliefs and how traditional (stupid, in the modern world) you are with your beliefs. And I don't give a rat's ass if you speak for "only the Christians who ___", but don't claim to speak for your entire religion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King of Nothing Posted June 24, 2011 Report Share Posted June 24, 2011 [quote name='Dark' timestamp='1308948722' post='5307914'] I didn't mean conservative as corresponding to "Republican", but rather conservative/liberal can be applied to how strongly you hold your beliefs and how traditional (stupid, in the modern world) you are with your beliefs. And I don't give a rat's ass if you speak for "only the Christians who ___", but don't claim to speak for your entire religion. [/quote] It's funny how most people not apart of a religion allow the idiots to speak for that entire religion, but won't let the others speak for it. I actually haven't met anyone who doesn't believe in some form of intelligent design within my religion, and I've seen quite a few people who actually believe in a form of intelligent design where God created fish in the belief that they would adapt and become monkeys, who would adapt and become humans. That's the intelligent design I believe in, anyways. I mean, humans are still evolving. People now are much taller, bigger and stronger than before. That being said, they've also lost the ability to survive in the wild because there is no need for that ability. I'm not debating that evolution and natural selection don't exist, I'm debating that there's no real need to remove "under God" from the pledge. There's waaaaaay more important things to be complaining about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Posted June 24, 2011 Report Share Posted June 24, 2011 [i]I actually haven't met anyone[/i] I actually haven't met anyone who was Christian with an IQ of more than seventy. I guess that makes both of us liars. [i]intelligent design where God created fish in the belief that they would adapt and become monkeys, who would adapt and become humans[/i] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intelligent_design > "are best explained by an intelligent cause, not an undirected process such as natural selection" You can say that you believe in evolution but that the first origins of life came from a supreme being, but unfortunately that belief isn't intelligent design. Intelligent design DIRECTLY goes against evolutionism and natural selection and anything and everything Darwin, so you are mis-labeling your beliefs. [i]I'm debating that there's no real need to remove "under God" from the pledge. There's waaaaaay more important things to be complaining about. [/i] Well, I'm fairly sure everyone agrees with you. It doesn't matter who wants what, the government has too many things to deal with at the moment and cba to change something this frivolous. I'm angry, and I assume everyone else in this topic is angry, that the government was retarded enough to change it in the first place. I don't give a rat's ass if some religious extremists don't want this country to be secular. They can go commit suicide for all I care. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King of Nothing Posted June 25, 2011 Report Share Posted June 25, 2011 Note how I did say "I believe in a FORM of intelligent design". I highly doubt wikipedia has every belief of every version of every belief within it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fenrir Posted June 25, 2011 Report Share Posted June 25, 2011 [quote name='King of Nothing' timestamp='1308906506' post='5307131'] What about natural selection? Sometimes, animals will infact hunt off an entire group because that group isn't adapt. [/quote] I just want to point something out, animals don't kill unless they need to. By need to, I mean to survive. Ie: food. Sometimes to defend their territory or to protect their young, or themselves. There are only a few animals that have ever shown the desire to kill for other reasons. Humans, certain primates, dolphins, elephants (although apparently they'll kill for revenge/anger over lost loved ones.) and honey badgers. The last one you don't want to f***ing meet. So no animal has really killed another group because they were merely inept, rather, that group succumbed to being hunted by another group of animals which found them easy prey. They didn't go, "Oh, look at those losers. Let's go kill them." Even if you didn't mean that, at least word it properly, because it really doesn't help your argument. >__> Now if you'll excuse me, I'll head back to my rock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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