Why is faith good?

[Felix]

[quote='HORUS' pid='2782595' dateline='1250030087']
[quote='Felix' pid='2780972' dateline='1250016591']
Weak-minded is quite harsh, in return I could call you close-minded right?

For most it would be a consolidation and meaning thing.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sT95mRT9090

It gives people something to fall back on and belong to.
[/quote]

A close-minded person is one who refuses to examine evidence or consider options. I've done both in regards to religion and decided against being religious. Most religious people would look at evidence that does not support their religion and say, [b]"What? This doesn't comply with the Bible!" and dismiss it entirely.[/b]

Weak-minded people are most usually close-minded, and most religious people have a close-minded attitude toward atheism and other religions.
[/quote]

Fuck:/ It took a while but it was worth it.

But no, you're thinking stereo types here. Your assumption is that anybody who believes in a greater power is automatically thick headed and ignorant. Not so; there have been numerous occasions where men and women of science have been lured over to the “other side” by reason and logic, not “magic” or a weak-minded lapse of intelligent behaviour. Anyway we're off track from the original topic, or at least I was heading in a different direction.

When I wake up tomorrow I'll try to give this my full attention. I like arguing with someone so I guess a debate is a little bit tamer than that.

Religion is good thing because if security, even if it’s false. That’s a pretty solid statement to leave on.

[Lemniscate]

Religion provides a sense of purpose to a person's life, and helps guide them in times where they are at a loss for what to do. Religions don't control a person's life, they are like a guidebook, directions on how to steer your ship in the river of life, and a person can choose to follow them or not. A person who follows the directions will still be faced with trials and tribulations, but they may also be happier, for the feeling that there is someone greater than them to believes in the goodness inside of them, and who is willing to assist them in their endeavors, no matter how trivial. A religious person sees religion as a way for them to help make decisions in their life, decisions they believe to be so important as to supersede their ability to fully decide. Religion does not hurt people, those who believe in it, or those who don't, what does hurt people is the misdirection some may draw from reading things they may not yet understand. There is a reason that people have to go to school to teach a religion, it is because religion is something that requires time to understand, and that requires effort to interpret. Religion is not something someone can do without training, religion is there for those who feel their life is empty, and who are looking for answers as to what the truth of life is. It doesn't matter if religion is true or not, what matters is the hope it brings to the people who believe in it, and the faith it requires of those follow it. Faith is the substance of things hoped for and the evidence of things not seen, and their is nothing truly harmful in that.

[Tabris]

Religion is good thing because if security, even if it’s false. That’s a pretty solid statement to leave on.

 

Convincing yourself that you're not being mauled by a bear, even if you are, is a good thing?

[Dark]

Tsk, tsk, tsk, HORUS.

 

The title makes it seem like 100% of the population believes religious faith is good. LIES.

 

Faith is neither good or bad. In fact, it changes nothing. Hoping and praying and having faith will amount to the same outcome as not hoping and not praying and not having faith. It's a false sense of happiness.

 

I have a question. If I walk around with a fully-loaded rifle and point it at people telling them to believe in the Wahamakilokofatiguaga God, otherwise I will shoot, how many people will I convert in a day, assuming infinite ammo.

[Guest JoshIcy]

The worlds oldest, and most effective mass-motivational tool.

Still is...

[Tabris]

Faith is neither good or bad. In fact, it changes nothing. Hoping and praying and having faith will amount to the same outcome as not hoping and not praying and not having faith. It's a false sense of happiness.

 

Do elaborate.

 

It seems my insomnia's gotten the better of me, but do tell us more.

[Dark]

Faith is neither good or bad. In fact' date=' it changes nothing. Hoping and praying and having faith will amount to the same outcome as not hoping and not praying and not having faith. It's a false sense of happiness.[/i']

 

Do elaborate.

 

It seems my insomnia's gotten the better of me, but do tell us more.

 

Let's repeat my die example.

 

Imagine a world with only atheists and a seperate world with only theists.

 

The atheists roll a die without believing in God, without hoping, without praying, etc. But in the back of their mind, they want it to land on 4, strictly because of a bet. 1/6 chance.

 

The theists roll a die. The believe in God, and they pray to him, they hope with all their might, and believe as strong as possibly that the die will land on 4. They want it to land on 4 as well. There chances are still 1/6, however.

 

In example 1, the atheists knew the chances, the PROVEN chances, and sat back and let the die go.

 

In example 2, the theists also knew the chances, the PROVEN chances, but actually hoped and believed and prayed. They were lured into a false sense of confidence and happiness, but their odds were still the same.

 

This example can also apply to other situations, but die is easy.

[Flame Dragon]

Faith is neither good or bad. In fact' date=' it changes nothing. Hoping and praying and having faith will amount to the same outcome as not hoping and not praying and not having faith. It's a false sense of happiness.[/i']

 

Do elaborate.

 

It seems my insomnia's gotten the better of me, but do tell us more.

 

Let's repeat my die example.

 

Imagine a world with only atheists and a seperate world with only theists.

 

The atheists roll a die without believing in God, without hoping, without praying, etc. But in the back of their mind, they want it to land on 4, strictly because of a bet. 1/6 chance.

 

The theists roll a die. The believe in God, and they pray to him, they hope with all their might, and believe as strong as possibly that the die will land on 4. They want it to land on 4 as well. There chances are still 1/6, however.

 

In example 1, the atheists knew the chances, the PROVEN chances, and sat back and let the die go.

 

In example 2, the theists also knew the chances, the PROVEN chances, but actually hoped and believed and prayed. They were lured into a false sense of confidence and happiness, but their odds were still the same.

 

This example can also apply to other situations, but die is easy.

WHEN HAS ANYONE SAID THAT FAITH CAN CHANGE THE UNCHANGEABLE!!!

 

No one, and those that do think that are just being stupid.

 

I've said I don't know how many times and it's been said by others too. Faith conferts people by the thought that their is more to this life and they are made happy by that thought. The thought of the loss of a loved one is eased ever so by the thought that they will be with them again. Even if they don't and their is nothing after this life their life ended with those thoughts and so they are happy because they think their is something.

[OMGAKITTY]

Religion provides a sense of purpose to a person's life' date=' and helps guide them in times where they are at a loss for what to do. Religions don't control a person's life, they are like a guidebook, directions on how to steer your ship in the river of life, and a person can choose to follow them or not. A person who follows the directions will still be faced with trials and tribulations, but they may also be happier, for the feeling that there is someone greater than them to believes in the goodness inside of them, and who is willing to assist them in their endeavors, no matter how trivial. A religious person sees religion as a way for them to help make decisions in their life, decisions they believe to be so important as to supersede their ability to fully decide. Religion does not hurt people, those who believe in it, or those who don't, what does hurt people is the misdirection some may draw from reading things they may not yet understand. There is a reason that people have to go to school to teach a religion, it is because religion is something that requires time to understand, and that requires effort to interpret. Religion is not something someone can do without training, religion is there for those who feel their life is empty, and who are looking for answers as to what the truth of life is. It doesn't matter if religion is true or not, what matters is the hope it brings to the people who believe in it, and the faith it requires of those follow it. Faith is the substance of things hoped for and the evidence of things not seen, and their is nothing truly harmful in that.

[/quote']

 

This. Although throwing in some paragraphs would have helped in the reading >_>

 

Life without God seems like an empty existence to me, and not one I want to live.

[Tabris]

Life without God seems like an empty existence to me' date=' and not one I want to live.

[/quote']

 

How about me (for instance)? I don't believe in supernatural beings, yet I live a happy life (despite my ever-changing moods)?

[OMGAKITTY]

Life without God seems like an empty existence to me' date=' and not one I want to live.

[/quote']

 

How about me (for instance)? I don't believe in supernatural beings, yet I live a happy life (despite my ever-changing moods)?

 

You are you, and I am me.

 

I said it seems like an empty and worthless existence to me.

[Flame Dragon]

Life without God seems like an empty existence to me' date=' and not one I want to live.

[/quote']

Why though? In day to day life a person rarely thinks of god. The only time the thought of god comes up is when

1) People are talking about it.

2) Some one close to you dies.

Side from that I never think about god and the same goes for most people.

 

Of those 2 faith only really matters when you loss some one because then it can help you deal with that loss.

[OMGAKITTY]

Life without God seems like an empty existence to me' date=' and not one I want to live.

[/quote']

Why though? In day to day life a person rarely thinks of god. The only time the thought of god comes up is when

1) People are talking about it.

2) Some one close to you dies.

Side from that I never think about god and the same goes for most people.

 

Of those 2 faith only really matters when you loss some one because then it can help you deal with that loss.

 

I hardly say it needs to be that extreme for one to turn to religion. Under any type of duress, most people tend to turn back to religion. Which is something I love about Christianity, knowing that no matter how much turmoil my life is in at the moment, there is that unchanging love from God there for me.

 

But enough of that. I think its an empty existence, because I think of what it means to not believe in God: that all this around me, it was all an accident. That I serve no greater purpose, that I am truly insignificant. That nothing I do will matter. That there is nothing beyond this short span of time I am on this Earth. Its not a life that appeals to me.

[Flame Dragon]

Life without God seems like an empty existence to me' date=' and not one I want to live.

[/quote']

Why though? In day to day life a person rarely thinks of god. The only time the thought of god comes up is when

1) People are talking about it.

2) Some one close to you dies.

Side from that I never think about god and the same goes for most people.

 

Of those 2 faith only really matters when you loss some one because then it can help you deal with that loss.

 

I hardly say it needs to be that extreme for one to turn to religion. Under any type of duress, most people tend to turn back to religion. Which is something I love about Christianity, knowing that no matter how much turmoil my life is in at the moment, there is that unchanging love from God there for me.

 

But enough of that. I think its an empty existence, because I think of what it means to not believe in God: that all this around me, it was all an accident. That I serve no greater purpose, that I am truly insignificant. That nothing I do will matter. That there is nothing beyond this short span of time I am on this Earth. Its not a life that appeals to me.

Well, those were the only times I've found myself thinking about god.

 

I do agree on the end part of the second part and that is why I believe in something after this life because it would suck if this is it. But life wouldn't be empty since that would mean that we have no impact. Which isn't true. We affect everything from the look of Earth, and even space, to how people live.

[OMGAKITTY]

We as a race do. You personally...?

[¶nÇØGn¶TØ]

Religion is the basic form of morality. Without it, there would be none. How do you know what is good and what is bad? Where did you think those ideas/standards came from?

 

Religion is also a what keeps people together. It is because they share the same beliefs and experiences. For short there is order. Without order, there would be chaos. Why do you we still have crime and violence? It's because those people forget.

 

If you claim that you don't have any Religion/Faith but claim that you can do things on your own and for your good, then, i don't believe you. How will you know what is good and what is bad? You must have a benchmark. A foundation. A religion.

 

Unconsciously, you might be/have created your own religion. Faith is something you believe in. No one believes in nothing but everyone believes in something.

 

Just remember that Faith is always connected to what you believe in. It's what keeps us alive.

[Flame Dragon]

Religion is the basic form of morality. Without it' date=' there would be none. How do you know what is good and what is bad? Where did you think those ideas/standards came from?

[b']Logic 101 classes. Really it's basic. Don't steal, don't kill. Most other things come off of these basic ideas because these can be expanded to cover many things. You don't need faith to know not to do these things.[/b]

If you claim that you don't have any Religion/Faith but claim that you can do things on your own and for your good, then, i don't believe you. How will you know what is good and what is bad? You must have a benchmark. A foundation. A religion.

It's called parents.

Just remember that Faith is always connected to what you believe in. It's what keeps us alive.

No, our heart beat keeps us alive. Faith helps give people a feeling of security

[Huntar!]

Faith is good because it gives humans a sense of security, and a sense of purpose. Like there's something out there after we die, like we should do something with our meager existence while we can. "Maybe there's a heaven out there after all."

[OMGAKITTY]

Religion is the basic form of morality. Without it' date=' there would be none. How do you know what is good and what is bad? Where did you think those ideas/standards came from?

[b']Logic 101 classes. Really it's basic. Don't steal, don't kill. Most other things come off of these basic ideas because these can be expanded to cover many things. You don't need faith to know not to do these things.[/b]

But where did this idea really come from? Look at animals in nature: they will kill and steal, anything to make sure they (and their offspring...usually) survive. When did mankind decide that this was not OK? Why? Joe has food. I need food. I kill Joe, I now have his food. >_>

Somewhere down the line, someone figured out this was not acceptable. It was probably a religious figure. And you simplify it a bit much. The only two rules in life is to not kill and not steal? Hardly.

If you claim that you don't have any Religion/Faith but claim that you can do things on your own and for your good, then, i don't believe you. How will you know what is good and what is bad? You must have a benchmark. A foundation. A religion.

It's called parents.

And where did they learn it? It all has to lead back to somewhere...

Just remember that Faith is always connected to what you believe in. It's what keeps us alive.

No, our heart beat keeps us alive. Faith helps give people a feeling of security

I disagree. Without a belief into something, be it a god, or your own abilities as a human, I don't think you can continue to live. You lose all faith, you'll probably end up killing yourself.

[Static]

Not all atheists are good hearted. Many are bitter, amoral bastard children of the American Bureaucratic system. Greedy bastards who only don't believe in god to 1, downplay the value of religion, and thus the value of everything because they're insecure about their own value in the world, and 2, deny any sense of morality to justify the urges within them that they know are wrong but wish to view themselves, their egos, as the protagonist of the story they call their life.

 

That said, Religious faith is almost necessary. Fundamental difference is what causes division between man and thus many of the world's strifes. Now, I for one don't give a funk about that sort of problem anymore; over time I've learned that worrying about anything, and that sort of stuff especially, is a waste of my time. That said, a common sense of morality and justice holds a group of people together stronger than anything else can. Atheism is fine if it does not deny justice; religious teachings are fine if they do not deny justice, from the political standpoint.

 

From the spiritual standpoint, if an Atheist holds value in what is but can accept that what happens will happen, then he is spiritually stable. The same thing goes for any member of any religion, but I must say that the Vedas and Buddhist texts write out just this way of "living and not suffering" in much simpler words than any other religion seems to. The idea that "people should not suffer," falls under what is considerably "Just."

 

That's all there is to this, it doesn't depend on faith, it depends on what you make of your outlook on life.

 

Faith is good for the man with the right outlook.

 

Also, being closed minded is sometimes a good thing. We often exemplify the idea of "Gay marriage" when we talk about closed mindedness, but let me counter example: Necrophilia. From a moral standpoint, allowing Necrophilia would be wrong. It is disrespectful to the body of the dead. I don't suppose that anyone would want to argue in favor of allowing a sexual drive override the idea of morality, especially one of such a disrespectful nature. Morality must remain an important part of society, and realistically, people of faith are what keep it that way.

[Flame Dragon]

But where did this idea really come from? Look at animals in nature: they will kill and steal' date=' anything to make sure they (and their offspring...usually) survive. When did mankind decide that this was not OK? Why? Joe has food. I need food. I kill Joe, I now have his food. >_>

Somewhere down the line, someone figured out this was not acceptable. It was probably a religious figure. And you simplify it a bit much. The only two rules in life is to not kill and not steal? Hardly.[/i']

And where did they learn it? It all has to lead back to somewhere...

 

But animals don't kill randomly do they? They do for their own survival. Also animals will try not to kill to get food since that puts them selves at risk' date=' they will simply try to steal, same goes for basic humans. As time passed we were able to becomes more powerful and were able to gain manipulate the earth and so the need to kill and steal from others decreased all the while our intelligence increased. As that happened we simply realized that their is no reason to take the life or food from some one else since we already have and so these practices became frowned upon. And yes these people could have gone on to become religious figures, but even so the fact that others so easily agreed to it shows that they found these ideas logical and shows the advancement of the species and even with out the figure we would have reached that point on our own.

 

Also I'm not really over simplifying. Hell you can say killing other is theft since you are "stealing" their life. And again those are two of the most fundamental laws. There are others.

 

 

I disagree. Without a belief into something, be it a god, or your own abilities as a human, I don't think you can continue to live. You lose all faith, you'll probably end up killing yourself.

This I have to agree with.

Faith in self=self confidence. no faith in self=no self confidence and so their is a chance of you killing your self because this can lead to depression.

[¶nÇØGn¶TØ]

Faith is not all about God or religion. Faith is something you believe in. Faith is a word commonly mistaken because most believe that it has something to do with God or religion. That is wrong. Faith nowadays is mostly known as something to do with God or religion because they use them most of the time. But hey, what if your boss tells you that "I assigned this project to you because i have FAITH in you". Does that have to do anything with religion or God? It just means that your boss trusts you right?

 

Faith is a good thing. It is necessary. If anyone is against it, then you are wrong. Why? because you believe that Faith is not necessary. But then again, since you believed in something, doesn't that make you an instrument of Faith^_^

 

 

"And yes these people could have gone on to become religious figures, but even so the fact that others so easily agreed to it shows that they found these ideas logical and shows the advancement of the species and even with out the figure we would have reached that point on our own."

 

 

Do you really think that without Faith we can really reach that point? Again, faith is something you believe in. Scientists discover new things because they have faith in something and would try to do everything to prove that what they believed is true. People long ago never believed man can fly. Well, they were wrong weren't they? Animals also have faith. They have faith that their mate will help them survive or they have faith that their masters will feed them in order to live. Once they lose Faith in them, they leave and look for something else to believe in order to survive.

[Dark]

Would you rather hear the truth, or sugar-coated lies?

 

In no way am I saying God is a sugar-coated lie, but I want you to think about the question above and answer it in detail.

[¶nÇØGn¶TØ]

Would you rather hear the truth' date=' or sugar-coated lies?

 

In no way am I saying God is a sugar-coated lie, but I want you to think about the question above and answer it in detail.

[/quote']

 

 

 

I've got a better question to answer your question.

 

How will you know of what is the truth and what is a lie?

 

 

People before believed that the earth was flat. For hundreds of years they always thought the earth was flat. Back then that was the truth for them. Which only after a hundred of years proven to be a lie. How sure are you that the TRUTH you are going to say is not a lie tomorrow or after a hundred of years.

[~/Coolio Prime\~]

Hard-Headed Atheists + Religious Fanatics = Intelligent, Tolerant, Well Thought Out Discussions

 

 

Oh wait, I think I did my math wrong.