Agro Posted May 2, 2013 Report Share Posted May 2, 2013 Kayyyy so ima see how slow I can make this game while still having it be fun. Caveman Format New Rules: - You can only run 1 card of the same name in the Extra Deck - You can only run 2 cards of the same name in the Main Deck Forbidden/Limited List: Normal List Stays in Effect, except for the following changes: [spoiler='Forbidden'] Archlord Krystia Atlantean Dragoons Black Luster Soldier - Envoy of the Beginning Blackwing - Kalut the Moon Shadow Blaster, Elemental Dragon of Calderas Brotherhood of the Fire Fist - Chicken Bujin Relic - Habakiri Cannon Soldier Constellar Sombres Crane Crane Dandylion Dark Armed Dragon Elemental HERO Stratos Enthusiastic Beastman Wolfberk Evilswarm Kerykeion Evoltile Najasho Exodia the Forbidden One Gladiator Beast Equeste Gogogo Ghost Gorz the Emissary of Darkness Grandsoil the Elemental Lord Grapha, Dragon Lord of Dark World Hazy Flame Peryton High Priestess of Prophecy Honest Infernity Archfiend Infernity Mirage Inzektor Hornet Judgment Dragon Koa'ki Meiru Doom Lava Golem Machina Fortress Madolche Hootcake Master Hyperion Mermail Abysslinde Mermail Abyssmegalo Mezuki Morphing Jar Moulinglacia the Elemental Lord Naturia Bambooshoot Nimble Angler Ninja Grandmaster Hanzo Noble Knight Medraut Nurse Reficule the Fallen One Overdrive Teleporter Reaper of Prophecy Red-Eyes Darkness Metal Dragon Redox, Elemental Dragon of Crags Rescue Rabbit Sephylon the Ultimate Time Lord Spore Superancient Deepsea King Coelacanth Tempest, Elemental Dragon of Cyclones The World of Prophecy Thunder Seahorse Tidal, Elemental Dragon of Cascades Toon Cannon Soldier Tour Guide from the Underworld Treeborn Frog Volcanic Queen Wind-Up Magician Windrose the Elemental Lord Wulf, Lightsworn Beast XX-Saber Faultroll Demise King of Armageddon Evigishki Gustkraken Herald of Perfection Blaze Fenix, the Burning Bombardment Bird Chimeratech Fortress Dragon Elemental HERO Air Neos Evil HERO Dark Gaia Gladiator Beast Gyzarus Ancient Sacred Wyvern Dragunity Knight - Vajrayana Fabled Ragin Karakuri Shogun mdl 00 "Burei" Karakuri Steel Shogun mdl 00X "Bureido" Legendary Six Samurai - Shi En Naturia Barkion Naturia Beast Shooting Quasar Dragon T.G. Hyper Librarian Tempest Magician Vylon Sigma Bahamut Shark Blade Armor Ninja Brotherhood of the Fire Fist - Cardinal Constellar Ptolemy M7 Daigusto Emeral Daigusto Phoenix Evolzar Dolkka Evolzar Laggia Gaia Dragon, the Thunder Charger Gear Gigant X Heroic Champion - Excalibur Hieratic Dragon King of Atum Lavalval Chain M-X-Saber Invoker Madolche Queen Tiaramisu Number 11: Big Eye Number 16: Shock Master Number 33: Chronomaly Machu Mech Number 61: Volcasaurus Number 6: Chronomally Atlandis Superdreadnaught Rail Cannon Gustaph Max Allure of Darkness Black Whirlwind Burial from a Different Dimension Call of the Atleanteans Card Destruction Chain Strike Charge of the Light Brigade Divine Wind of Mist Valley Final Countdown Fire Formation - Tenki Gateway of the Six Gem-Knight Fusion Gishki Aquamirror Hysteric Sign Infernity Launcher Limiter Removal Machine Duplication Madolche Chateau Mind Control Monster Gate Monster Reborn Night Beam One Day of Peace Onslaught of the Fire Kings Pot of Avarice Reasoning Rekindling Royal Tribute Spellbook of Judgment Spellbook of Secrets The Grand Spellbook Tower Vylon Element Wave-Motion Cannon Wind-Up Factory Abyss-sphere Abyss-squall Bad Reaction to Simochi Ceasefire Chain Material Double-Edged Sword Technique Hysteric Party Imperial Iron Wall Return from the Different Dimension Royal Decree Secret Barrel Self-Destruct Button Starlight Road Ultimate Offering W Nebula Meteorite Wall of Revealing Light [/spoiler] [spoiler='Limited'] Blackwing - Vayu the Emblem of Honor Collapsarpent the Ebony Dragon Debris Dragon Deep Sea Diva Fire King High Avatar Garunix Geargiarmor Madolche Majileine Ronintoadin Tragoedia Watthopper Wyrburstar the Ivory Dragon Advanced Heraldry Art Miracle Fusion Mystical Space Typhoon' Rise of the Bujin Toon Table of Contents Bottomless Trap Hole Call of the Haunted Mirror Force Skill Drain Torrential Tribute [/spoiler] [spoiler='Unlimited (can be played @2)'] Blackwing - Gale the Whirlwind Book of Moon Gladiator Beast Bestiari Inzektor Dragonfly Left Arm of the Forbidden One Left Leg of the Forbidden One Neo-Spacien Grand Mole One for One Primal Seed Right Arm of the Forbidden One Right Leg of the Forbidden One Scapegoat T.G. Striker [/spoiler] If there's anything you think I missed, post the change along with your reasoning behind it. Besides a few exceptions, I tried to follow these rules when hitting cards: Forbidden: Problem cards; Cards that are too powerful; Cards that give unnecessary plusses without thought to use Limited: Cards that interact with themselves too well; Cards that are powerful, but while at 1, would take serious consideration before using Unlimited (@2): Cards that do not fit under the first two categories [spoiler='Here is a list of cards that I looked at, but did not put on the list'] A Wingbeat of Giant Dragon Abyss-scale of the Cestus Abyss-scale of the Kraken Abyss-scale of the Mizuchi Abyss-strom Alien Ammonite All-Out Attacks Asceticism of the Six Samurai Bait Doll Black Salvo Block Golem Brotherhood of the Fire Fist - Bear Brotherhood of the Fire Fist - Gorilla Brotherhood of the Fire Fist - Spirit Burning Knuckler - Counter-Blow Burning Knuckler - Switch-Hitter Cardcar D Compulsory Evacuation Device Creature Swap Cyber Eltanin Deck Devastation Virus Delta Crow - Anti Reverse Dimension Prison Dragon Ravine Eclipse Wyvern Emergency Teleport Evilswarm Bahamut Evilswarm Ophion Galaxy Expedition Gladiator Beast Darius Gravekeeper's Steele Harpie Channeler Hieratic Dragon of Tefnuit Inzektor Giga-Mantis/Inzektor Sword - Zektkaliber Meklord Emperor Wisel Meklord Emperor Granel Mermail Abyssteus Molten Conduction Field Necro Gardna Overload Fusion Phantom of Chaos Reckless Greed Recycling Batteries Scrap Chimera Shien's Smoke Signal Sky Scourge Norleras Spellbook of Fate Swords of Revealing Light System Down Temperance of Prophecy Wind-Up Arsenal Zenmaioh Wind-Up Rat Zombie Master [/spoiler] Needs testing, obviously. 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Zeppeli Gyro Supreme Posted May 3, 2013 Report Share Posted May 3, 2013 The following is what I personally had a problem with while reading through: Volcanic Queen - She's a severely neutered Lava Golem who usually doesn't last for long and can severely backfire (no pun intended). Hitting her just because she's burn seems ridiculous to me. Especially since Wave Motion Cannon is left untouched. Hieratic Dragon King of Atum - Without Darkness Metal or Thunder Charger, what would you really use this for? I might be forgetting some kind of FTK/OTK you can do with it, but otherwise I have to say it's useful, but not "great". -------------------------- Debris Dragon - You can still make Black Rose Dragon, Trident Dragion, Starform Dragon, etc etc with this, and it's more searchable with 2 Sangan. Deep Sea Diva - Even with the two main problems, Daigusto Phoenix and Abyssmegalo, are gone, it still can help deal a whole ton of damage thanks to Marksman. Plus it's a free level 5 synchro inherently. Advanced Heraldry Art - I guess this isn't too horrible considering the dedication you have to have, but Heraldry Reborn is still in the deck too. Miracle Fusion - You can't abuse it as much, but Shining is still a thing, and if nothing else, Ab0. They can easily convert to the Fusion Gate/Parallel World Fusion version of the deck if they have to. Rise of the Bujin - Same as Heraldry Art's sort of reasoning, with different cards. ---------- Inzektor Dragonfly - You can still make +X rank 3's, 4's, and 5's without hornet, and there's still lots of potential for abuse without super accessible OTKs. Other than that, I pretty much agree with everything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agro Posted May 3, 2013 Author Report Share Posted May 3, 2013 The following is what I personally had a problem with while reading through: Volcanic Queen - She's a severely neutered Lava Golem who usually doesn't last for long and can severely backfire (no pun intended). Hitting her just because she's burn seems ridiculous to me. Especially since Wave Motion Cannon is left untouched. It's being hit for the same reasons as Lava Golem. That won't change. Hieratic Dragon King of Atum - Without Darkness Metal or Thunder Charger, what would you really use this for? I might be forgetting some kind of FTK/OTK you can do with it, but otherwise I have to say it's useful, but not "great". Summon any dragon from the deck in a +1. Atum was never balanced without REDMD and thunder charger and Hieratics can still easily make it. -------------------------- Debris Dragon - You can still make Black Rose Dragon, Trident Dragion, Starform Dragon, etc etc with this, and it's more searchable with 2 Sangan. Aaaaand, then I realized Sangan is @2. Now it's at 0! Impressive. Deep Sea Diva - Even with the two main problems, Daigusto Phoenix and Abyssmegalo, are gone, it still can help deal a whole ton of damage thanks to Marksman. Plus it's a free level 5 synchro inherently. I may ban it as well. I'll wait to hear if anyone argues against it. Advanced Heraldry Art - I guess this isn't too horrible considering the dedication you have to have, but Heraldry Reborn is still in the deck too. Miracle Fusion - You can't abuse it as much, but Shining is still a thing, and if nothing else, Ab0. They can easily convert to the Fusion Gate/Parallel World Fusion version of the deck if they have to. And you only have 1. They're literally power cards in their respective decks and as such you don't want to waste it, especially since you only get one of each Fusion/Xyz. Rise of the Bujin - Same as Heraldry Art's sort of reasoning, with different cards.Same as Heraldry Art's explanation, with different cards. ---------- Inzektor Dragonfly - You can still make +X rank 3's, 4's, and 5's without hornet, and there's still lots of potential for abuse without super accessible OTKs. It's still a much slower "loop" and you can't do all the bullshit with Excaliber and Giga-Mantis anymore since Hornet is banned. "super accessible OTKs" is an overstatement. That being said, if others think the Xyz toolbox should be hit, then I'll move it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeppeli Gyro Supreme Posted May 3, 2013 Report Share Posted May 3, 2013 Your points in order: I still don't think it's nearly as effective as Lava Golem, and don't believe anyone would ever play it for the purpose of burn, especially with all fo the other burn cards that took a hit. Wave Motion Cannon should take a hit before it, in my opinion, considering that decks can actually be effectively built around. (Clockblock) Atum was really on the fence for me, though it's actually a +0 card considering it's 2 to make 1 (they always end up using 2 cards to make it) and then get another one, at which point neither of those cards is able to actually do anything. I think it could stay where it's at, really, but like I said, I'm personally on the fence. The Heraldry cards and such I guess are okay until it's been tested. Like I said, I wasn't even sure if it was worth bringing up. As for Dragonfly, what I was talking about was the days of 3 Fly, 3 Centipede, and 3 Hornet, how they could easily pull OTKS out of the butt. In this case, they just lose out on Hornet (and of course they can't pull as consistently). They can also go the Heart of Clear Water route to accomplish the deck's goals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agro Posted May 3, 2013 Author Report Share Posted May 3, 2013 Your points in order: I still don't think it's nearly as effective as Lava Golem, and don't believe anyone would ever play it for the purpose of burn, especially with all fo the other burn cards that took a hit. Wave Motion Cannon should take a hit before it, in my opinion, considering that decks can actually be effectively built around. (Clockblock) Then I'll hit both. Problem solved! As for Dragonfly, what I was talking about was the days of 3 Fly, 3 Centipede, and 3 Hornet, how they could easily pull OTKS out of the butt. In this case, they just lose out on Hornet (and of course they can't pull as consistently). They can also go the Heart of Clear Water route to accomplish the deck's goals. The difference there was that there was 3 Hornet alongside them. Now, it's 2 Dragonfly and 2 Centipede. Now they're basically just Dragunities for Xyz. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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