Dark Posted November 26, 2008 Report Share Posted November 26, 2008 I was in History class today, and a random discussion emerged. Some idiot in my class said that utopias were possible, we just had to stop money. Stop making money, stop selling, stop buying, etc. Stop doing everything that includes those little green things you love so much. This has nothing to do with what I am about to say. I said that utopias could not exsist unless everyone was dead. If people are still alive, they could still be mad, be cranky, be mean. If everyone and everything was dead, how would anyone be mean? Making, a utopia. Please discuss, as I would like to hear your thoughts on my statement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D-Striker Posted November 26, 2008 Report Share Posted November 26, 2008 You had school today??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Posted November 26, 2008 Author Report Share Posted November 26, 2008 Yeah, why? Thanksgiving isn't until tomorrow. So, they dragged us to school, like the idiots they are. But that is not relevant to what I am asking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bury the year Posted November 26, 2008 Report Share Posted November 26, 2008 Utopia is a societal thing; if you kill off everyone, society cannot exist, and, therefore, neither can a utopia. [/topic] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ragnarok1945 Posted November 26, 2008 Report Share Posted November 26, 2008 and it's not like you can get everyone to agree with your POV either, so a utopia isn't possible because of the different opinions. You'll never get a society that is not corruptible Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Posted November 26, 2008 Author Report Share Posted November 26, 2008 Utopia is a societal thing; if you kill off everyone' date=' society cannot exist, and, therefore, neither can a utopia. [/topic'] In my eyes, you do not need a life form to contain a utopia. I think of a utopia as a place of peace and serenity. and it's not like you can get everyone to agree with your POV either' date=' so a utopia isn't possible because of the different opinions. You'll never get a society that is not corruptible[/quote'] Unless everyone was dead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abstract [Atrocity] Posted November 26, 2008 Report Share Posted November 26, 2008 yeah, taking $ out of the equation is step 1so meaningless in the long run, but it controls the world.Also, we'd have to stop violence, find a natural source of energy, stop natural disasters...nah, not gonna happen :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ragnarok1945 Posted November 26, 2008 Report Share Posted November 26, 2008 ' pid='1398726' dateline='1227731881']Utopia is a societal thing; if you kill off everyone' date=' society cannot exist, and, therefore, neither can a utopia. [/topic'] In my eyes, you do not need a life form to contain a utopia. I think of a utopia as a place of peace and serenity. and it's not like you can get everyone to agree with your POV either' date=' so a utopia isn't possible because of the different opinions. You'll never get a society that is not corruptible[/quote'] Unless everyone was dead. What kind of utopia have you see where it's comprised of only one person? Tectonix is right. You need a population for it to be even theoretically possible, not just kill everyone so there's no one left to oppose your opinion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Posted November 26, 2008 Author Report Share Posted November 26, 2008 ' pid='1398729' dateline='1227731908']yeah' date=' taking $ out of the equation is step 1so meaningless in the long run, but it controls the world.Also, we'd have to stop violence, find a natural source of energy, stop natural disasters...nah, not gonna happen :P[/quote'] But, if we kill everyone, who will be violent, who will get killed by disasters? ' pid='1398726' dateline='1227731881']Utopia is a societal thing; if you kill off everyone' date=' society cannot exist, and, therefore, neither can a utopia. [/topic'] In my eyes, you do not need a life form to contain a utopia. I think of a utopia as a place of peace and serenity. and it's not like you can get everyone to agree with your POV either' date=' so a utopia isn't possible because of the different opinions. You'll never get a society that is not corruptible[/quote'] Unless everyone was dead. What kind of utopia have you see where it's comprised of only one person? Tectonix is right. You need a population for it to be even theoretically possible, not just kill everyone so there's no one left to oppose your opinion If there is no one left to oppose your opinion, that IS a utopia. If there are other people, people will oppose your POV. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ragnarok1945 Posted November 26, 2008 Report Share Posted November 26, 2008 a utopia is supposed to have people to interact with Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Posted November 26, 2008 Author Report Share Posted November 26, 2008 A utopia is a place of complete peace and solitude. Who said that a utopia has to have citizens? And a utopia can be comprised of 1 citizen, as long as they are not bi-polar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Felix Posted November 26, 2008 Report Share Posted November 26, 2008 All that "No emotions" thing would sort us out, it would be a rubbish and boring utopia but a utopia nonetheless. I mean with no emotions "boring" wouldn't exist either. If there's no money then we'll just fight over land space. So getting rid of the money is a waist of time. With money we are allot more structured than we would be without it. It's what keeps the world ticking and stops countries obtaining free nuclear devices and blowing the $h!t out of everyone. (So basically Dark, your classmate is an idiot):D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ragnarok1945 Posted November 26, 2008 Report Share Posted November 26, 2008 then can you name some utopias with 1 person in them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Posted November 26, 2008 Author Report Share Posted November 26, 2008 Yes, he is an idiot. Getting rid of money would not be the answer, as people would fight over what is who's. If everyone was nice, a utopia could be possible. But that is a 0% chance of happening. ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enrise Posted November 26, 2008 Report Share Posted November 26, 2008 You could always have a Necroutopia. A Utopia of Dead People, therefore, people won't kill each other because they are already dead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Posted November 26, 2008 Author Report Share Posted November 26, 2008 OK, that works. If no one was living, no one could die, is the main point of my statement. If no one could die, and no one could fight, it is a utopia. We could NEVER have a utopia with more than 1 person. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enrise Posted November 26, 2008 Report Share Posted November 26, 2008 ' pid='1398803' dateline='1227733110']OK' date=' that works. If no one was living, no one could die, is the main point of my statement. If no one could die, and no one could fight, it is a utopia. We could NEVER have a utopia with more than 1 person.[/quote'] Unless they are an Undead or are Immortal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ragnarok1945 Posted November 26, 2008 Report Share Posted November 26, 2008 You go too long without anyone you'd end up going insane and killing yourself. Think I Am Legend (although that's a little different, but has some parallels) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Posted November 26, 2008 Author Report Share Posted November 26, 2008 Ok, good point. You would go crazy, and die. It would still be a utopia. Since everyone would be dead, no one could fight. And what would you have to worry about if you are the only one left? No animals, humans, anything. You can steal things, get whatever you want, etc.Ok, good point. You would go crazy, and die. It would still be a utopia. Since everyone would be dead, no one could fight. And what would you have to worry about if you are the only one left? No animals, humans, anything. You can steal things, get whatever you want, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ragnarok1945 Posted November 26, 2008 Report Share Posted November 26, 2008 You have a point there as well. Still, if you kept getting what you wanted wouldn't your happiness fade in time? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Felix Posted November 26, 2008 Report Share Posted November 26, 2008 Technically you’re not actually stealing. Stealing means taking something from someone else’s possession without his or her permission so with no one else there you can't steal; your just moving furniture. Plus you'd eventually run out of food (unless you were a good cook and liked vegetables). No it isn't a Utopia, a Utopia is defined as "an ideal way of life". If no one is alive you contradict the life part of its definition. Also being completely alone is not an ideal way to live. So as much as you feel like arguing you don't have an argument to make. You could spring another word on us if you wanted but Utopia wont work anymore. I believe I just played the trump card! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ragnarok1945 Posted November 26, 2008 Report Share Posted November 26, 2008 yeah well some people's ideal way of life is to do whatever you want, and that's why there was a suggestion for no one else around you. Still, you're right. It has to stay ideal for it to work, and as shown in the I Am Legend movie, you'd go insane and commit suicide if there's too much loneliness. Interaction with others is a basic human need, you know Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sander Posted November 26, 2008 Report Share Posted November 26, 2008 Utopias are impossible, peace cannot be maintained forever, there will always be people who...well, you get where I'm aiming for. And in utopia, all people are treated as equal, right? If so, that's another reason why utopias cannot exist, as much as we wish, there will be people who have more rights, berks, money etc. etc. than other people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ragnarok1945 Posted November 26, 2008 Report Share Posted November 26, 2008 yeah, and if everyone wants equality you're just going to get further conflicts, and this will continue to escalate until the utopia inevitably collapses (assuming it's possible to actually make one in the first place) Besides, the very people who created the utopia will already have more power than others they invite, that alone disproves the equality principle in a utopia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Posted November 26, 2008 Author Report Share Posted November 26, 2008 IF EVERYONE WAS DEAD... all dead people would be treated equal. It would be an ideal way of life. So, utopias CAN exsists if peoplez are dead. :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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