Illegal Immigration

[Dark]

We cannot possibly argue that illegal immigrants are a GOOD thing. The issue I have with many conservative points of view regarding immigration is simply the lack of humanity they display on the issue. That' date=' and the importance they give it..

[/quote']

 

Uhh... well, I could attempt to argue that but fail hard. They aren't good, but it's not a necessarily bad thing to have a couple (thousand) of 'em.

[archie17]

I blame the Mexican government for not providing their citizens enough resources so they wouldn't have to illegally cross the border for a better life.

[The Dark One]

I blame the Mexican government for not providing their citizens enough resources so they wouldn't have to illegally cross the border for a better life.

 

I agree. Mexico has one of the most corrupt governments in the world.

 

Issue is, it's not just the government. The corruption extends everywhere, and Mexico is just a poor country to begin with.

 

We make such a big deal of immigration, it seems to me that if we had tried to fix up Mexico instead of Iraq, everyone would be a whole lot happier.

[Frlf]

Well, instead of picking a side based on my opinion... I'll just pick a side based on the facts. Illegal immigrants actually cause a more positive effect on the economy than negative. They have almost no effect at all when it comes to the job market because the only people that are actually competing with illegal immigrants are high school drop-outs. In my opinion, kicking one person out of the country because he/she is Mexican and not American is discrimination. Also, based on Arizona, violent crime rates do not increase with an influx of illegal immigrants. In fact, statistically speaking, the violent crime rate of Arizona decreased in the 2000s, while crimes like robberies involving less than 100 dollars increased slightly. Illegal immigrants also stimulate the economy and contribute to the job market.

 

So, really, anyone who is against illegal immigration is either: A. A racist or B. An overly patriotic moron.

[Frlf]

Well, instead of picking a side based on my opinion... I'll just pick a side based on the facts. Illegal immigrants actually cause a more positive effect on the economy than negative. They have almost no effect at all when it comes to the job market because the only people that are actually competing with illegal immigrants are high school drop-outs. In my opinion, kicking one person out of the country because he/she is Mexican and not American is discrimination. Also, based on Arizona, violent crime rates do not increase with an influx of illegal immigrants. In fact, statistically speaking, the violent crime rate of Arizona decreased in the 2000s, while crimes like robberies involving less than 100 dollars increased slightly. Illegal immigrants also stimulate the economy and contribute to the job market.

 

So, really, anyone who is against illegal immigration is either: A. A racist or B. An overly patriotic moron.

[Frlf]

Well, instead of picking a side based on my opinion... I'll just pick a side based on the facts. Illegal immigrants actually cause a more positive effect on the economy than negative. They have almost no effect at all when it comes to the job market because the only people that are actually competing with illegal immigrants are high school drop-outs. In my opinion, kicking one person out of the country because he/she is Mexican and not American is discrimination. Also, based on Arizona, violent crime rates do not increase with an influx of illegal immigrants. In fact, statistically speaking, the violent crime rate of Arizona decreased in the 2000s, while crimes like robberies involving less than 100 dollars increased slightly. Illegal immigrants also stimulate the economy and contribute to the job market.

 

So, really, anyone who is against illegal immigration is either: A. A racist or B. An overly patriotic moron.

[Dr. Cakey]

In my opinion' date=' kicking one person out of the country because he/she is Mexican and not American is discrimination.

[/quote']

 

But legally it is not, since those laws only apply to American citizens.

 

I laugh at the non-logic of saying that spending more would save the economy.

 

I hope you're still here for this quick lesson. The economy depends on constant growth. For example, the definition of a "recession" is two consective months (or was it quarters? Crap.) of not growing. An economy/business that is not growing is failing. The country's economy has nothing to do with people, just businesses. People spending money allows businesses to grow/recover, allowing them to re-hire people, allowing those people to spend money, allowing businesses to grow/recover, allowing them to hire people, allowing - make sense? If spending decreases, businesses lose money, causing them to streamline by laying off workers, decreasing the number of people who spend, causin businesses to lose money, causing them to lay off workers, causing - A beautiful thing, isn't it? No? I agree.

[Dark]

But legally it is not, since those laws only apply to American citizens.

 

Didn't he mean legal Mexicans? 'Cause, y'know, those damn Arizona laws kind of discriminate against Hispanics and Mexicans regardless of whether they are legal or not.

 

My stance stays that illegal immigrants are needed, but there should be a cap on how many are allowed to reside here. Because if they aren't legal, they technically shouldn't be here.

[JadenxAtemYAOI]

they're not citizens and they don't have green cards. Put em into slavery as punishment

[Frlf]

they're not citizens and they don't have green cards. Put em into slavery as punishment

 

You're, and I'm being very lenient with this mild insult, a moron.

[The Dark One]

But legally it is not' date=' since those laws only apply to American citizens.[/i']

 

Didn't he mean legal Mexicans? 'Cause, y'know, those damn Arizona laws kind of discriminate against Hispanics and Mexicans regardless of whether they are legal or not.

 

My stance stays that illegal immigrants are needed, but there should be a cap on how many are allowed to reside here. Because if they aren't legal, they technically shouldn't be here.

 

That doesn't even make sense. We allow a certain number of nonallowed immigrants into the country?

 

Yeah, immigrants don't really hurt the workforce or the economy like some people claim, but they still are obviously not a good thing. I'm against the extreme legislation that some people propose against them, but they should never be sanctioned.

 

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Also, at the dumbass who said that the laws only apply to Americans: What laws? Because that has actually been an issue of discussion before, but never has it been said that the constitutional rights are only applied to citizens. The constitution is not just a guideline for the fair treatment of American citizens, it is a guideline for the fair treatment of people.

[Dark]

That doesn't even make sense. We allow a certain number of nonallowed immigrants into the country?

 

What I'm saying is that illegal immigrants obviously fill up the jobs that other Americans don't want to do (for some reason). We obviously need (not being racist or stereotypical) garbage cleaners and those people, and if Americans won't do those jobs, someone has to.

 

If we allow just enough illegals to fill those jobs, that's my plan. That way we fill those jobs for our own self-benefit, and we are allowing a certain amount of people to live here. If we let every Mexican or Latino that wants to come here, we'll have an influx of illegals and will be overpopulated like hell.

 

Surely my idea is flawed, but it could be something to work off of.

[The Dark One]

That doesn't even make sense. We allow a certain number of nonallowed immigrants into the country?

 

What I'm saying is that illegal immigrants obviously fill up the jobs that other Americans don't want to do (for some reason). We obviously need (not being racist or stereotypical) garbage cleaners and those people' date=' and if Americans won't do those jobs, someone [i']has[/i] to.

 

If we allow just enough illegals to fill those jobs, that's my plan. That way we fill those jobs for our own self-benefit, and we are allowing a certain amount of people to live here. If we let every Mexican or Latino that wants to come here, we'll have an influx of illegals and will be overpopulated like hell.

 

Surely my idea is flawed, but it could be something to work off of.

 

Except then they're no longer illegal.

 

So in other words you're saying that we should simply increase the number of Mexicans we allow into the country by normal processes yearly.

[Dark]

We don't have to outright give them legal status. They can remain illegal but we can still employ them, and the government can seem to be the stupid, oblivious government they've always been regarding this issue. :/

[Красивая Ведьма]

I support Illegal Immigration Laws as should everyone. They unlike real Americans do not pay taxes and are sponging of our country or rather any other country they go to. So, just get used to me saying the U.S.A. okay? Okay. If they do not pay taxes and send their money off to their home country as so many do, then this is slowly weakening the country’s economy. There are more reasons than just this one as well.

 

Secondly, illegal immigrates coming into this country in such a way as their title suggests makes it more difficult for people to seek political asylum. Thousands are sent back to their country to die while some criminal is mowing a lawn. It is because of so much illegal immigration that these laws become more needed and legal immigration becomes more difficult.

 

I resent the idea that they do "the jobs that Americans don't want" because it is a lie. These are the jobs that students did and to a lesser extent still do to pay for their education. Maybe if these criminals, which are what they are, stopped taking so many jobs there would be a shorter line at the unemployment office. Even if it is only a slight change it is one of many that need to be done.

[Frlf]

I support Illegal Immigration Laws as should everyone. They unlike real Americans do not pay taxes and are sponging of our country or rather any other country they go to. So' date=' just get used to me saying the U.S.A. okay? Okay. If they do not pay taxes and send their money off to their home country as so many do, then this is slowly weakening the country’s economy. There are more reasons than just this one as well.

 

[b']Actually, they do not bring down the economy at any rate. They actually stimulate it slightly by spending their money they don't spend on taxes (assuming they don't pay taxes, when most of them actually DO) on food and other necessities. And, by spending their money, they help keep jobs that they're not qualified enough to take stay available.[/b]

 

Secondly, illegal immigrates coming into this country in such a way as their title suggests makes it more difficult for people to seek political asylum. Thousands are sent back to their country to die while some criminal is mowing a lawn. It is because of so much illegal immigration that these laws become more needed and legal immigration becomes more difficult.

 

Legal immigration is already difficult, or else they'd be coming here legally.

 

I resent the idea that they do "the jobs that Americans don't want" because it is a lie. These are the jobs that students did and to a lesser extent still do to pay for their education. Maybe if these criminals, which are what they are, stopped taking so many jobs there would be a shorter line at the unemployment office. Even if it is only a slight change it is one of many that need to be done.

 

A job on a construction site isn't going to pay for a decent education. And, on average, the only people who are underqualified enough to take a job that illegal immigrants take are people who dropped out of High School. It comes down to kicking this person out of the country because they're Mexican and not American.

 

 

 

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=5312900

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0BUE/is_1_141/ai_n28073127/

http://www.ilw.com/articles/2010,0707-roach.shtm

[Красивая Ведьма]

 

Actually' date=' they do not bring down the economy at any rate. They actually stimulate it slightly by spending their money they don't spend on taxes (assuming they don't pay taxes, when most of them actually DO) on food and other necessities. And, by spending their money, they help keep jobs that they're not qualified enough to take stay available.[/b']

 

Legal immigration is already difficult, or else they'd be coming here legally.

 

A job on a construction site isn't going to pay for a decent education. And, on average, the only people who are underqualified enough to take a job that illegal immigrants take are people who dropped out of High School. It comes down to kicking this person out of the country because they're Mexican and not American.

 

Okay, I'll take this one at a time. Yes, many who come to live here do stimulate the economy slightly and the money they spend in the free market does the same. The issue comes in when they send money back home and they do pay SOME taxes, but do not declare yearly taxes because if they did they would be found out as aliens.

 

Yes, it IS difficult, but this is because of the past. Illegal immigration caused the modern day difficulty in it, and the more illegal immigration that occurs the more laws and barriers are created. There was a time when immigration to this country was very easy, but with time by these immigrates it became what it is.

 

The adjective "decent" is up to opinion. Any further education is better than nothing even if it is only a community college. This country was built on people pulling themselves out of there situation and "making it."

 

If they come to the U.S.A. legally then there is no problem. Mexicans aren't the only ones who do this. People from many countries still come here.

[The Dark One]

 

Actually' date=' they do not bring down the economy at any rate. They actually stimulate it slightly by spending their money they don't spend on taxes (assuming they don't pay taxes, when most of them actually DO) on food and other necessities. And, by spending their money, they help keep jobs that they're not qualified enough to take stay available.[/b']

 

Legal immigration is already difficult, or else they'd be coming here legally.

 

A job on a construction site isn't going to pay for a decent education. And, on average, the only people who are underqualified enough to take a job that illegal immigrants take are people who dropped out of High School. It comes down to kicking this person out of the country because they're Mexican and not American.

 

Okay, I'll take this one at a time. Yes, many who come to live here do stimulate the economy slightly and the money they spend in the free market does the same. The issue comes in when they send money back home and they do pay SOME taxes, but do not declare yearly taxes because if they did they would be found out as aliens.

 

Yes, it IS difficult, but this is because of the past. Illegal immigration caused the modern day difficulty in it, and the more illegal immigration that occurs the more laws and barriers are created. There was a time when immigration to this country was very easy, but with time by these immigrates it became what it is.

 

The adjective "decent" is up to opinion. Any further education is better than nothing even if it is only a community college. This country was built on people pulling themselves out of there situation and "making it."

 

If they come to the U.S.A. legally then there is no problem. Mexicans aren't the only ones who do this. People from many countries still come here.

 

Obviously illegal immigration is not ok. If we think our economy can support, or even be benefitted by a greater number of Mexican immigrants than are presently allowed through legal processes, than we should simply increase the quotas.

 

The issue of contention isn't whether or not illegal immigration is a GOOD thing, but:

 

A. How important of an issue it is: Meaning does it warrant further legislation to better secure our borders, and the subsequent tax dollars it would cost us (likely greater than any possible strain the immigrants would actually place on the economy)

 

B. Is it moral to actually DEPORT aliens within the country

 

C. Regardless of our policy regarding deportation, how invasively is it moral or constitutional for us to search for immigrants within the country.

 

For example, the new law in Arizona is far too invasive and clearly unconstitutional.

[Frlf]

 

Actually' date=' they do not bring down the economy at any rate. They actually stimulate it slightly by spending their money they don't spend on taxes (assuming they don't pay taxes, when most of them actually DO) on food and other necessities. And, by spending their money, they help keep jobs that they're not qualified enough to take stay available.[/b']

 

Legal immigration is already difficult, or else they'd be coming here legally.

 

A job on a construction site isn't going to pay for a decent education. And, on average, the only people who are underqualified enough to take a job that illegal immigrants take are people who dropped out of High School. It comes down to kicking this person out of the country because they're Mexican and not American.

 

Okay, I'll take this one at a time. Yes, many who come to live here do stimulate the economy slightly and the money they spend in the free market does the same. The issue comes in when they send money back home and they do pay SOME taxes, but do not declare yearly taxes because if they did they would be found out as aliens.

 

This is a totally hypothetical stance. Statistically speaking, they don't have enough of an effect for it to really matter as far as the US Economy goes. Yes, some Illegal Immigrants DO send money back to Mexico, but this is usually so that their families can afford to live. So regardless of whether or not they're illegal, they'd still do this.

 

Yes, it IS difficult, but this is because of the past. Illegal immigration caused the modern day difficulty in it, and the more illegal immigration that occurs the more laws and barriers are created. There was a time when immigration to this country was very easy, but with time by these immigrates it became what it is.

 

Had it been easy, people wouldn't have immigrated illegally...

 

The adjective "decent" is up to opinion. Any further education is better than nothing even if it is only a community college. This country was built on people pulling themselves out of there situation and "making it."

 

This country was built on exploiting people with less money to help keep the rich payed. And if you're a high school graduate, you're probably going to be aiming for jobs a little more prestigious than the ones illegal immigrants take. And if you're NOT a high school graduate, you're probably not going to college.

 

If they come to the U.S.A. legally then there is no problem. Mexicans aren't the only ones who do this. People from many countries still come here.

 

If they come into the U.S.A. legally, they still present all of the problems you suggest deporting them for.

[Tentacruel]

Can't we just legalize em all? <_< Yes, there will be no jobs left, but when there are no jobs, the immigrants will stop coming.