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Arcana Force

Blake

By Blake
in Yu-Gi-Oh! TCG/OCG Card Discussion

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evilfusion Newbie

evilfusion

Posted
Posted

Arcana Force have ZERO synergy. None, zip, nothing. They rely on luck, have little to no support, their effects are weak or detrimental, and they have no synergy with themselves. They cannot be teched into other decks (the Fool can for stall decks) because their effects dont DO anything, even if you get the right flip.

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DARKPLANT RISING Newbie

DARKPLANT RISING

Posted
Posted

They needed stuff like this:

Arcana Force Troll
Level 4
1900
Heads-Select 1 "Arcana Force" monster in your deck and add it to your hand.
Tails-Select 1 "Arcana Force" monster in your deck and mill it.

Arcana Force Derplord
Level 4
1900
Heads-Once per turn, you can destroy 1 face-up monster
Tails-Once per turn, you can destroy 1 face-down S/T

Arcana Force Raging Earth
Level 8
3000
Summon by Banishing 2 Arcana Forces from the Graveyard. Once per turn, you can Banish 1 card on the field.

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The Warden Enthusiast

The Warden

Posted
Posted

If no one else is going to say it.

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N-rSt1PXUDA&feature=player_detailpage[/media]

The Arcana Force suffer from having their much better support being anime only. The best example would be this: [url="http://yugioh.wikia.com/wiki/Magician%27s_Scales"]http://yugioh.wikia....cian%27s_Scales[/url]

If they had this, at least you can get more use out of AF that end up in the Reversed position.

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evilfusion Newbie

evilfusion

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[quote name='Cyborg360' timestamp='1316709288' post='5532818']
If most of their cards weren't anime-only, they would be good.

Still, to who says they relie on luck:
Second Toin Coss/Light Barrier
[/quote]

...no.

Order of the Emperor maybe, for draw power, and Light Barrier's okay.

The biggest problem is their effects aren't good, even if you do get the right effect. Only Light and Dark Ruler, and maybe the World, have decent effects.

The Fool will almost always be Set, so its effect is irrelevent.

The Magician can be a 2200 for the turn if a Spell is played. Not worth it. But if you're wrong, every Spell heals the opponent by 500. Also not worth it.

The Empress actually is pretty decent, in you can either SS any Arcana Force from your hand when your opponent Normal Summons or Sets, but if you're wrong, you'll discard a card when they do that. Too risky.

The Emperor is either ATK increase or ATK decrease. Risky, not enough of a boost to use.

The Lovers either counts as 2 Tributes, or you cannot Tribute Summon Arcanas at all. This would be much better if the Arcana Force EX were Tribute Summoned. The Moon and the World are the only things that can use this.

The Chariot is either a monster stealer or switches to the opponent. It's bad.

Temperance is a Level 6 LIGHT Kuriboh. And if you actually Summon it, it can halve Battle Damage to you, or to your opponent. Too risky for the benefit.

The Moon is either a Token producer, or you're forced to give your opponent a monster at the end of your Turn.

The World is...actually quite good, due to the World Lock. But its downside effect lets your opponent recycle their Graveyard cards.

The EX are good, with 4000 ATK, but they require 3 monsters to be "sent to the Graveyard", so no Tokens. Light Ruler can either replenish Graveyard cards when it kills a monster, or loses 1000 ATK and negates a targeting effect on it.

Dark Ruler can either ATK twice, or nuke the field when it's destroyed.

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Cyborg360 Newbie

Cyborg360

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Posted

[quote name='evilfusion' timestamp='1316716745' post='5532994']

...no.

Order of the Emperor maybe, for draw power, and Light Barrier's okay.

The biggest problem is their effects aren't good, even if you do get the right effect. Only Light and Dark Ruler, and maybe the World, have decent effects.

The Fool will almost always be Set, so its effect is irrelevent.

The Magician can be a 2200 for the turn if a Spell is played. Not worth it. But if you're wrong, every Spell heals the opponent by 500. Also not worth it.

The Empress actually is pretty decent, in you can either SS any Arcana Force from your hand when your opponent Normal Summons or Sets, but if you're wrong, you'll discard a card when they do that. Too risky.

The Emperor is either ATK increase or ATK decrease. Risky, not enough of a boost to use.

The Lovers either counts as 2 Tributes, or you cannot Tribute Summon Arcanas at all. This would be much better if the Arcana Force EX were Tribute Summoned. The Moon and the World are the only things that can use this.

The Chariot is either a monster stealer or switches to the opponent. It's bad.

Temperance is a Level 6 LIGHT Kuriboh. And if you actually Summon it, it can halve Battle Damage to you, or to your opponent. Too risky for the benefit.

The Moon is either a Token producer, or you're forced to give your opponent a monster at the end of your Turn.

The World is...actually quite good, due to the World Lock. But its downside effect lets your opponent recycle their Graveyard cards.

The EX are good, with 4000 ATK, but they require 3 monsters to be "sent to the Graveyard", so no Tokens. Light Ruler can either replenish Graveyard cards when it kills a monster, or loses 1000 ATK and negates a targeting effect on it.

Dark Ruler can either ATK twice, or nuke the field when it's destroyed.
[/quote]

Right, but still they're not so bad! I've seen worse. I said they could be good, not exellent.
Look at this Anime-only card:
http://yugioh.wikia.com/wiki/Arcana_Force_XII_-_The_Hanged_Man
Good, right? At least if you get his good eff with Second Toin Coss. Just because Arcana's can have downsides, doesn't mean you can't get over them.
But I see what you mean. Just another never used archetype.

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.Rai Newbie

.Rai

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Posted

[quote name='Cyborg360' timestamp='1316717574' post='5533020']
http://yugioh.wikia.com/wiki/Arcana_Force_XII_-_The_Hanged_Man
Good, right? At least if you get his good eff with Second Toin Coss. Just because Arcana's can have downsides, doesn't mean you can't get over them.
But I see what you mean. Just another never used archetype.
[/quote]

The Hanged Man is actually not too good. And your first point of Second Coin Toss proves it. It relies too heavily on luck. Luck shouldn't be the main factor of your game. Arcana Force can't be played well, no matter how skilled the player, because 90% of it is all due to luck.

The Hanged Man is a bad alternative to Volcasaurus or other great removal like BLS, or Ryko.

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Mugendramon Newbie

Mugendramon

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Posted

[quote name='evilfusion' timestamp='1316716745' post='5532994']
The Empress actually is pretty decent, in you can either SS any Arcana Force from your hand when your opponent Normal Summons or Sets, but if you're wrong, you'll discard a card when they do that. Too risky.
[/quote]


Effect Discard. I smell bad hybrid Decktype.

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Cyborg360 Newbie

Cyborg360

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Posted

[quote name='Cursed Reaction' timestamp='1316717703' post='5533024']
The Hanged Man is actually not too good. And your first point of Second Coin Toss proves it. It relies too heavily on luck. Luck shouldn't be the main factor of your game. Arcana Force can't be played well, no matter how skilled the player, because 90% of it is all due to luck.

The Hanged Man is a bad alternative to Volcasaurus or other great removal like BLS, or Ryko.
[/quote]

So it relies on luck. Its crappy because of that! Good one. Yugioh relies on luck.
And that card is in no way like Volca or BLS
It can use its high burn eff and still attack! It is a BLS that doesn't banish and Volca that can attack directly, even if it uses its effect!

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evilfusion Newbie

evilfusion

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There's a difference between the game itself being luck based (it IS a card game, after all) and unnecessarily bogging down your duel with luck cards. Generally speaking, if a card has a 50% chance or lower of success, it is a bad card and should not be used, unless the effect is beneficial regardless of the result. Cup of Ace should never be used as draw power, but if you use Appropriate, it's...acceptable to run.

Snipe Hunter has a 66% chance of success, and this luck factor actually helps the card because Stardust can't respond to an effect that might not destroy anything. Plus, it works with Fableds, so Snipe Hunter is a good luck card, but one of the few.

Other luck cards are bad, because in addition to the luck aspect by the very nature of a TCG, it ruins and prevents consistency. Morphtronics, notably Celfon, are incredible with the right luck, but the gambling nature of Celfon reduces their consistency, and that is why the deck rarely performs well. It CAN perform well, but it can't do so with the same iron consistency that most other decks have.

Also, luck cards tend to be either "something good happens, or nothing happens". Arcana Force have the concept of "something good happens, or something BAD happens", making instances of bad luck come back to bite you even harder. For example, the Empress will make you LOSE card advantage for its secondary effect, and the Moon will force you to relinquish your monsters, giving you an overall -2 in field advantage.

These types of risks are unacceptable in any good deck, and this is worsened by the fact Arcana Force DO NOT have good beneficial effects in the first place. The EX ones are the only ones whose effects aren't unacceptably negative.

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Expelsword Newbie

Expelsword

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[quote name='evilfusion' timestamp='1316723141' post='5533201']
There's a difference between the game itself being luck based (it IS a card game, after all) and unnecessarily bogging down your duel with luck cards. Generally speaking, if a card has a 50% chance or lower of success, it is a bad card and should not be used, unless the effect is beneficial regardless of the result. Cup of Ace should never be used as draw power, but if you use Appropriate, it's...acceptable to run.

Snipe Hunter has a 66% chance of success, and this luck factor actually helps the card because Stardust can't respond to an effect that might not destroy anything. Plus, it works with Fableds, so Snipe Hunter is a good luck card, but one of the few.

Other luck cards are bad, because in addition to the luck aspect by the very nature of a TCG, it ruins and prevents consistency. Morphtronics, notably Celfon, are incredible with the right luck, but the gambling nature of Celfon reduces their consistency, and that is why the deck rarely performs well. It CAN perform well, but it can't do so with the same iron consistency that most other decks have.

Also, luck cards tend to be either "something good happens, or nothing happens". Arcana Force have the concept of "something good happens, or something BAD happens", making instances of bad luck come back to bite you even harder. For example, the Empress will make you LOSE card advantage for its secondary effect, and the Moon will force you to relinquish your monsters, giving you an overall -2 in field advantage.

These types of risks are unacceptable in any good deck, and this is worsened by the fact Arcana Force DO NOT have good beneficial effects in the first place. The EX ones are the only ones whose effects aren't unacceptably negative.
[/quote]

I need to show this topic to my friend.

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