VampireofDarkness Posted March 30, 2015 Report Share Posted March 30, 2015 Based upon a rather pessimistic view of life and death, the Dread Angels are a DARK Fairy-Type Xyz Based archetype that revolves around keeping one Rank 4 or Rank 8 Xyz on the field at a time. They can easily pump such Xyz out and some have solid effects, can regenerate materials, and have access to several cards that on their own are quite solid. The catch? They all cost Life Points, all effects are mandatory, and you can only control one of each of the Main Deck monsters at a time. Aside from playing the Deck a pure build with the basic concept down, usually with some sort of protection, techs such as Darklord Superbia and Archlord Kristya are both options, in addition to chaos potential with White Dragon Wyverbuster. As always, CnC is appreciated. [Spoiler Effect Monsters] [Spoiler Dread Angel of the Blackened Wing][/spoiler] [Spoiler Dread Angel of the Fiendish Gate][/spoiler] [Spoiler Dread Angel of the Endless Grave][/spoiler] [Spoiler Dread Angel of the Unfaithful Moon][/spoiler] [Spoiler Dread Angel of the Fallen Feathers][/spoiler] [Spoiler Dread Angel of the Devoured Throne] You can Special Summon this card (from your hand) by banishing 1 Level 4 DARK Fairy-Type monster from your Graveyard. You can Special Summon this card (from your Graveyard) by sending 1 Level 8 DARK Fairy-Type monster from your hand to the Graveyard. Once per turn, you can send 1 DARK Fairy-Type monster from your hand and 1 DARK Fairy-Type monster from your Deck to the Graveyard, then activate one of the following effects (This is a Quick Effect): - Target 1 DARK Fairy-Type monster on the field; that monster's Level becomes 8 until the end of the turn. - Target 1 "Dread Angel" monster in your Graveyard; Special Summon that target. You can only control 1 "Dread Angel of the Devoured Throne". [/spoiler] [Spoiler Dread Angel of the Illusionary Reign] You can Special Summon this card (from your hand) by banishing 1 Level 4 DARK Fairy-Type monster from your Graveyard. You can Special Summon this card (from your Graveyard) by sending 1 Level 8 DARK Fairy-Type monster from your hand to the Graveyard. Once per turn, you can send 1 DARK Fairy-Type monster from your hand and 1 DARK Fairy-Type monster from your Deck to the Graveyard, then activate one of the following effects (This is a Quick Effect): - Target 1 card on the field; destroy that target. - Target 1 DARK Fairy-Type monster you control; that target is unaffected by the opponent's card effects this turn. You can only control 1 "Dread Angel of the Illusionary Reign". [/spoiler] [/spoiler] [Spoiler Xyz Monsters] [Spoiler Dread Angel of Armageddon] 2 Level 4 DARK Fairy-Type Monsters If this card is the only monster you control, it cannot be destroyed by monster effects. At the start of each player's Battle Phase, target 1 monster your opponent controls, and if you do, detach 1 Material from this card, then pay 500 Life Points (This is not optional); place 1 Armageddon Counter on that monster. If a monster with an Armageddon Counter is destroyed (by battle or by card effect), except by the effect of "Dread Angel of Armageddon", your opponent takes damage equal to half the ATK of the destroyed monster. During the End Phase, destroy all monsters with Armageddon Counters on them. During either player's End Phase, if this card has no Xyz Materials, target any number of "Dread Angel" monsters you control, except "Dread Angel of Armageddon", and if you do, pay 500 Life Points (This is not optional); Attach the targets to this card as Xyz Materials, then your opponent takes 500 damage for each Xyz Material attached to this card. [/spoiler] [Spoiler Dread Angel of Lustful Reflections] 2 Level 4 DARK Fairy-Type Monsters If this card is the only monster you control, your opponent can only activate the effect of 1 Spell/Trap card per turn. When this card destroys a monster by battle, detach 1 Xyz Material from this card and pay 500 Life Points (This is not optional); gain Life Points equal to half the ATK of the destroyed monster. During the End Phase, if this card has no Xyz Materials, target any number of "Dread Angel" monsters you control, except "Dread Angel of Lustful Reflections" and if you do, pay 500 Life Points (This is not optional); attach the targeted monsters to this card, then gain 500 Life Points for each attached monster. [/spoiler] [Spoiler Dread Angel of the Tempted Swords] 2 Level 4 DARK Fairy-Type Monsters When this card battles a monster while it is the only monster you control, your opponent cannot activate cards and effects until the end of the Battle Phase. When this card destroys a monster by battle, detach 1 Xyz Material from this card and pay 500 Life Points (This is not optional); this card can attack again in a row. Before the end of either player's Battle Phase, if this card has no Xyz Materials and your opponent controls a monster(s), target any number of "Dread Angel" monsters you control, except "Dread Angel of the Tempted Swords", and if you do, pay 500 Life Points, then target 1 monster your opponent controls whose ATK is less than this card's original ATK (This is not optional); Attach the first target(s) to this card as Xyz Materials, then destroy the second target. [/spoiler] [Spoiler Dread Angel of the Forgotten Vengeance] 2 Level 8 DARK Fairy-Type Monsters If this card is the only monster you control and has Xyz Materials, it can attack all monsters your opponent controls once each. During each player's End Phase, detach 1 Xyz Material from this card, pay 800 Life Points, then target 1 card your opponent control; destroy that target. During either player's End Phase, if this card has no Xyz Materials, target any number of "Dread Angels" you control, except "Dread Angel of the Forgotten Vengeance" and if you do, pay 800 Life Points (This is not optional); you can destroy 1 Set card on the field. [/spoiler] [Spoiler Dread Angel of the Razor's Edge] 2 Level 8 DARK Fairy-Type Monsters If this card is the only monster you control and has Xyz Materials, neither player can activate Spell or Trap cards, except during the Main Phase and End Phase. At the start of each of your opponent's Standby Phases, detach 1 Xyz material from this card and target 1 card your opponent controls, then pay 800 Life Points (This is not optional); until the end of this turn, that card's effects are negated, and if it is Set, it cannot be flipped face up. During either player's End Phase, if this card has no Xyz Materials, target any number of "Dread Angel monsters you control, except "Dread Angel of the Razor's Edge" and if you do, pay 800 Life Points and target 1 Set Spell/Trap card your opponent controls, if any (This is not optional); attach the first targets to this card, and the second target cannot be activated while you control this card. [/spoiler] [Spoiler Dread Angel of the Withered Rose] 2 Level 8 DARK Fairy-Type Monsters If this card is the only monster you control and has Xyz Materials, it is unaffected by other card effects. At the start of each of your opponent's Draw Phases, before they draw, pay 800 Life Points and detach 1 Xyz Material from this card (This is not optional); look at the top card of your opponent's Deck, then put that card on the top or bottom of their Deck. During either player's End Phase, if this card has no Xyz Materials, target any number of "Dread Angel" monsters you control, except "Dread Angel of the Withered Rose" then pay 800 Life Points (This is not optional); Attach the first targets to this card as Xyz Materials, then look at the top card of your opponent's Deck, and put that card on the top or bottom of their Deck. [/spoiler] [/spoiler] [Spoiler Spell Cards] [Spoiler Shadows of the Dread Angels][/spoiler] [Spoiler Sorrow of the Dread Angels][/spoiler] [Spoiler Feathers of the Dread Angels][/spoiler] [Spoiler Fallen City of the Dread Angels][/spoiler] [Spoiler Cemetery of the Dread Angels][/spoiler] [/spoiler] [Spoiler Trap Card] [Spoiler Last Resort of the Dread Angels][/spoiler] [/spoiler] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VampireofDarkness Posted March 31, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 31, 2015 Bump. Any reviews/feedback? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VCR_CAT Posted March 31, 2015 Report Share Posted March 31, 2015 *cracks knuckles* Alright, get set! (just kidding)First off, the maindeck monsters are all fairly balanced; you've found some good ways to make some strong cards while also keeping them from being easily abused. The main thing to point out is that if the effect does not say "You can" or anything that implies the effect is optional and is worded in a way that presents an a condition followed by a consequence; it doesn't need to say "This is not optional" since it's already implied it has to happen. So to make sure of that, use wording like "When this card is summoned" or "When your opponent does X". This implies the effect -has- to happen.Second, there are some Xyz effects that are worded a little funny. I would go through each individually, but there are a lot of little cases. Most of them have to do with the effects that have multiple targets, so I would go back and just read through and see if there's anything that looks like it might be confusing.Third, Fallen City is intensely good. I would either put some sort of strict limit on its effect, or a big cost that makes the decision of gaining the lifepoints a strategic dilemma; such as being forced to tribute the monster in order to gain the Lifepoints. Otherwise, being able to sack into a level 8 and summoning either it or one from your grave and then gaining 2900 LP at the end of the turn is too much of a tables-turner. I would also consider specifying Original ATK over just ATK, as to prevent it from being abused with equips or other effects that boost ATK.Finally, Last Resort is insanely good for only an 800 point cost. Being able to stop a common removal monster and THEN skip their next battlephase makes this card far better than even, say, Battleguard Howling. I would cut the effect down to just the first effect, and manipulate what it does and its cost to balance it just so.Other than that, I would also recommend trying to cull out a few cards. 19 is quite a few, and I think you could it down by 2 - 4 while still retaining the same design choices and function. Just remember that an archetype shouldn't strive to cover all the bases, so tutor these monster effects to instead further the niche strategy it's going for and really own it. Other than that you're on the right track. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VampireofDarkness Posted March 31, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 31, 2015 *cracks knuckles* Alright, get set! (just kidding) First off, the maindeck monsters are all fairly balanced; you've found some good ways to make some strong cards while also keeping them from being easily abused. The main thing to point out is that if the effect does not say "You can" or anything that implies the effect is optional and is worded in a way that presents an a condition followed by a consequence; it doesn't need to say "This is not optional" since it's already implied it has to happen. So to make sure of that, use wording like "When this card is summoned" or "When your opponent does X". This implies the effect -has- to happen. Second, there are some Xyz effects that are worded a little funny. I would go through each individually, but there are a lot of little cases. Most of them have to do with the effects that have multiple targets, so I would go back and just read through and see if there's anything that looks like it might be confusing. Third, Fallen City is intensely good. I would either put some sort of strict limit on its effect, or a big cost that makes the decision of gaining the lifepoints a strategic dilemma; such as being forced to tribute the monster in order to gain the Lifepoints. Otherwise, being able to sack into a level 8 and summoning either it or one from your grave and then gaining 2900 LP at the end of the turn is too much of a tables-turner. I would also consider specifying Original ATK over just ATK, as to prevent it from being abused with equips or other effects that boost ATK. Finally, Last Resort is insanely good for only an 800 point cost. Being able to stop a common removal monster and THEN skip their next battlephase makes this card far better than even, say, Battleguard Howling. I would cut the effect down to just the first effect, and manipulate what it does and its cost to balance it just so. Other than that, I would also recommend trying to cull out a few cards. 19 is quite a few, and I think you could it down by 2 - 4 while still retaining the same design choices and function. Just remember that an archetype shouldn't strive to cover all the bases, so tutor these monster effects to instead further the niche strategy it's going for and really own it. Other than that you're on the right track.Whoops! Fallen City should only heal for half the ATK. Is it fine with that in mind? Main Deck monsters, thanks for letting me know, I was just taking the wording from the classic Archfiends. Thanks for noting the balance, I've been fairly cautious with how it works because the engine is sometimes rather fast and because of the easy access to cards like Superbia, but it has yet to cause problems up to this point. As for the Xyz, I'll check it. Maybe if you can lead me in the right direction? Again, I'll check with a few peers, but you could be right. This archetype is a few months old, previously meant to compete in a tournament, so I just kept most of the wording intact cause it wasn't mentioned Onto Last Resort, I have yet to see this card get too much play, (I was previously testing these on Duel Portal before the site went down) so I can't say for sure. It's definitely good opening with it and combining it with certain cards makes it definitely good, but like a fair amount of the Deck, it's not the best late game, and is one of the few things that gives the Deck such. Also keep in mind the monster on the field must be the only, and it doesn't stop the effect from happening at all, which means you can be left open at times. When Duel Portal comes back up or when I get the cards into YGOPro as I plan, I will definitely see its power, but for right now I will have your comment on the table. I also am on the fence about cutting cards. As I previously mentioned, I have done some extensive testing, and the Deck has had the majority of the cards in it for a while now. Though the Deck has recently been getting upgrades to its original cards and such, I do feel it uses most of its cards to a fair extent to keep itself afoot, unlike unnecessary support for an archetype that is often missed out on (Ex Bujingi Sinyou). I see where you are coming from for sure, but I also have the evidence that most of it has put a fair amount of work in. (I say most cause some of the recent revisions that led me to this post were not tested a lot before Duel Portal went down). I don't plan on adding anything, but taking away things is questionable for now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VCR_CAT Posted March 31, 2015 Report Share Posted March 31, 2015 Fair enough. To be honest, a lot my judgments are based on theory, but if practice has proven otherwise then I can't really argue with that.I'll use Razor's Edge for an example, though.Original:During either player's End Phase, if this card has no Xyz Materials, target any number of "Dread Angel monsters you control, except "Dread Angel of the Razor's Edge" and if you do, pay 800 Life Points and target 1 Set Spell/Trap card your opponent controls, if any (This is not optional); attach the first targets to this card, and the second target cannot be activated while you control this cardWhat I think it could be:During either player's End Phase, if this card has no Xyz Materials; pay 800 LP, then target any number of "Dread Angel" monsters you control and 1 Set Spell/Trap Card your opponent controls (if any): Attach the first target(s) to this card as Xyz Material. Spells and Traps targeted by this card's effect cannot be activated while you control this Face-Up card.At least, that's what I HOPE would be a correct wording. Granted, my OCG still needs work and this does change the order in which things occur. Granted, by the sounds of it the first half of the effect on your end is all technically simultaneous as the cost, so I think it turns out okay. I would recommend posting a broad effect in the OCG correction thread that can be applied to all your monsters and then fixing it accordingly, since the multiple simultaneous effects is sticky business.Also yeah, half ATK is a lot better than equal to ATK, but I would still specify "Original". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VampireofDarkness Posted March 31, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 31, 2015 Fair enough. To be honest, a lot my judgments are based on theory, but if practice has proven otherwise then I can't really argue with that. I'll use Razor's Edge for an example, though. Original: During either player's End Phase, if this card has no Xyz Materials, target any number of "Dread Angel monsters you control, except "Dread Angel of the Razor's Edge" and if you do, pay 800 Life Points and target 1 Set Spell/Trap card your opponent controls, if any (This is not optional); attach the first targets to this card, and the second target cannot be activated while you control this card What I think it could be: During either player's End Phase, if this card has no Xyz Materials; pay 800 LP, then target any number of "Dread Angel" monsters you control and 1 Set Spell/Trap Card your opponent controls (if any): Attach the first target(s) to this card as Xyz Material. Spells and Traps targeted by this card's effect cannot be activated while you control this Face-Up card. At least, that's what I HOPE would be a correct wording. Granted, my OCG still needs work and this does change the order in which things occur. Granted, by the sounds of it the first half of the effect on your end is all technically simultaneous as the cost, so I think it turns out okay. I would recommend posting a broad effect in the OCG correction thread that can be applied to all your monsters and then fixing it accordingly, since the multiple simultaneous effects is sticky business. Also yeah, half ATK is a lot better than equal to ATK, but I would still specify "Original". Testing definitely helps, the Deck used to be not so great when it started off as just the Main Deck monsters with the exception of Throne, Reign and Feathers, but had completely different effects that didn't really synergize and Armageddon was the only Xyz (Which destroyed cards equal to any number Xyz materials you detached during your opponent's End Phase), and it slowly became this after figuring out what I could do to make it function and low and behold, it works As for OCG, The only problem with your suggestion is I want it to be mandatory to target monsters, but only enforce payments if any monsters are targeted. With your suggestion, I THINK it would be the LP first, which is not what I wish. I will ask about it tho. Thank you for at least bringing it up. Also with Fallen, I'll probably end up doing original ATK then, if only to make calculations easier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VCR_CAT Posted March 31, 2015 Report Share Posted March 31, 2015 You can also add the condition of If this card has no Xyz Materials and you control other "Dread Angel" monsters. As I said, it gets very sticky so I would bring this up with someone that REALLY knows what they're talking about XD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VampireofDarkness Posted March 31, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 31, 2015 You can also add the condition of If this card has no Xyz Materials and you control other "Dread Angel" monsters. As I said, it gets very sticky so I would bring this up with someone that REALLY knows what they're talking about XD That would be where Zazi comes in..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Number IV Posted March 31, 2015 Report Share Posted March 31, 2015 Hullo! 1st) In regards to fallen city, the mandatory life gain seems a bit unfair, especially considering that if this is late game, some Xyz Monster can provide a min. of 1200 LP 2nd) Do you have any hard counters, aside from basic deck staples to combat something (which, I guess isn't as common) like Simochi or Reficule. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VampireofDarkness Posted April 1, 2015 Author Report Share Posted April 1, 2015 Hullo! 1st) In regards to fallen city, the mandatory life gain seems a bit unfair, especially considering that if this is late game, some Xyz Monster can provide a min. of 1200 LP 2nd) Do you have any hard counters, aside from basic deck staples to combat something (which, I guess isn't as common) like Simochi or Reficule.From playtesting, it's less harsh than one would imagine, and it's kinda necessary to keep Fallen City up at times cause you'll be paying anywhere from 1300-2300 a turn depending on what you have to do to keep yourself/get yourself back in the game, and Fallen does that. The banish can also hurt because it is mandatory, where you want to keep cards in your Graveyard for cards like Devoured Throne and Illusionary Reign become top priority. The aforementioned point goes into point 2 where Simochi doesn't exactly become the most ideal card against the Deck compared to just negating enough effects to where you have exhausted out the Life Points to not be able to do much. As such, cards like Fiendish Chain and Breakthrough Skill really hurt the Deck, because usually if a bigger play, especially one of your Main Deck monsters attempting to go into an Xyz, gets interrupted, you have to pay more LP to make up for the loss. A good example would be if your trying to make a play with Throne so you Normal Summon Moon to send it from the Deck, it gets Chain'd so you have to lose the 500 and instead use something like a Blackened Wing (Costs 800) to go into a less powerful Xyz like Armageddon (500 for the removal, so 1800 payed the turn) to regain control of the gamestate. Though to directly answer the question, no, there is no Spell/Trap destruction/negation to stop such cards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorgott-san Posted April 4, 2015 Report Share Posted April 4, 2015 I like the dark design and the way the cards work. Really cool cards, but two of them confused me a little bit. 1st : Dread Angel of the forgotten Vengeance "During either player's End Phase, if this card has no Xyz Materials, target any number of "Dread Angels" you control, except "Dread Angel of the Forgotten Vengeance" and if you do, pay 800 Life Points (This is not optional); you can destroy 1 Set card on the field." Why do you need to target a monster, if you dont do anything with the mosnter. Is it just to make sure, there IS another monster. But then it would make more sense, to just ask for another monster existing. 2nd: Dread Angel of the razor´s edge " and if it is Set, it cannot be flipped face up" What do you do then, if you attack that monster? Beside these 2 confusing me, I really like the cards. Good work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VampireofDarkness Posted April 4, 2015 Author Report Share Posted April 4, 2015 I like the dark design and the way the cards work. Really cool cards, but two of them confused me a little bit. 1st : Dread Angel of the forgotten Vengeance "During either player's End Phase, if this card has no Xyz Materials, target any number of "Dread Angels" you control, except "Dread Angel of the Forgotten Vengeance" and if you do, pay 800 Life Points (This is not optional); you can destroy 1 Set card on the field." Why do you need to target a monster, if you dont do anything with the mosnter. Is it just to make sure, there IS another monster. But then it would make more sense, to just ask for another monster existing.2nd: Dread Angel of the razor´s edge " and if it is Set, it cannot be flipped face up"What do you do then, if you attack that monster? Beside these 2 confusing me, I really like the cards. Good work. That's a mistake. The targets are supposed to attach to Vengeance, like the rest of the Dread Angels, THEN destroy the Set card Razor's effect only works during the opponent's turn for one turn IIRC, but in theory I believe you can't attack the monster due to the rulings on Protector of the Sanctuary. Thank you for the feedback tho! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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