COTLB Broken?

[El Majishan]

So I was talking to my friend the other day and I told him he sucks and only wins because he runs LS (which he does wrong btw). He tried to defend himself saying LS are not that broken and only JD is the problem. While it is common knowledge that JD is a problem I also pointed out to him that COTLB is also a problem. He then replied with "that's bull" and asked me to explain my point of view....which I did.

 

I said that "COTLB is a problem because it adds to much speed to an already fast deck with no draw backs and can easily lead to crazy Field Advantage with no skill required of the LS player."

 

He again asked me to explain

 

I then showed him the basic LS opening hand (from what I've seen)

 

"COTLB into Lumina, mill 3 cards. Chances are you milled a Wulf and another monster or at least 1 monster. If you milled Wulf you get a Free Summon. If you milled another monster summon Lumina and revive. So thats 2-3 Monsters all because of one card. The LS player then carries out their Battle Phase, Main Phase 2 and End Phase. During the End Phase you mill AT LEAST another 3 Cards. Most likely 3-6 cards. So in one turn the LS player milled 6-9 cards which sets them up for an easy JD next turn"

 

I know Solar Recharge is also played some where is that combo but I just wanted to focus on COTLB.

 

Anyway while JD is still the win condition in the end. COTLB only adds to the problem by adding unneeded speed to an already fast deck. It also gives the possibility of massive field advantage with little effort.

 

So YCM I come to you seeking your opinion. Discuss.

[Master Hyperion]

What was COTLD again?

[Azuh]

What was COTLB again?

 

Charge of the Light Brigade

[Master Hyperion]

What was COTLB again?

 

Charge of the Light Brigade

 

I misspelled it?

>_<

 

On-topic:

So in one turn the LS player milled 6-9 cards with sets them up for an easy JD next turn

 

Don't use banworthy cards as an arguement for a banlist placement for a card.

 

ktnx

 

And really? It's just ROTA made awesome for a specific archtype.

[El Majishan]

What was COTLB again?

 

Charge of the Light Brigade

 

I misspelled it?

>_<

 

On-topic:

So in one turn the LS player milled 6-9 cards with sets them up for an easy JD next turn

 

Don't use banworthy cards as an arguement for a banlist placement for a card.

 

ktnx

 

And really? It's just ROTA made awesome for a specific archtype.

 

That's like saying don't use DSF as an argument as to why Rescue Cat was a problem. As I said it is a problem because of what it can do with no cost. Yes its an RoTA, but as you said "made awesome". The speed and advantage it gives to an already fast deck is almost unfair. Why was Rescue Cat a problem? Because of what it can do with little to no cost right? And its easy to set up OTK right? Its the same concept here. Massive Advantage with no cost or effort is not a good thing.

[Father Wolf]

What was COTLB again?

 

Charge of the Light Brigade

 

I misspelled it?

>_<

 

On-topic:

So in one turn the LS player milled 6-9 cards with sets them up for an easy JD next turn

 

Don't use banworthy cards as an arguement for a banlist placement for a card.

 

ktnx

 

And really? It's just ROTA made awesome for a specific archtype.

 

That's like saying don't use DSF as an argument as to why Rescue Cat was a problem. As I said it is a problem because of what it can do with no cost. Yes its an RoTA' date=' but as you said "made awesome". The speed and advantage it gives to an already fast deck is almost unfair. Why was Rescue Cat a problem? Because of what it can do with little to no cost right? And its easy to set up OTK right? Its the same concept here. Massive Advantage with no cost or effort is not a good thing.

[/quote']

 

Rescue Cat is a +1 guarantied + easy synchro set up + Speed; while, Charge is a +0 + +X capabilities + Speed.

 

yes charge is a powerful searcher that can set up OTK's... reason why? JD. im not saying Charge should be left at 3 (i would say Simi-limit because you could mill 1 away and possibly get 1 in hand), all im saying is it isnt what makes LS win. so whats the problem here? JD.

[/thread]

[El Majishan]

What was COTLB again?

 

Charge of the Light Brigade

 

I misspelled it?

>_<

 

On-topic:

So in one turn the LS player milled 6-9 cards with sets them up for an easy JD next turn

 

Don't use banworthy cards as an arguement for a banlist placement for a card.

 

ktnx

 

And really? It's just ROTA made awesome for a specific archtype.

 

That's like saying don't use DSF as an argument as to why Rescue Cat was a problem. As I said it is a problem because of what it can do with no cost. Yes its an RoTA' date=' but as you said "made awesome". The speed and advantage it gives to an already fast deck is almost unfair. Why was Rescue Cat a problem? Because of what it can do with little to no cost right? And its easy to set up OTK right? Its the same concept here. Massive Advantage with no cost or effort is not a good thing.

[/quote']

 

Rescue Cat is a +1 guarantied + easy synchro set up + Speed; while, Charge is a +0 + +X capabilities + Speed.

 

yes charge is a powerful searcher that can set up OTK's... reason why? JD. im not saying Charge should be left at 3 (i would say Simi-limit because you could mill 1 away and possibly get 1 in hand), all im saying is it isnt what makes LS win. so whats the problem here? JD.

[/thread]

 

Valid point, and being at 2 would help limit the problem. To me it just makes the JD/LS Swarm problem worst but giving the deck to much speed.

[RyanAtlus]

This is what it actually does...

 

CotLB

During your third Standby Phase after activation, Special Summon 1 'Judgment Dragon' from your Deck, ignoring the Summoning Conditions.

[Manjoume Thunder]

FACT: LS wasn't winning in Japan before they got COTLB.

[iAmNateXero]

FACT: LS wasn't winning in Japan before they got COTLB.

 

FACT: Lysol Kills 99.9% of all houshold Germs!

[Guest PikaPerson01]

So it adds consistently to a lucksack inconsisent deck? What's the problem? You have just as much as chance as opening with a Wulf opening hand as you do opening with CoTLB.

[Dark_Armed_Zombie]

FACT: LS wasn't winning in Japan before they got COTLB.

 

FACT: Lysol Kills 99.9% of all houshold Germs!

 

FACT: JD owns all other broken cards and sells then via the slave trade.

[/thread]

 

CotLB didn't help anything, but it isn't broken. Cheap? Yeah. Unfair? Arguably. Broken? No, just annoying as heck for LS.

[Fraz]

FACT: LS wasn't winning in Japan before they got COTLB.

 

This is true... charge added consistency to a decktype which was developed to be unpredictable and inconsistent.

 

Charge gives a player +4 new options. While it doesn't add any card advantage, with the exception of milling a wulf or 2, it does put a player in a better position to win the game quickly and unfairly.

 

Charge needs to go to one on the banlist imo, with solar recharge going to 2...

[Exiro]

"COTLB into Lumina' date=' mill 3 cards. Chances are you milled a Wulf and another monster or at least 1 monster.

[/quote']

 

There is also a fair chance that you won't mill any monsters at all, but if they do, I see no problems with it.

 

 

If you milled Wulf you get a Free Summon.

 

That is indeed the definition of a 'Free Summon'. I see no problems with it.

 

 

If you milled another monster summon Lumina and revive.

 

That would indeed be an option. I see no problems with it.

 

 

So thats 2-3 Monsters all because of one card.

 

If no monster was milled' date=' that would be just 1 monster. In case of 3 monsters, I see no problems with it.

 

 

The LS player then carries out their Battle Phase, Main Phase 2 and End Phase.

 

Just like any other deck. I see no problems with it.

 

 

During the End Phase you mill AT LEAST another 3 Cards. Most likely 3-6 cards.

 

Unless TT or something similar happens. If that doesn't happen' date=' I see no problems with it.

 

 

So in one turn the LS player milled 6-9 cards

I see no problems with it.

 

 

which sets them up for an easy JD next turn"

 

Which is why JD should be banned.

[daboss144]

It's because Konami is still under the impression that the milling lightsworns do is a cost... That was supposed to be their main weaknesses for people to exploit while playing against them. What they didn't realize was that wulf wasn't the only card that gives an added benefit to the milling. It is now excessively easy to play with zombies and the rest of the current meta. It is broken, but a few limitations of cards (not banning) will help limit them. Honest at 1, JD at 1, they become much less dominating.

---

Oh, and ban Beckoning Light.

[Flame Dragon]

This is true... charge added consistency to a decktype which was developed to be unpredictable and inconsistent.

How is this bad.

 

Charge gives a player +4 new options.

And Solar Recharge is a +4 in new options. Ryko give you +3 in new options. Needlebug Nest give you +5 in new options. Lets ban all them too.

While it doesn't add any card advantage' date=' with the exception of milling a wulf or 2, it does put a player in a better position to win the game quickly and unfairly.

[/quote']

Is the whole point of any given card in a deck to help move you closer to winning? Also how is it unfair?

 

Charge needs to go to one on the banlist imo' date=' with solar recharge going to 2...

[/quote']

Please tell me your joking. Never put a card at 2. That changes NOTHING. A card should only go to two based on how it interacts with other copies of itself. The same goes for putting a card at 1. Just you can also put one their if it provides good for the game (such as Mirror Force).

[tonisanoob]

theme specific rota?

 

no i dont think so

[Darkest Hour]

:\

Really? More people complaining about running Lightsworn and wahing because it's too strong?

 

Use a damn side deck. Rai-Oh kills JD, Lumina's Summons, Wulfs and stops COTLB. That's the first suggestion.

[Father Wolf]

:\

Really? More people complaining about running Lightsworn and wahing because it's too strong?

 

Use a damn side deck. Rai-Oh kills JD' date=' Lumina's Summons, Wulfs and stops COTLB. That's the first suggestion.

[/quote']

 

LOLOLOLOL Rai-Oh can't stop Wulf and Lumina summons. u silly noob.

 

Siding Light-Imprisoning Mirror or Skill Drain is enough to hurt LS.

[Darkest Hour]

:\

Really? More people complaining about running Lightsworn and wahing because it's too strong?

 

Use a damn side deck. Rai-Oh kills JD' date=' Lumina's Summons, Wulfs and stops COTLB. That's the first suggestion.

[/quote']

 

LOLOLOLOL Rai-Oh can't stop Wulf and Lumina summons. u silly noob.

 

Siding Light-Imprisoning Mirror or Skill Drain is enough to hurt LS.

 

O RLY?

[Guest PikaPerson01]

:\

Really? More people complaining about running Lightsworn and wahing because it's too strong?

 

Use a damn side deck. Rai-Oh kills JD' date=' Lumina's Summons, Wulfs and stops COTLB. That's the first suggestion.

[/quote']

 

That's a terrible argument. I really don't feel like explaining why, but if I really must, at the absolute minimum, rather then addressing admitted problems in your game, your only suggestion is for people to play cards that some people wouldn't wish to play in their decks. "Treeborn's ruining the meta!? Rather then banning Treeborn, we're just going to give you the advice of running D.D. Crow!"

[Darkest Hour]

:\

Really? More people complaining about running Lightsworn and wahing because it's too strong?

 

Use a damn side deck. Rai-Oh kills JD' date=' Lumina's Summons, Wulfs and stops COTLB. That's the first suggestion.

[/quote']

 

That's a terrible argument. I really don't feel like explaining why, but if I really must, at the absolute minimum, rather then addressing admitted problems in your game, your only suggestion is for people to play cards that some people wouldn't wish to play in their decks. "Treeborn's ruining the meta!? Rather then banning Treeborn, we're just going to give you the advice of running D.D. Crow!"

 

Simple solutions for the win. Charge of the Light Brigade, hell, even Lightsworn wouldn't be a problem if people would quit playing stupid decks that don't win anyway, and start using a side deck or at least running something to stop the cards they hate rather than demanding that they be banned if they aren't banworthy. There are some cards that we just too powerful and had to be banned, while some give a huge advantage to a player and continue to do so because people don't play well enough to survive against them.

[Dark_Armed_Zombie]

So you are saying that SJC was full of idiot players who played bad decks and didn't use a side deck? A side deck helps, but there is a reason 9 of the top 16 were LS and there is a reason LS made it to the top 4. The deck does take some skill so that you can make it work when you are getting bad mills or bad hands, but the second you get 4 LS w/ different names in the grave it's pretty much auto-pilot win. Just because you side doesn't mean you will win.

[El Majishan]

:\

Really? More people complaining about running Lightsworn and wahing because it's too strong?

 

Use a damn side deck. Rai-Oh kills JD' date=' Lumina's Summons, Wulfs and stops COTLB. That's the first suggestion.

[/quote']

 

That's a terrible argument. I really don't feel like explaining why, but if I really must, at the absolute minimum, rather then addressing admitted problems in your game, your only suggestion is for people to play cards that some people wouldn't wish to play in their decks. "Treeborn's ruining the meta!? Rather then banning Treeborn, we're just going to give you the advice of running D.D. Crow!"

 

Simple solutions for the win. Charge of the Light Brigade, hell, even Lightsworn wouldn't be a problem if people would quit playing stupid decks that don't win anyway, and start using a side deck or at least running something to stop the cards they hate rather than demanding that they be banned if they aren't banworthy. There are some cards that we just too powerful and had to be banned, while some give a huge advantage to a player and continue to do so because people don't play well enough to survive against them.

 

I don't even know how to reply to this without insulting you....

---

:\

Really? More people complaining about running Lightsworn and wahing because it's too strong?

 

Use a damn side deck. Rai-Oh kills JD' date=' Lumina's Summons, Wulfs and stops COTLB. That's the first suggestion.

[/quote']

 

LOLOLOLOL Rai-Oh can't stop Wulf and Lumina summons. u silly noob.

 

Siding Light-Imprisoning Mirror or Skill Drain is enough to hurt LS.

 

D-Fissure also helps since the LS playing wilt just side in Royal Decree/Trap Eater because they expect LIM

[Father Wolf]

:\

Really? More people complaining about running Lightsworn and wahing because it's too strong?

 

Use a damn side deck. Rai-Oh kills JD' date=' Lumina's Summons, Wulfs and stops COTLB. That's the first suggestion.

[/quote']

 

That's a terrible argument. I really don't feel like explaining why, but if I really must, at the absolute minimum, rather then addressing admitted problems in your game, your only suggestion is for people to play cards that some people wouldn't wish to play in their decks. "Treeborn's ruining the meta!? Rather then banning Treeborn, we're just going to give you the advice of running D.D. Crow!"

 

Simple solutions for the win. Charge of the Light Brigade, hell, even Lightsworn wouldn't be a problem if people would quit playing stupid decks that don't win anyway, and start using a side deck or at least running something to stop the cards they hate rather than demanding that they be banned if they aren't banworthy. There are some cards that we just too powerful and had to be banned, while some give a huge advantage to a player and continue to do so because people don't play well enough to survive against them.

 

I don't even know how to reply to this without insulting you....

---

:\

Really? More people complaining about running Lightsworn and wahing because it's too strong?

 

Use a damn side deck. Rai-Oh kills JD' date=' Lumina's Summons, Wulfs and stops COTLB. That's the first suggestion.

[/quote']

 

LOLOLOLOL Rai-Oh can't stop Wulf and Lumina summons. u silly noob.

 

Siding Light-Imprisoning Mirror or Skill Drain is enough to hurt LS.

 

D-Fissure also helps since the LS playing wilt just side in Royal Decree/Trap Eater because they expect LIM

 

D-Fissure is rly only a good anti-LS side in GB.