evilhorus Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 This meta, as you all very well know, is incredibly fast, with victory occurring on the 1st turn not being an oddity (and on the 0th turn for some). [/capt obvious] As said by PIkaperson, a card that nukes the whole field for the measly cost of 1000LP is viewed at as being bad, which shows us how terrible this meta is. Well, Discus the current meta. How long will it last? Will it get slower? Faster(lol)? Or will we be forever within this purgatory of losing without a 2nd turn? Go go go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vough Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 FISHTK Fusion Gate FTK Six Sams SalvoDAD We're doomed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manjoume Thunder Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 [quote]Practicing dice rolling is probably a better thing than actually play testing atm.[/quote] And Librarian hasn't been released yet. [quote]SalvoDAD[/quote] wat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yeezus Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 META STATE OF MIND *thinks up rap* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vough Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 [quote name='Loki el Señor de los Aesir' timestamp='1306780923' post='5242216'] META STATE OF MIND *thinks up rap* [/quote] Lol Empire State of Min parody. Meta is broken. Konami doesn't care of 'cause of $100+ cards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ieyasu Tokugawa Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 [quote name='Vough' timestamp='1306780974' post='5242217'] Lol Empire State of Min parody. Meta is broken. Konami doesn't care of 'cause of $100+ cards [/quote] Konami doesn't sell singles iirc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vough Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 [quote name='Miror B.' timestamp='1306781088' post='5242219'] Konami doesn't sell singles iirc. [/quote] Buy mass packs Get rares top tourneys Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evilhorus Posted May 30, 2011 Author Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 [quote name='Vough' timestamp='1306781277' post='5242227'] Buy mass packs Get rares top tourneys [/quote] It was an unknown (?) double meaning Singles > Cards Singles > Songs > Empire State of Mind/Meta Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Resident Fascist Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 [quote name='Vough' timestamp='1306781277' post='5242227'] Buy mass packs Get rares top tourneys [/quote] All TCGs are like that, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evilhorus Posted May 30, 2011 Author Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 Also, all TCG's are owned by the spoiled kids with $$$. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 Every deck mains Veiler now..... at least, they should. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Cakey Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 idk run battle fader? Isn't this what GKs were for? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeathSDelano Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 aren't GKs also in tops meta game as well >.> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lonk Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 If the meta is this fast, I don't see why Stalling Traps that are @1 should be limited anymore..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evilhorus Posted May 30, 2011 Author Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 [quote name='ZeroChill' timestamp='1306785459' post='5242359'] If the meta is this fast, I don't see why Stalling Traps that are @1 should be limited anymore..... [/quote] lolnami? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King of Nothing Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 The meta will only get faster, unless if Konami just bans everything invasion of chaos and after. It's not Konami's fault (oh no I'm about to die), it's actually to be expected of any game that doesn't cycle. They didn't cycle it because they probably didn't expect it to be as big as it really is. You have to print better cards to stay alive, or the same decks will always win. Konami should cycle between seasons, so that the first yugioh cycled out when GX came in, and GX cycled out for 5ds, etc...Or, I don't know, they should have a cycling list is what i'm trying to say. If they don't use a cycling mechanic I wouldn't be surprised if we looked at Delinquent (Sp?) Duo and called it bad because it didn't generate a field advantage, or if we looked at mirror force and called it bad because it didn't generate a hand advantage. We'll probably start seeing a meta where people don't even normal summon monsters, because they don't need to. It's already kind of getting like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evilhorus Posted May 30, 2011 Author Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 [quote name='Ghostmyth' timestamp='1306789736' post='5242519'] The meta will only get faster, unless if Konami just bans everything invasion of chaos and after. It's not Konami's fault [u][i][b](oh no I'm about to die)[/b][/i][/u], it's actually to be expected of any game that doesn't cycle. They didn't cycle it because they probably didn't expect it to be as big as it really is. You have to print better cards to stay alive, or the same decks will always win. Konami should cycle between seasons, so that the first yugioh cycled out when GX came in, and GX cycled out for 5ds, etc...Or, I don't know, they should have a cycling list is what i'm trying to say. If they don't use a cycling mechanic I wouldn't be surprised if we looked at Delinquent (Sp?) Duo and called it bad because it didn't generate a field advantage, or if we looked at mirror force and called it bad because it didn't generate a hand advantage. We'll probably start seeing a meta where people don't even normal summon monsters, because they don't need to. It's already kind of getting like that. [/quote] OHHH YES YOU ARE But Debris needs a normal Summon I can actually see a Normal Summon-less meta in a while (long while, though), unless Konami make a crapload of uber cards with norma summon effects. Id love that, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King of Nothing Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 [quote name='Cyber Eltanin' timestamp='1306789953' post='5242544'] OHHH YES YOU ARE But Debris needs a normal Summon I can actually see a Normal Summon-less meta in a while (long while, though), unless Konami make a crapload of uber cards with norma summon effects. Id love that, [/quote] You mean like...Charmer Monarchs? The Charmers become the new Monarchs and have a low level but still have an awesome effect? I could see that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boss Z Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 Debris, Junk, that one Six Sam Card that special summons another six sam, Lone Fire Blossom... Thats All I can think of that is meta that gets normal summoned [color="#FFFFFF"]I know there are more, but I'm just emphasisng... duh[/color] What Lolnami needs to do is make Abusable cards for every Archtype... and make some of those cards Commons and in High-Print, thus forcing the Price of Awesome archtypes down and adding to the diversity of the game The Closest thing we now have to this was the release of W Nebula Metior... which literally is the ONLY reason Worms are good Lolnami needs to start doing things like that for other Archtypes or give them lots of Special Attention as the SixSam Archtype got and make everything PRO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mysty Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 [quote name='Invalid Arguement' timestamp='1306781360' post='5242233'] All TCGs are like that, though. [/quote] I've heard that, in Vampire: the Eternal Struggle, if a card goes up to $10, the company will reprint it in the next Starter Deck. Therefore, the price of a card never stays up. I don't play it, but that's the testimony of someone I know who does. Personally, in order to make this game balanced, I would personally just start anew, implement a rotation system, and/or make a large banlist. The way things are are basically broken beyond repair. A rotation system would guarantee that any archetypes (if any) would have to be smaller and/or more generic in their support (maybe to the point of two-archetype decks). Of course, I support giving all archetypes more support if a rotation system isn't implemented, but not to the point where every archetype becomes broken and expensive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Resident Fascist Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 [quote name='Mystery Guest' timestamp='1306796592' post='5242866'] implement a rotation system [/quote] I don't like spending £2,000 every 12 Months. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boss Z Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 [quote name='Invalid Arguement' timestamp='1306796771' post='5242872'] I don't like spending £2,000 every 12 Months. [/quote] In a system that is involved in MTG or Pokemon, the values of cards actually stay lower, except for a few given cards... the point of the system is that players know after X Number of Months, they won't be able to play the cards in the Meta, they'll drop out, its actually a good thing... kinda it just would break all yugioh stradegies and would require either the increase from 5/9 cards per pack OR would require more cards per pack (some being reprints) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psycho Shocker Android Posted May 31, 2011 Report Share Posted May 31, 2011 Just wait till we get librarian and quasar. Right now, it's not a bad meta we still have heroes and GK, they don't win fast and still top. The only real problem I see is royal tribute ruining veilers, faders, trago and gorz. With those you can't get otk easily. It would force aggro deck into mid range stuff because I do agree, when 2 of those collide games don't last long. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flame Dragon Posted May 31, 2011 Report Share Posted May 31, 2011 [quote=i just noticed how much the quoting system sucks] Mark Rosewater's Mana Action: On why Mana is key to MTG success #2 – It Controls the Flow of the Game One of the best ways to understand the value of something is to imagine a world in which it doesn't exist. So for this thought experiment, let's imagine that you can play whatever card you want whenever you want. How would the game play? Turn one, you'd play most of your cards—definitely the permanents that you can attack your opponent with and any proactive spells. The only things you wouldn't play would be reactive spells that would want to wait until they're useful. As this is a trading card game, you would choose cards that bent towards this system. Most likely you would choose cards that overcome the two major limits in the system, turns and cards. For example, you'd be much more likely to play creatures with haste because the ability to attack the turn you cast the creature helps you accelerate the usefulness of your creatures by a turn. Likewise, card drawing would go from being very good to being completely insane as it would allow you to play even more spells. The end result of this is that the game would probably end on the first player's first turn. Maybe the opponent has enough reactive cards to stop the first player, but the abuse of this system leads to games that end very quickly. Now you can start to see what the mana system is preventing. Magic is more fun if only one or two cards get cast a turn, especially in the early game. The mana system allows a slow buildup as players get to cast larger and more powerful spells. The mana system serves as a release valve that helps ensure that something happens each turn, but not too much. Most players don't think about the pace of the game because people don't tend to think about what just is. Magic plays the way it does because, well, that's what it does. When you peek behind the scenes, though, you start to realize that there are all sorts of ways the game could play badly. The mana system was created to help regulate the game play to the pace we all know and love. [/quote] IMO this speaks a lot to why yugioh has the problem that it does. The normal summon rule was used as a way to cap the amount of stuff you can do in one turn. However the game has evolved a lot since the early days an the number of ways to special summon has only increased allowing for numerous moves to be made in a single turn. IMO the easiest fix is to put a cap on special summons, but that doesn't seem like a good move. The next best thing is to add something like summoning sickness so that creatures can't attack the turn the enter play. This would give the other player a chance to respond or find a response the some moves. After that banning literally +30 cards (I can't remember my ban list so that's a rough guest at the number of cards I would ban but odds are it's still low since it's super out of date) might be the only other option. [quote name='Boss Z' timestamp='1306795375' post='5242825'] What Lolnami needs to do is make Abusable cards for every Archtype... and make some of those cards Commons and in High-Print, thus forcing the Price of Awesome archtypes down and adding to the diversity of the game The Closest thing we now have to this was the release of W Nebula Metior... which literally is the ONLY reason Worms are good Lolnami needs to start doing things like that for other Archtypes or give them lots of Special Attention as the SixSam Archtype got and make everything PRO [/quote] More broken cards won't help any. Adding more good cards at lower rarities would be nice but it won't happen. We know DAD as secret rare because it was moved their from Rare compared to it's OCG counter part. Also people HATE mythic rares in MTG for upping the price of the game and those come in 1/8 packs. Side from them you get you always get a common, uncommon, and rare in your packs. Yugioh on the other hand has common, rare, super rare (at 1/5), ultra (at 1/12), and secret (at 1/23). Really, changing the rarity system around to one that doesn't suck would also be a god send. Also, a rant I've been wanting to go on for a while is how konami treats archetypes and how it personally made me stop buying cards. Really, they are treated as flavors of the week. They spin there magic giant wheel to pick an archetype they want to support/make and give them support for several sets. After that they either stop making new cards for them or throw them 1 or 2 crappy/meh card every now and then. While this is going on a new archetype gets made a the cycle repeats. I don't think a set goes buy in recent memory where some kind of new archetype is made. The worse part is that when people take time to invest in a deck once the support goes away they will fall behind the new toys the new archetypes are getting as their best cards get hit by the ban list. Hell, I played Zombies and even with something a broad as a type I got shafted after they lost interest. This causes people, myself included, to need to go out an invest in the new flavor of the week. And this is coming from someone that played casually. So yea, that's my say on the whole matter. Odds are some of this is off the mark since I've been only glancing at Yugioh stuff for the past year now. Maybe my casual experience doesn't translate well into the competitive field. Maybe I'm just crazy. What ever the case, I'm sure some of what I said holds true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DARKPLANT RISING Posted May 31, 2011 Report Share Posted May 31, 2011 I long those days when Vorse Raider won games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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