.Rai Posted March 27, 2012 Report Share Posted March 27, 2012 One of two things: - It's ignorance based on cultural biases basically. Happens everywhere, is extremely annoying, and it will always stay here in society unfortunately. - Enraged fans who read the book stupidly and didn't realise Rue was black. Probably both really. Mainly the second, because a lot of people probably didn't read the thing fully. Just shows our concentration spans. Pretty much what people have already said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Crouton Posted March 27, 2012 Report Share Posted March 27, 2012 I can sympathize. When I watched the original Transformers cartoon, I imagined Spike as a likable character who later becomes part of Fortress Maximus in the series finale. Then, I saw 5 minutes of Revenge of the Fallen and was disappointed to see he was replaced by Shia LaBeouf. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tentacruel Posted March 27, 2012 Report Share Posted March 27, 2012 [quote name='❤ Lovely Warrior ❤' timestamp='1332863978' post='5890891'] Becuase if its a black person and something bad happens to him/her idiots automatically asumes it racist. [/quote] I don't think you read the article. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dwarven King Posted March 27, 2012 Report Share Posted March 27, 2012 [quote name='Yuzuru Otonashi' timestamp='1332826944' post='5890485'] [insert rant about media being media] [insert sheep picture] [insert creepy statement] [/quote] Book said Rue had Dark skin. Dark =/= White. You argument is now invalid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blake Posted March 27, 2012 Report Share Posted March 27, 2012 [quote name='Dwarven King' timestamp='1332874707' post='5891101'] Book said Rue had Dark skin. Dark =/= White. You argument is now invalid. [/quote] And you can't read. I was saying people missed the statement where it said she was black, and that they weren't being racist on purpose for the msot part, it was jsut an inconsistency with the book in their eyes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dwarven King Posted March 27, 2012 Report Share Posted March 27, 2012 [quote name='Yuzuru Otonashi' timestamp='1332875795' post='5891128'] And you can't read. I was saying people missed the statement where it said she was black, and that they weren't being racist on purpose for the msot part, it was jsut an inconsistency with the book in their eyes. [/quote] Your attempts at backing up your argument are feeble. It clearly said her skin was dark colored. If they can't see that when reading the books, then THEY are the ones who can't read. For the most part, they simply skipped over it, or failed to picture her as the book described her. There are racists people out there and you can't deny that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vairocana Posted March 27, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 27, 2012 [quote name='Yuzuru Otonashi' timestamp='1332875795' post='5891128'] And you can't read. I was saying people missed the statement where it said she was black, and that [b]they weren't being racist on purpose[/b] for the msot part, it was jsut an inconsistency with the book in their eyes. [/quote] That's what makes this so upsetting. [i]These people weren't being racist [b]on purpose[/b][/i]. But they were [i]still being racist[/i]. This highlights a really disturbing underlying cultural ideaology that still pervades America. THIS is why we can't say we live in a post-racial age. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admiral Tim Posted March 27, 2012 Report Share Posted March 27, 2012 [quote name='Vairocana' timestamp='1332822407' post='5890445'] It's worth noting because there is a depressing lack of female heroes in both fiction and cinema. And the ones that do make it in cinema are often portrayed as some sort of hyper-sexualized object of desire, instead of a well developed character. But, you see, the movie [i]was consistent with the book, and the fans were outraged because of it[/i]. What makes this so horrifying isn't that Rue was portrayed differently than they expected her to be, but that [i]her being black somehow invalidates their feelings of loss[/i]. Because black people's deaths aren't worth crying over, or something. [/quote] Tbh, I kinda pictured Rue as East Indian but.... OT: That's just plain annoying, i wanna kill those ignorant brats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catterjune Posted March 27, 2012 Report Share Posted March 27, 2012 [quote name='Yuzuru Otonashi' timestamp='1332822977' post='5890452'] Polaris knows that. He was saying that most of them were more concerned that they THOUGHT it was an inconsistency. [/quote] I think it's perfectly fine to be confused or something if the character in your head does not turn out to be the character on screen which is probably rather common for most book-to-film adaptation. But if you do find yourself confused, you shouldn't act like a twat about it like those teens did when they got on Twitter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blake Posted March 27, 2012 Report Share Posted March 27, 2012 [quote name='Dwarven King' timestamp='1332878440' post='5891172'] Your attempts at backing up your argument are feeble. It clearly said her skin was dark colored. If they can't see that when reading the books, then THEY are the ones who can't read. For the most part, they simply skipped over it, or failed to picture her as the book described her. There are racists people out there and you can't deny that. [/quote] Just like you did with my argument? I'm not even saying they're right, if you noticed. I'm just saying that MOST of them aren't doing anything to intentionally be assholes, they're just expressing distaste. The article chose some of the worst examples they could find and threw a few not-so-bad ones in to make it look better. [quote name='Vairocana' timestamp='1332880212' post='5891214'] That's what makes this so upsetting. [i]These people weren't being racist [b]on purpose[/b][/i]. But they were [i]still being racist[/i]. This highlights a really disturbing underlying cultural ideaology that still pervades America. THIS is why we can't say we live in a post-racial age. [/quote] I understand that, but the horrible truth is that we'll NEVER live in a post-racial age, sadly. Nowhere will be. This world is pretty much doomed to constantly hate one another. This should still be observed with a reason to change, and we should of course try to fix it, but... It'll never be completely fixed, and it's idealistic beyond belief. That doesn't mean stop trying, just don't set the bar too high, because there is no reasoning with some people, and even the most "tolerant" people have prejudices. [quote name='Hatcher' timestamp='1332881835' post='5891287'] I think it's perfectly fine to be confused or something if the character in your head does not turn out to be the character on screen which is probably rather common for most book-to-film adaptation. But if you do find yourself confused, you shouldn't act like a twat about it like those teens did when they got on Twitter. [/quote] >Implying I'm defending them In the modern era people run to the internet to bitch about things they don't like the moment it happens. Sad, but true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hydra of Ages Posted March 27, 2012 Report Share Posted March 27, 2012 [quote name='.Rai' timestamp='1332868196' post='5890953'] - It's ignorance based on cultural biases basically. Happens everywhere, is extremely annoying, and it will always stay here in society unfortunately. - Enraged fans who read the book stupidly and didn't realise Rue was black. [/quote] These two things have overlap. People read the book stupidly and fail to recognize the intended nationality of a character because their cultural biases have trained them to see protagonist characters in a certain way; ie, white. They wouldn't be surprised to see a character was black if they hadn't assumed they were otherwise for some reason. [quote name='Yuzuru Otonashi' timestamp='1332883126' post='5891349'] I'm not even saying they're right, if you noticed. I'm just saying that MOST of them aren't doing anything to intentionally be assholes, they're just expressing distaste. The article chose some of the worst examples they could find and threw a few not-so-bad ones in to make it look better. [/quote] "Expressing distaste" in a black protagonist character being black? I have no clue how you're trying to justify this; when is it ever acceptable to be disappointed in a character being of a certain nationality when the source material doesn't contradict it? Of course they showed the worst examples they could find, [i]it's a news article. [/i]You choose examples that are most representative of the problem or issue at hand, that's how reporting works. The fact that they're throwing the spotlight on obvious racists and drawing attention to them being terrible people is just a bonus. My point is that I don't think they have to be fair and balanced when talking about [i]people being racist. [/i]Even the least severe examples are a [i]little bit racist [/i]and deserve to be reprimanded, because that's just how this issue works. You don't whitewash characters without reason, and you don't get angry at people for correcting your whitewashing unless you hold that the nationality you've given them is important to their identity for some reason. [quote name='.Rai' timestamp='1332868196' post='5890953'] I understand that, but the horrible truth is that we'll NEVER live in a post-racial age, sadly. Nowhere will be. This world is pretty much doomed to constantly hate one another. This should still be observed with a reason to change, and we should of course try to fix it, but... It'll never be completely fixed, and it's idealistic beyond belief. That doesn't mean stop trying, just don't set the bar too high, because there is no reasoning with some people, and even the most "tolerant" people have prejudices. [/quote] This is a terrible argument, on par with [i]"we'll never totally get rid of cancer; ergo, we should stop pumping so much funding into looking for a cure!"[/i]. Explain this notion of 'not setting the bar too high' to me, because all I'm hearing from it is "Since racists will always exist, we should stop caring about people being racist". Yes, even the most tolerant people have prejudices -I'm not sure why you're using airquotes for tolerant- but most tolerant people don't immediately assume that a protagonist character is white and complain when proven wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vairocana Posted March 28, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 28, 2012 Hydra, I want to make sweet sweet love to you right now. OT: There's something a little bit ironic about this whole situation- normally Hollywood gets it [i]wrong[/i], and we deal with a whitewashed character that has fan backlash. Except, this time they actually got it [i]right[/i] and are facing fan whitewashing backlash. Hollywood has always worked under the general impression that viewers cannot empathize with a lead character unless the lead is white.....it's a sad day when the viewers actually confirm this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bury the year Posted March 28, 2012 Report Share Posted March 28, 2012 Isn't it also in the books suggested that District 11 (where Rue comes from) is supposed to be modeled after Civil War-era Deep South, with the hard agricultural life and little respect going around? If so, those who envisioned Rue as white are even more in the wrong: I'm pretty sure that Ms. Collins was trying to draw a thematic comparison, and having Rue any other skin color would defeat that purpose. That was the impression I got, at least. Plus, I think the actress that played Rue was cast perfectly, because she really does look innocent but still a bit steely like she was portrayed in the book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tentacruel Posted March 28, 2012 Report Share Posted March 28, 2012 Gaiz, not realizing she was black isn't racist, being upset by her skin color [i]is[/i]. So is it bad that I'm really amused by this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catterjune Posted March 28, 2012 Report Share Posted March 28, 2012 [quote name='Yuzuru Otonashi' timestamp='1332883126' post='5891349'] >Implying I'm defending them In the modern era people run to the internet to bitch about things they don't like the moment it happens. Sad, but true. [/quote] No one said you were. And while I know people complain about everything, it's what they're complaining about and why it offended them that is disheartening, not the fact that they complained. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clair Posted March 28, 2012 Report Share Posted March 28, 2012 It seems that, nowadays, there are people who will dig insanely deep just to find something offensive in the media. It's pretty depressing, tbh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~ P O L A R I S ~ Posted March 28, 2012 Report Share Posted March 28, 2012 [quote name='Vairocana' timestamp='1332880212' post='5891214'] That's what makes this so upsetting. [i]These people weren't being racist [b]on purpose[/b][/i]. But they were [i]still being racist[/i]. [/quote] Racism is a belief, not just an appearance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vairocana Posted March 28, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 28, 2012 [quote name='~ P O L A R I S ~' timestamp='1332901637' post='5891953'] Racism is a belief, not an appearance. [/quote] I'm...not quite sure what you mean by "appearance". However, I don't believe you need to actively believe in racial superiority to have racist perceptions or actions. It's the difference between the Klan member who thinks all blacks are filthy and the guy on twitter who feels emotionally gyped because Rue turned out to be black. Or to phrase it another way, you can subconciously buy into a belief/ideology. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~ P O L A R I S ~ Posted March 28, 2012 Report Share Posted March 28, 2012 [quote name='Vairocana' timestamp='1332901894' post='5891957'] I'm...not quite sure what you mean by "appearance". However, I don't believe you need to actively believe in racial superiority to have racist perceptions or actions. It's the difference between the Klan member who thinks all blacks are filthy and the guy on twitter who feels emotionally gyped because Rue turned out to be black. Or to phrase it another way, you can subconciously buy into a belief/ideology. [/quote] What I'm saying is that because we aren't mind-readers it isn't fair for us to assume that people are driven by the most despicable intentions when there's a reasonable possibility that they were motivated by something else. I believe it to be best policy with regards to avoiding misunderstandings and ultimately best policy in general to assume that people are driven by the best intentions where doubt exists. I feel as though I see people being demonized for having beliefs they don't actually have too often, even when they insist upon not having the beliefs attributed to them. Think about why people would deny any given label. It's either because they don't identify with it or because they do but feel as though they have too much to lose in being associated with it to admit to it. However, the latter case doesn't make sense for those who are labeled because of something they'd just posted or they wouldn't have posted it in the first place. This defeats the purpose of castigating people as racists solely based on their posts, because they're either going to be consistently okay with that label within the medium in which they're posting or consistently not, in which case they can't be identified as racists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lonk Posted March 28, 2012 Report Share Posted March 28, 2012 To be honest, this is just as hilarious as the spoiled teens for Christmas thread. Just because people missed that snippet of the book where Rue was Dark Skinned, it does not justify their ignorant and potentially offensive expressions on how she should have been cast as a caucasian. I'm not going to go ahead and say it is their fault for wanting a caucasian for that part, but rather it is the media's fault for normally potraying caucasians as likeable characters and convincing the standard public that this is the standard character for everything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Revan of the Sith Posted March 28, 2012 Report Share Posted March 28, 2012 Whether black or white the movie was great and I still feel it was better than the book. I could care less how loyal to the book it was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucifer the Wise Posted March 28, 2012 Report Share Posted March 28, 2012 Movie was great and so was the actress for Rue. They can complain all they want but it still makes no sense. I liked the movie. Funny thing is though... In the movie... Rue was black. Thresh was black. And most of District 11 was black. And when District 11 starts that riot after Rue dies- They get hosed by security guards. Anyone else find that funny? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vairocana Posted March 29, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 29, 2012 [quote name='Cronus' timestamp='1332964648' post='5892666'] Whether black or white the movie was great and I still feel it was better than the book. I could care less how loyal to the book it was. [/quote] Seriously, people who can't be bothered to read a page and a half long article that is literally the thesis of the topic, need to gtfo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Amazing Avian Posted March 30, 2012 Report Share Posted March 30, 2012 What is this? I don't even... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeal Ascendant Posted March 31, 2012 Report Share Posted March 31, 2012 Geez, not only are these people racist but they're also idiots. Rue and Thresh were both black in the book (Seriously, how could you miss that? I knew that without even needing to be reminded by the excerpts from the book in the article, and I read the books like a year ago), and the fact that they made Cinna black is a [i]good thing[/i]. These people just make me sick... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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