Time Seal

[Superdoopertrooper]

 

 

Let's hear your thoughts on it. Let's see if anyone can state why this card is mediocre.

 

[spoiler='Hint:']Compare it to Jar of Greed and Legacy of Yata-Garasu.[/spoiler]

[ihop]

I'd rather I drew 1 card and my opponent drew none than I drew 2 and my opponent drew one, this restricts what your opponent does too much. There's just no place for it in the game.

[mido9]

I'd rather I drew 1 card and my opponent drew none than I drew 2 and my opponent drew one, this restricts what your opponent does too much. There's just no place for it in the game.

Thing is, with how time seal is more or less useless on its own in helping any strategy, it's like drawing nothing at all too.

[Superdoopertrooper]

I'd rather I drew 1 card and my opponent drew none than I drew 2 and my opponent drew one, this restricts what your opponent does too much. There's just no place for it in the game.

 

And I'd rather draw a card that actually allows me to directly plus, or allow me to stop actual physical threats, or that combos with the rest of my deck than to draw this.

 

You're giving up a Draw Phase to draw this card, in order to make your opponent skip one of theirs, and at a delay. It takes 3 turns before this card can even 1-for-1. How is that not fair? Running the card actually disadvantages you because of that, because you basically just drew nothing and it's only good if your opponent uses 1-for-1 removal on it, in which case Jar and Legacy do virtually the same thing anyway.

 

You're right about one thing though: "There's just no place for it in the game", and that's because this card is just not worth running over other things and would see almost no play, regardless of the meta.

[Miror B]

It's only a winmoar card. That's the sole reason it shouldn't come back.

[Superdoopertrooper]

It's only a winmoar card. That's the sole reason it shouldn't come back.

 

You heard him guys, all winmoar cards to 0!!!1!!1!

[Toffee.]

It's only a winmoar card. That's the sole reason it shouldn't come back.

Pretty much :/
I mean, given the chance the Opponent can easily use up his whole hand, flipping this in that scenario would be absolutely crucial.

[Miror B]

You heard him guys, all winmoar cards to 0!!!1!!1!

You heard him guys! I'm an ass!

Back your argument up please -.-

[Jord200]

Yeah, this shouldn't come back anytime soon. Or ever for that matter.

[Superdoopertrooper]

Pretty much :/
I mean, given the chance the Opponent can easily use up his whole hand, flipping this in that scenario would be absolutely crucial.

 

I really want to use an insult here, but I'll refrain.

 

1. If someone uses up their whole hand, that's their damn fault.

 

2. Flipping this in that scenario wouldn't necessarily be crucial at all. They could still have a powerful field of monsters and/or backrow. And because the opponent used/has Time Seal, that's one less answer they could have had to help them overcome that field.

 

3. If a player is topdecking against an opponent who is in a good position and also has Time Seal, the player topdecking would have most likely lost anyway, and the player who did get into the better position was effectively handicapped the whole time because they could have been playing other cards which actually help them get into the winning position in the first place.

[Jord200]

I really want to use an insult here, but I'll refrain.

 

1. If someone uses up their whole hand, that's their damn fault.

 

2. Flipping this in that scenario wouldn't necessarily be crucial at all. They could still have a powerful field of monsters and/or backrow. And because the opponent used/has Time Seal, that's one less answer they could have had to help them overcome that field.

 

3. If a player is topdecking against an opponent who is in a good position and also has Time Seal, the player topdecking would have most likely lost anyway, and the player who did get into the better position was effectively handicapped the whole time because they could have been playing other cards which actually help them get into the winning position in the first place.

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P5iqYuFmzqg

[Miror B]

I really want to use an insult here, but I'll refrain.

 

1. If someone uses up their whole hand, that's their damn fault.

 

2. Flipping this in that scenario wouldn't necessarily be crucial at all. They could still have a powerful field of monsters and/or backrow. And because the opponent used/has Time Seal, that's one less answer they could have had to help them overcome that field.

 

3. If a player is topdecking against an opponent who is in a good position and also has Time Seal, the player topdecking would have most likely lost anyway, and the player who did get into the better position was effectively handicapped the whole time because they could have been playing other cards which actually help them get into the winning position in the first place.

1. Yes it is. That's not my argument.

 

2. No it might not be. That's not my argument at all.

 

3. Yes they would have. That's not my argument at all.

 

In fact I agree with you that Time Seal is absolute shit right now. Hell it could go to three and no fucks would be given from me. But let me tell you something else.

What situation is Time Seal used where it's not shit and not a win more play?

Its only combo is a loop that shouldn't exist even if inconsistent. It doesn't give you a small advantage at some cost. There's no skillful plays with it. It's either you're using it while you're in a dominant board state to better guarantee your win, or it sits there.

It's not a card that should stay banned because it's broken. It's a card that has no real reason to come back. Find me a deck that can run this without it being win more or inconsistent Tsuki loop and I'll change my mind.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P5iqYuFmzqg

I really don't get these posts either btw -.- then again I'm an ass.

[Expelsword]

It's chainable to MST for one. I'm sure people would abuse this with Mask of Darkness and Tsukuyomi, not only that, this doesn't destroy your opponent's resources, but PREVENTS their creation, which is more dangerous.

[Superdoopertrooper]

It's chainable to MST for one. I'm sure people would abuse this with Mask of Darkness and Tsukuyomi, not only that, this doesn't destroy your opponent's resources, but PREVENTS their creation, which is more dangerous.

 

12 replies in and we finally get the obligatory paranoid response involving the infamous Mask + Tsuk + Seal combo. Oh, and the "chainable to MST" one is a classic knee-slapper as well. 2 cliche'd fears in one go, I'm impressed.

[Miror B]

12 replies in and we finally get the obligatory paranoid response involving the infamous Mask + Tsuk + Seal combo. Oh, and the "chainable to MST" one is a classic knee-slapper as well. 2 cliche'd fears in one go, I'm impressed.

It's a valid paranoia because it's a dumb loop that really doesn't deserve to exist in the first place due to just sack :/

[Aerion Brightflame]

Yeah, this is just win more. Nothing else. If you're losing it's pointless, if you're winning it goes from being anywhere from mediocre to amazing.

 

It can come back, and not even because the meta won't run it, but because nothing will really. The lockdown is just to slow, and inconsistent to work.

[Agro]

It doesn't matter if you're giving up a card for it. It doesn't matter if it's a +0. It doesn't matter if you're "giving up a draw" for it. You're giving a -1 in order to stop your opponent from even attempting to make a move. Time Seal as a card simply rejects the idea of player interaction. That much is enough for me to leave it @0.

[Superdoopertrooper]

It doesn't matter if you're giving up a card for it. It doesn't matter if it's a +0. It doesn't matter if you're "giving up a draw" for it. You're giving a -1 in order to stop your opponent from even attempting to make a move. Time Seal as a card simply rejects the idea of player interaction. That much is enough for me to leave it @0.

 

We have to be honest with ourselves folks: Agro just has no idea what he's saying does he?

 

He even has his terminology and understanding of game concepts wrong, calling going -1 to prevent drawing a card during the draw phase "Stopping the opponent from even attempting a move". If that isn't the biggest load of sensationalist tripe I've ever heard..

[ihop]

We have to be honest with ourselves folks: Agro just has no idea what he's saying does he?

 

He even has his terminology and understanding of game concepts wrong, calling going -1 to prevent drawing a card during the draw phase "Stopping the opponent from even attempting a move". If that isn't the biggest load of sensationalist tripe I've ever heard..

 

Well you've really excelled yourself this time haven't you? Agro's right, this thing has no place in the game, it's not a card that makes the game more enjoyable to play, it's not good card design and therefore shouldn't be legal.

[Aerion Brightflame]

We have to be honest with ourselves folks: Agro just has no idea what he's saying does he?

 

He even has his terminology and understanding of game concepts wrong, calling going -1 to prevent drawing a card during the draw phase "Stopping the opponent from even attempting a move". If that isn't the biggest load of sensationalist tripe I've ever heard..

 

Surely it's not a big logic step to think he's refering to the card at it's most extreme. I.e. top decking time. 

 

And he has a point, it doesn't increase player interaction. Which in many people's view is enough to see it stay at 0, despite it being able to come back into the game. However, just because something can, doesn't mean it should.

[Miror B]

We have to be honest with ourselves folks: Agro just has no idea what he's saying does he?

 

He even has his terminology and understanding of game concepts wrong, calling going -1 to prevent drawing a card during the draw phase "Stopping the opponent from even attempting a move". If that isn't the biggest load of sensationalist tripe I've ever heard..

You still haven't answered me what decks would use this where it isn't win more or loop.

[Superdoopertrooper]

Surely it's not a big logic step to think he's refering to the card at it's most extreme. I.e. top decking time. 

 

And he has a point, it doesn't increase player interaction. Which in many people's view is enough to see it stay at 0, despite it being able to come back into the game. However, just because something can, doesn't mean it should.

 

What's this dumb obsession with the phrase "player interaction" on this site? It's like a catch phrase that you try to apply to literally everything no matter how invalid it may be. Does Jar of Greed "increase player interaction"? No. Does that mean it should be banned? No. Neither Time Seal nor Jar of Greed have much to do with "player interaction" at all, outside of allowing its user to sometimes capitalize on reckless blind 1-for-1 destruction the opponent attempts. They are both neutral towards this concept, Jar gives itself up to draw another card, Seal gives itself up to prevent a card being draw. Both virtually do the same thing, just in a slightly different way. Neither are problematic for the same reason.

[Captain Murphy ☆]

We have to be honest with ourselves folks: Agro just has no idea what he's saying does he?

 

He even has his terminology and understanding of game concepts wrong, calling going -1 to prevent drawing a card during the draw phase "Stopping the opponent from even attempting a move". If that isn't the biggest load of sensationalist tripe I've ever heard..

 

...

 

Anyway, This card should stay banned. It wouldn't be fun :(

[Agro]

What's this dumb obsession with the phrase "player interaction" on this site?

Player interaction.

You know, the point of a two-player game.

For two players to interact with each other.

Like in Yugioh. So yes, I am QUITE curious as to why we make such a big deal about cards that are detrimental to player interaction on this site. Truly a logical question that isn't blatantly obvious.

Jar of Greed and Time Seal both do not increase player interaction, no. But one of those two restricts it. Which is stupid. Time Seal isn't neutral in that regard. Like, at all.

Time Seal doesn't even try to achieve a purpose like Jar of Greed does. As Miror said, it's either winmoar or looped to stop your opponent from making a play. Neither of which are good for Yugioh, which, again, I'll remind you in case you forgot, is a two player game. Jar of Greed, while not increasing player interaction, doesn't decreases it like Time Seal does, and more importantly, it tries to achieve a deck goal. That being trying to reach a certain card in your deck faster. It may not be highly interactive, but it's far from detrimental.

[Aerion Brightflame]

What's this dumb obsession with the phrase "player interaction" on this site? It's like a catch phrase that you try to apply to literally everything no matter how invalid it may be. Does Jar of Greed "increase player interaction"? No. Does that mean it should be banned? No. Neither Time Seal nor Jar of Greed have much to do with "player interaction" at all, outside of allowing its user to sometimes capitalize on reckless blind 1-for-1 destruction the opponent attempts. They are both neutral towards this concept, Jar gives itself up to draw another card, Seal gives itself up to prevent a card being draw. Both virtually do the same thing, just in a slightly different way. Neither are problematic for the same reason.

 

Because Solitare decks are boring to play against. That's all, we like feeling like doing more than sitting there watching your opponent plays. And Jar of Greed increase interaction, because it gives you a card. A card through which you can interact with the opponent. Where as Time Seal instead can remove any interaction, by denying cards through which to do that. I admit it's sketchy logic at best, but it's enough of a distinction for most people here.