Sort-of-mana-system for YGO... kind of format.

[Sleepy]

What the tittle says.

It's a mixture between MTG mana and Naruto TCG's chakra system like Kaijudo/Duel Masters.

This one is mostly for IRL use since I don't think it's likely that DN will grow a new space for the mana.

 

Starting hand = 6 cards (instead of the usual 5)

 

What Mana is:

You now need to pay mana in order to perform certain actions.

Mana is placed in any space you want outside of the game zones.

Pretty much wherever you want where you can make it work for you.

There is no limit for the mana you want to have in your Mana Zone.

 

Mana can be any card of your Deck.

The Type/Attribute of a monster used is the "color" of the Mana. Spell/Trap Cards are colorless.

 

How Mana works:

To use it, you just need to tap it. Then it'll stay tapped until the end of your next Standby Phase.

Each player can only place 1 mana per turn in his/her Mana Zone.

Cards you choose to be Mana, will remain there for the rest of the Duel.

 

Cards that can change Types or Attributes as part of their effect, can activate their effect to affect their Mana color.

 

 

Losing/Gaining  Mana:

 

 

A player that self-inflicted Effect Damage can choose 1 of his/her own Mana, and get rid of it instead of taking the Effect Damage.

The lost Mana can either be placed it in the top or bottom of the Deck or shuffled into it.

 

When a player gains Life Points, they can place 1 Mana from the top of their Deck into the Mana Zone instead of the Life Gain. If Mana is gained this way, that player cannot put Mana in their Mana Zone regularly that turn.

 

Mana Stun:

 

When a player inflicts Effect Damage to a player(s), he/she can instead, tap 1 of that player(s) Mana, which will not untap during the next time it should.

 

Mana Costs:

To Normal Summon or Special Summon a monster, the mana pay must include at least 1 mana of the same color (Type or Attribute) as the monster, 

To Set a monster, you pay the same amount, but you do not need to worry about the color of mana you use.

 

Spell/Trap Cards just need you to pay the number, since they don't have a specific color.

 

Ritual = 1 mana

Counter/Continuous/Equip = 2 mana

Quick-Play/Normal = 3 mana

 

Monsters: Mana pay = Tributes/materials + 1

Attacking = 1 mana

Activating ignition effects = 1 mana

Trigger effects that are optional = 1 mana

 

Other costs like Tributing monsters, paying Life Points, discarding, etc. and conditions are still applied.

 

Ditching the Mana Costs:

It is important to note that only your voluntary actions cost mana.

 

If you activate any effect that Special Summons, like Monster Reborn, the card's cost must be payed. Though, you won't pay for the monster's Summon regardless of what it is.

 

Mandatory and Continuous effects also are free from the payment.

[Toffee.]

Suddenly Yugioh becomes Duel Masters.
Heh...

[Sleepy]

Suddenly Yugioh becomes Duel Masters.
Heh...

Is that how Duel Masters work? xD
The only thing I know about the game is that it's life is 5 shields + 1 direct attack. And that there's this reincarnation called Kaijudo, which I've been sort of curious about.

[D.A._Sakuyamon]

Sounds like this would actually be even slower then my format. O.o

[Sleepy]

Sounds like this would actually be even slower then my format. O.o

Is that good or bad? xD

[Strider Tigerwolf]

MtG Yugo = lol. I wouldn't mind trying this, but I want to know a bit more about this:

 

"Monsters: Mana pay = Tributes/materials + 1"

 

Does this mean that instead of "Tributing" or using "materials", we pay the "Mana cost". Such as:

 

X Monarch monster = 2 Mana of its color (1 Tribute + 1 Mana)

Tyrant Dragon/BEWD = 3 Mana of its color (2 Tributes + 1 Mana)

 

but what about Synchros?

 

ex

Stardust Dragon = 3+ Mana of its color (2+ Synchro Materials + 1 Mana)?

 

How would this work?

[D.A._Sakuyamon]

MtG Yugo = lol. I wouldn't mind trying this, but I want to know a bit more about this:

 

"Monsters: Mana pay = Tributes/materials + 1"

 

Does this mean that instead of "Tributing" or using "materials", we pay the "Mana cost". Such as:

 

X Monarch monster = 2 Mana of its color (1 Tribute + 1 Mana)

Tyrant Dragon/BEWD = 3 Mana of its color (2 Tributes + 1 Mana)

 

but what about Synchros?

 

ex

Stardust Dragon = 3+ Mana of its color (2+ Synchro Materials + 1 Mana)?

 

How would this work?

I think its a payment for the action to do so.

 

 

Is that good or bad? xD

Both

[Sleepy]

MtG Yugo = lol. I wouldn't mind trying this, but I want to know a bit more about this:

 

"Monsters: Mana pay = Tributes/materials + 1"

 

Does this mean that instead of "Tributing" or using "materials", we pay the "Mana cost". Such as:

 

X Monarch monster = 2 Mana of its color (1 Tribute + 1 Mana)

Tyrant Dragon/BEWD = 3 Mana of its color (2 Tributes + 1 Mana)

 

but what about Synchros?

 

ex

Stardust Dragon = 3+ Mana of its color (2+ Synchro Materials + 1 Mana)?

 

How would this work?

If you want to Tribute Summon Blue-Eyes, you have to pay 3 mana (number of Tributes +1) but you still need to Tribute for them as you normally would.

If you Summon Beast King Barbaros, it really depends on the number of Tributes you want to Summon it with.

 

For Xyz/Fusion/Synchro, just substitute the word "Tribute" with "material" and everything else is pretty much the same.

Mist Wurm needs at least 4 mana. Stardust at least 3.

 

In addition, Blue-Eyes wants at least 1 of those mana to be LIGHT, and Stardust at least 1 to be WIND.

Which is a bit under consideration, because .... well, it just sounds like a sort of iffy idea.

 

 

I think its a payment for the action to do so.

 

 

Both

Though, this format is really just slow early game. If players have no problems with lands in MTG, these are lands that are not dead draws, which might be better or worse for the game, but at the very least I can guarantee you should be able to do stuff past a certain point.

[Strider Tigerwolf]

In addition, Blue-Eyes wants at least 1 of those mana to be LIGHT, and Stardust at least 1 to be WIND.

Which is a bit under consideration, because .... well, it just sounds like a sort of iffy idea.

Actually that might actually put a few limits to certain decks which can be nice. However, due needing excess mana to play these cards, one might find them-self playing with 50-60 card decks instead of the norm 40. I'll make a deck in a bit and want to play this format :o

[Cute Rotten Yoshika]

i feel like counter needing the least and quick-plays and normals needing the most isnt going to end well as most decks are gonna be locked out of a majority of their moves except for decks specifically built to skirt the issue (like worms).

[Sleepy]

i feel like counter needing the least and quick-plays and normals needing the most isnt going to end well as most decks are gonna be locked out of a majority of their moves except for decks specifically built to skirt the issue (like worms).

I do admit, I was kinda biased by what Icons are currently less relevant. I don't think the cost for Normals and Quick Plays is bad, but the Counters might not be the best idea.

 

How much do you suggest I should I up the cost?

 

 

 

Actually that might actually put a few limits to certain decks which can be nice. However, due needing excess mana to play these cards, one might find them-self playing with 50-60 card decks instead of the norm 40. I'll make a deck in a bit and want to play this format :o

 

Yeah, 40 decks are gonna lose by deckout here.

I wish I could make a tournament or something based on this one, but the place for the Mana Zone is the problem.

Can banished cards be flipped face-down while banished? if so, with some restrictions, I think at least a test could be made.

It also sounds like a pain to keep flipping up and down all that mana through DN's system xD

[Cute Rotten Yoshika]

I do admit, I was kinda biased by what Icons are currently less relevant. I don't think the cost for Normals and Quick Plays is bad, but the Counters might not be the best idea.

 

How much do you suggest I should I up the cost?

 

i honestly think you should reverse the costs. normals and quickplays being at 4 is incredibly bad because thats the most common type of s/t. most decks dont run any other types except for a small amount of counters (the solemn duo) so making their most likely option the most expensive drastically limits what they can do for the first several turns. also considering a deck that goes in the opposite direction, packing their deck with loads of counter traps, theyll be much harder to stop because counter traps are either turn. meaning it costs 4x as much for their opponent to attempt to make a move as it does for them to prevent it. that is wildly awful and is going to turn every single deck into set 5 & pass, because no other deck can be consistently successful in that environment.

[Sleepy]

i honestly think you should reverse the costs. normals and quickplays being at 4 is incredibly bad because thats the most common type of s/t. most decks dont run any other types except for a small amount of counters (the solemn duo) so making their most likely option the most expensive drastically limits what they can do for the first several turns. also considering a deck that goes in the opposite direction, packing their deck with loads of counter traps, theyll be much harder to stop because counter traps are either turn. meaning it costs 4x as much for their opponent to attempt to make a move as it does for them to prevent it. that is wildly awful and is going to turn every single deck into set 5 & pass, because no other deck can be consistently successful in that environment.

Now that you mention it, yeah, I guess by the nature of Counters, they can afford to cost more and be able to pay for themselves by the time they get to be used. I'll move them to the place where currenly Normals are.

 

As for Normals and Quick-Plays, I'll slide everything down by one to fill the spaces Counter had. It'll make them a little less expensive than before, and definitely less expensive than Counters.

Spells will be the center of speed if they go to 1, and by turn 3, non-Spellbook Decks will do as they please with them, making it hardly matter.

 

It'll be a test.

[Strider Tigerwolf]

Actually Sleepy, mock the MtG style of mana costs in relevance to yugioh cards.

 

Originally:

Counter = 1 mana

Field/Ritual = 2 mana

Continuous/Equip = 3 mana

Quick-Play/Normal = 4 mana

 

What should've been done (from MtG stand point):

 

Ritual = 1 Mana

Field/Counter/Continuous = 2 Mana

Quick-Play/Normal = 3 Mana

 

Why?

 

Ritual monsters will also need to pay the cost for their Ritual Monster (tributes + 1 mana + Ritual Spell activation). Therefore, as a result, should be the least to use up mana as to make them playable.

 

Fields, Continuous and Counters all fall into control categories, but of a decent-to-lesser extent. Fields affect the board through forms of advantage, same with continuous. Counters, however, allow for balanced game play by restricting what your opponent plays or not and by consequence slows the game down. Counters should be viable since they promote thinking instead of derping.

 

Normals and Quick-Plays as the highest mana count because of the way they can alternate the game state. A few examples are cards like Monster Reborn, Forbidden Lance, MST, etc. These being moved to the highest mana count makes for quality control and restricts their use from sudden destruction to a more passive thought process. Now you have to time that MST, Lance, Reborn, etc so that you can get the most of it instead of just dropping and popping.

 

Least that's my reasoning towards the mana system.

[Sleepy]

I'll follow that one. It sounds like a reasonable measure. =0

Selecting how much mana to pay is the hardest thing for me here xD

 

*goes edit*

 

EDIT:
Ready.

Also, I couldn't help but notice you didn't label Equips, but I'll leave them as they are for the mean time.

[Strider Tigerwolf]

My bad XD Equips currently go with Field/Continuous/Counters.

[Sleepy]

I also just thought of an idea.

Maybe making it able to use banned cards, but because of their status, greatly increasing their mana cost in exchange.

I'm debating wether that'd be alright or not. It's not like banned cards really apport much to the game anyways, but it could be fun.

 

 

 

Also, what do you people think of the way of gathering/losing mana?

I'm sure many read this before I added that section.

[Strider Tigerwolf]

Some cards (in mind) that could come back:

 

Sinister Serpent (you'll have to pay the mana cost to add)

Trap Dustshot (It's now a balanced MtG replica (forgot the name of the card though))

Sangan

Future Fusion (This is mass mana/mass profit since you have to pay monster costs now)

Magician of Faith

 

and...those are just a few at the top of my head.

 

OH! And Pot of Greed.

[Sleepy]

Yeah I was mainly thinking Pot of Greed. With the mana taking up advantage every turn, some might need it.

 

Tour Guide costs 1 DARK mana to play. While Deep Sea Diva costs 1 WATER mana.

aren't they cheap?

Them being optional effects is supposed to cost another mana in my head, which I think I forgot to add to the OP.

[Strider Tigerwolf]

Actually, Tour Guide...from what I understand, costs 1 DARK Mana for the Summon, 1 Mana for its effect, and then the Monster Being Summoned costs 1 Mana of its color.

 

So...it actually is balanced. Same with Diva.

Here's a List of the Banned cards that could see play in your format:

 

Cyber Jar

Dark Magician of Chaos

Destiny HERO - Disk Commander

Fishborg Blaster

Glow-Up Bulb

Magician of Faith

Mind Master

Rescue Cat

Sangan

Sinister Serpent

Substitoad

Witch of the Black Forest (wow)

Brionac, Dragon of the Ice Barrier

Trishula, Dragon of the Ice Barrier (Still debating this one...but...)

Wind-up Carrier Zenmaity

Butterfly Dagger - Elma

Cold Wave? (Also Debating)

Future Fusion

Giant Trunade? (It's only going to be either Cold Wave or this...not both)\

Graceful Charity

Metamorphosis

Pot of Greed

Premature Burial? (It's a cheaper Monster Reborn....)

Royal Oppression?

[Sleepy]

Actually, Tour Guide...from what I understand, costs 1 DARK Mana for the Summon, 1 Mana for its effect, and then the Monster Being Summoned costs 1 Mana of its color.

 

So...it actually is balanced. Same with Diva.

Here's a List of the Banned cards that could see play in your format:

 

Cyber Jar

Dark Magician of Chaos

Destiny HERO - Disk Commander

Fishborg Blaster

Glow-Up Bulb

Magician of Faith

Mind Master

Rescue Cat

Sangan

Sinister Serpent

Substitoad

Witch of the Black Forest (wow)

Brionac, Dragon of the Ice Barrier

Trishula, Dragon of the Ice Barrier (Still debating this one...but...)

Wind-up Carrier Zenmaity

Butterfly Dagger - Elma

Cold Wave? (Also Debating)

Future Fusion

Giant Trunade? (It's only going to be either Cold Wave or this...not both)\

Graceful Charity

Metamorphosis

Pot of Greed

Premature Burial? (It's a cheaper Monster Reborn....)

Royal Oppression?

No, well. You are correct until the last bit of the effect.

The cost is just to activate the card/effect. Once you do, whatever it does won't cost you. As in, Monster Reborn doesn't require you to pay for the revived monster too. Sangan will be dropped on it's own after the 2 mana pay for Tour Guide.

 

Maybe I should make it the way you imagine it?

I admit. It'd prevent cheapness.

[Strider Tigerwolf]

Hmm, no, keep it like you intend it to. 2 Mana for 2 monsters is actually fair. Especially since Xyzing with them or Synchroing will take additional mana to do.

 

Ex.

 

Tour Guide + Effect = 2 Mana.

Xyz Into Rank 3 = 3 Mana

We've expended quite some mana just for 1 Xyz Monster.

 

Same with Diva.

[Sleepy]

I tried testing my Heraldic Beast build as is and, well, regardless of passing time, it still is incredibly slow.

It's almost refreshing that I have Dragon Ravine, a Leo ready to discard, a Leviair ready for Tour Guide Summoning, a Unicorn ready to revive Number 8, and an Advanced Heraldry Arts ready to make me something else, and I can only activate 1 of them that turn.

 

The issue I got in the test is, I wanted to see how much multi-Attribute builds are bothered by it. In the end result, there was no way for me to Summon Tour Guide as the only DARK of the build. Or course, my build is made for IRL format, but still...

 

I was thinking about making it possible to go around that "color restriction" making it so that, from the original mana cost, either:

-Not using the right color mana will cost you 1 extra mana

-Using it with the right color mana will cost you 1 less mana

 

I'm inclining more towards the second one because it IS kind of an expensive mechanic as is.

 

 

 

Opinions?

[Mysty]

I tried testing my Heraldic Beast build as is and, well, regardless of passing time, it still is incredibly slow.

It's almost refreshing that I have Dragon Ravine, a Leo ready to discard, a Leviair ready for Tour Guide Summoning, a Unicorn ready to revive Number 8, and an Advanced Heraldry Arts ready to make me something else, and I can only activate 1 of them that turn.

 

The issue I got in the test is, I wanted to see how much multi-Attribute builds are bothered by it. In the end result, there was no way for me to Summon Tour Guide as the only DARK of the build. Or course, my build is made for IRL format, but still...

 

I was thinking about making it possible to go around that "color restriction" making it so that, from the original mana cost, either:

-Not using the right color mana will cost you 1 extra mana

-Using it with the right color mana will cost you 1 less mana

 

I'm inclining more towards the second one because it IS kind of an expensive mechanic as is.

 

 

 

Opinions?

@bolded: Do remember that many people will build around these rules rather than take a deck they had before and just use that deck.
I actually like the consequence of the bolded. It means you can't just tech in 2 Tour Guides into a non-DARK deck.

[Sleepy]

@bolded: Do remember that many people will build around these rules rather than take a deck they had before and just use that deck.
I actually like the consequence of the bolded. It means you can't just tech in 2 Tour Guides into a non-DARK deck.

That is true.

What mainly made me think about it is the idea of something like Wind-Ups trying to match it. They were made to play as an archetype, but are not unusable.

Well, they could still find ways around it, thinking about it.