What If List (Shien?)

[Zeppeli Gyro Supreme]

For those who don't understand what they've read: This is not a real ban list. I just decided to post up some of the suggestions people have made as for a ban list, as well as some of my own ideas. Please discuss.

 

 

I. Forbidden Cards

 

You cannot use these cards in your Deck or Side Deck:

 

BLACK LUSTER SOLDIER - ENVOY OF THE BEGINNING

BREAKER THE MAGICAL WARRIOR

BUTTERFLY DAGGER - ELMA

CALL OF THE HAUNTED

CHANGE OF HEART

CHAOS EMPEROR DRAGON - ENVOY OF THE END

CHAOS SORCERER

CONFISCATION

CYBER JAR

CYBER-STEIN

DARK ARMED DRAGON

DARK HOLE

DARK MAGICIAN OF CHAOS

DELINQUENT DUO

DIMENSION FUSION

EXCHANGE OF THE SPIRIT

FIBER JAR

HARPIE'S FEATHER DUSTER

IMPERIAL ORDER

LAST TURN

LAST WILL

MAGICAL EXPLOSION

MAGICAL SCIENTIST

MAGICIAN OF FAITH

MAKYURA THE DESTRUCTOR

METAMORPHOSIS

MIRAGE OF NIGHTMARE

PAINFUL CHOICE

POT OF GREED

RAIGEKI

RING OF DESTRUCTION

SINISTER SERPENT

SNATCH STEAL

THE FORCEFUL SENTRY

THOUSAND-EYES RESTRICT

TIME SEAL

TRIBE-INFECTING VIRUS

TSUKUYOMI

WITCH OF THE BLACK FOREST

YATA-GARASU

 

NEW! - Dimension Fusion, Dark Armed Dragon, Dark Magician of Chaos, Magical Explosion

 

 

II. Limited Cards

 

You can ONLY use one of the following cards in the Deck & Side Deck combined:

 

BRAIN CONTROL

CARD DESTRUCTION

CARD TROOPER

CEASEFIRE

CHAIN STRIKE

CRUSH CARD VIRUS

D. D. WARRIOR LADY

DARK MAGICIAN OF CHAOS

DESTINY HERO - DISK COMMANDER

ELEMENTAL HERO STRATOS

EXODIA THE FORBIDDEN ONE

FISSURE

FUTURE FUSION

GIANT TRUNADE

GOLD SARCOPHAGUS

GRAVITY BIND

GREAT SHOGUN SHIEN

GREEN BABOON, DEFENDER OF THE FOREST

HEAVY STORM

LEFT ARM OF THE FORBIDDEN ONE

LEFT LEG OF THE FORBIDDEN ONE

LEVEL LIMIT - AREA B

LIMITER REMOVAL

MAGIC CYLINDER

MARSHMALLON

MEGAMORPH

MIND CRUSH

MIRROR FORCE

MONSTER REBORN

MORPHING JAR

MYSTICAL SPACE TYPHOON

NEO-SPACIAN GRAND MOLE

NIGHT ASSAILANT

NOBLEMAN OF CROSSOUT

OJAMA TRIO

OVERLOAD FUSION

PREMATURE BURIAL

RAIZA THE STORM MONARCH

RIGHT ARM OF THE FORBIDDEN ONE

RIGHT LEG OF THE FORBIDDEN ONE

SANGAN

SCAPEGOAT

SMASHING GROUND

SNIPE HUNTER

SPIRIT REAPER

SWORDS OF REVEALING LIGHT

THE TRANSMIGRATION PROPHECY

TORRENTIAL TRIBUTE

TRAP DUSTSHOOT

TREEBORN FROG

TWIN-HEADED BEHEMOTH

ULTIMATE OFFERING

UNITED WE STAND

VICTORY DRAGON

WALL OF REVEALING LIGHT

 

NEW! - Great Shogun Shien, Victory Dragon

 

 

III. Semi-Limited Cards

 

You can ONLY use two of the following cards in the Deck & Side Deck combined:

 

BOOK OF MOON

CARD OF SAFE RETURN

CYBER DRAGON

DESTINY HERO - MALICIOUS

FOOLISH BURIAL

LIGHT AND DARKNESS DRAGON

MAGE POWER

MAGICAL STONE EXCAVATION

MANTICORE OF DARKNESS

MASK OF DARKNESS

NECROFACE

REINFORCEMENT OF THE ARMY

ROYAL DECREE

 

NEW!- Card of Safe Return

 

NEW! - The following cards are no longer Limited: Advanced Ritual Art, Magical Stone Excavation

[CrabHelmet]

The three cards you banned are all correct, and the one card you semi-limited is a step in the right direction, but still not quite right. The three cards you limited defy all logic. The cards that you unlimited are also correct.

[Guest PikaPerson01]

Lol, still a terrible list.

 

Unlimit Smasing and Fissure. Unlimit MST. Unlimit DDWL.

 

Ban Frog. Ban Monster Reborn. Ban Graceful Charity.

 

And that's just off the top of my head, barely skimming the list.

[Guest Chaos Pudding]

Things it got right: Banning DAD, DMoC, Dimension Fusion.

 

Things it got wrong: Too many to name.

[WindupRabbitFan14]

I'd get Manticore Limited it bugs me so much

[RedSceptile]

The bans are good.

 

The semi is getting better. The limits are horrible.

[CrabHelmet]

The bans are good.

 

The semi is getting better. The limits are horrible.

 

This is exactly what I said.

[Axiom_Nor]

^Agreed

 

DAD needs banning.

DMoC is overabused.

same w/ dimmension fusion.

 

Limits make no sense whatsoever.

[Zeppeli Gyro Supreme]

Shien is there because I noticed him being ran in 3's and decks using it winning a lot in tourneys. Being able to only play 1 card at a time destroys combo plays and original ideas. And it also makes it a lot harder to defend yourself once your opponent summons a Samurai, Granmaster, and him. Six Sams already have anti-destruction mechanisms. They don't need to make it impossible to clean away their brutes.

 

Graceful I sort of just flipped a coin on xD

 

But for Victory Dragon, I decided Dragons didn't have enough support and this card wasn't really too popular anyway, so what's the point?

[b7hamma]

Thank you, I missed Demise SO MUCH.

[RedSceptile]

Victory Dragon wins tourneys. Not games. Tourneys.

 

You hurt a card (Shien) that is actually making the format better (somewhat) the ability to slow down DAD, DDT, and Explosion is a good thing.

[Zeppeli Gyro Supreme]

Thank you' date=' I missed Demise SO MUCH.

[/quote']

I showed it to you guys for that reason. Once we realize what cards to take out now, we can decide which cards would probably replace them.

 

I was actually thinking about weakening Demise while I was writing this list out, but like I said above.

[CrabHelmet]

Shien is there because I noticed him being ran in 3's and decks using it winning a lot in tourneys. Being able to only play 1 card at a time destroys combo plays and original ideas. And it also makes it a lot harder to defend yourself once your opponent summons a Samurai' date=' Granmaster, and him. Six Sams already have anti-destruction mechanisms. They don't need to make it impossible to clean away their brutes.

[/quote']

 

Six Samurai have no anti-destruction mechanisms other than Solemn Judgment, which isn't exclusive to them. Limiting a card because people use it is Konami logic. There's enough removal in the game that he can't shut things down for long anyhow.

 

Graceful I sort of just flipped a coin on xD

 

That makes no sense at all.

 

But for Victory Dragon' date=' I decided Dragons didn't have enough support and this card wasn't really too popular anyway, so what's the point?

[/quote']

 

The reason nobody uses it is that it's banned. Nobody deserves to lose an entire Match in the first duel.

[Guest PikaPerson01]

Graceful I sort of just flipped a coin on xD

 

Yeah, you really put thought into your banlist. [/sarcasm]

 

But for Victory Dragon, I decided Dragons didn't have enough support and this card wasn't really too popular anyway, so what's the point?

 

A match should be played out all the way. No one wants to be luck sac'd into a defeat.

[Zeppeli Gyro Supreme]

Shien is there because I noticed him being ran in 3's and decks using it winning a lot in tourneys. Being able to only play 1 card at a time destroys combo plays and original ideas. And it also makes it a lot harder to defend yourself once your opponent summons a Samurai' date=' Granmaster, and him. Six Sams already have anti-destruction mechanisms. They don't need to make it impossible to clean away their brutes.

[/quote']

 

Six Samurai have no anti-destruction mechanisms other than Solemn Judgment, which isn't exclusive to them. Limiting a card because people use it is Konami logic. There's enough removal in the game that he can't shut things down for long anyhow.

 

Graceful I sort of just flipped a coin on xD

 

That makes no sense at all.

 

But for Victory Dragon' date=' I decided Dragons didn't have enough support and this card wasn't really too popular anyway, so what's the point?

[/quote']

 

The reason nobody uses it is that it's banned. Nobody deserves to lose an entire Match in the first duel.

They can destroy others instead of themselves. And especially in Shien's case, that's not nice at all.

 

I removed it because, like I said, it was just a flip. And I was actually half asleep when writing the limited, while it was just a moment ago I wrote in Card.

 

As for Victory Dragon, I see what you mean, but I'll leave it on there right now for people to discuss. After all, this was for discussion.

[CrabHelmet]

Shien is there because I noticed him being ran in 3's and decks using it winning a lot in tourneys. Being able to only play 1 card at a time destroys combo plays and original ideas. And it also makes it a lot harder to defend yourself once your opponent summons a Samurai' date=' Granmaster, and him. Six Sams already have anti-destruction mechanisms. They don't need to make it impossible to clean away their brutes.

[/quote']

 

Six Samurai have no anti-destruction mechanisms other than Solemn Judgment, which isn't exclusive to them. Limiting a card because people use it is Konami logic. There's enough removal in the game that he can't shut things down for long anyhow.

 

Graceful I sort of just flipped a coin on xD

 

That makes no sense at all.

 

But for Victory Dragon' date=' I decided Dragons didn't have enough support and this card wasn't really too popular anyway, so what's the point?

[/quote']

 

The reason nobody uses it is that it's banned. Nobody deserves to lose an entire Match in the first duel.

They can destroy others instead of themselves. And especially in Shien's case, that's not nice at all.

 

I removed it because, like I said, it was just a flip. And I was actually half asleep when writing the limited, while it was just a moment ago I wrote in Card.

 

As for Victory Dragon, I see what you mean, but I'll leave it on there right now for people to discuss. After all, this was for discussion.

 

Six Samurai's anti-destruction effect doesn't generate any advantage, and is useless against mass removal. Shien happens to be one of the only current defenses against decks like DDT.

[RedSceptile]

Victory Dragon wins tourneys. Not games. Tourneys.

 

You hurt a card (Shien) that is actually making the format better (somewhat) the ability to slow down DAD' date=' DDT, and Explosion is a good thing.

[/quote']

[Zeppeli Gyro Supreme]

Shien is there because I noticed him being ran in 3's and decks using it winning a lot in tourneys. Being able to only play 1 card at a time destroys combo plays and original ideas. And it also makes it a lot harder to defend yourself once your opponent summons a Samurai' date=' Granmaster, and him. Six Sams already have anti-destruction mechanisms. They don't need to make it impossible to clean away their brutes.

[/quote']

 

Six Samurai have no anti-destruction mechanisms other than Solemn Judgment, which isn't exclusive to them. Limiting a card because people use it is Konami logic. There's enough removal in the game that he can't shut things down for long anyhow.

 

Graceful I sort of just flipped a coin on xD

 

That makes no sense at all.

 

But for Victory Dragon' date=' I decided Dragons didn't have enough support and this card wasn't really too popular anyway, so what's the point?

[/quote']

 

The reason nobody uses it is that it's banned. Nobody deserves to lose an entire Match in the first duel.

They can destroy others instead of themselves. And especially in Shien's case, that's not nice at all.

 

I removed it because, like I said, it was just a flip. And I was actually half asleep when writing the limited, while it was just a moment ago I wrote in Card.

 

As for Victory Dragon, I see what you mean, but I'll leave it on there right now for people to discuss. After all, this was for discussion.

 

Six Samurai's anti-destruction effect doesn't generate any advantage, and is useless against mass removal. Shien happens to be one of the only current defenses against decks like DDT.

DDT doesn't exist nearly as well in this list, so there is no reason to bring that up.

 

And as I said, Shien's effect is brutal. You slap a Samurai, summon Grandmaster, and then Shien. Then what happens? Your opponent activates a Spell or Trap Card to destroy Shien? Your opponent switches the target to another Samurai, and then they lose their S/T for the turn. They'd need to summon to the field a 2100 ATK monster, and another, 2400 ATK monster to even match that field then. That's three cards wasted in one turn because of an easy summon.

[Guest PikaPerson01]

Also, lol at Graceful ever coming off the Banlist. Dark World, Disk Commander, Dump + Revive, Malicious, Dasher, Zombies, Treeborn Frog, and that's just off the top of my head.

 

Next time you make a banlist, don't be foolish enough to decide a card's legality on the flip of a coin. Actually... you know... think!

[Gravitize Me Cap'n!]

Vortex/Warrior Elimination/Kinetic Soldier.

[Zeppeli Gyro Supreme]

Also' date=' lol at Graceful ever coming off the Banlist. Dark World, Disk Commander, Dump + Revive, Malicious, Dasher, Zombies, Treeborn Frog, and that's just off the top of my head.

 

Next time you make a banlist, don't be foolish enough to decide a card's legality on the flip of a coin. Actually... you know... think!

[/quote']

It was an expression. I didn't literally flip a coin, nor anything like that.

 

The main idea behind it originally was "maybe it wouldn't be so bad", but it was wrong to think that at the time, and I never said it wasn't.

[RedSceptile]

Shien isn't broken. Shien is making the meta better.

 

I think it was Grav who said it; meta needs more Shien/Spell Cancellor and Solemn(or soemthing along those lines).

[CrabHelmet]

Shien is there because I noticed him being ran in 3's and decks using it winning a lot in tourneys. Being able to only play 1 card at a time destroys combo plays and original ideas. And it also makes it a lot harder to defend yourself once your opponent summons a Samurai' date=' Granmaster, and him. Six Sams already have anti-destruction mechanisms. They don't need to make it impossible to clean away their brutes.

[/quote']

 

Six Samurai have no anti-destruction mechanisms other than Solemn Judgment, which isn't exclusive to them. Limiting a card because people use it is Konami logic. There's enough removal in the game that he can't shut things down for long anyhow.

 

Graceful I sort of just flipped a coin on xD

 

That makes no sense at all.

 

But for Victory Dragon' date=' I decided Dragons didn't have enough support and this card wasn't really too popular anyway, so what's the point?

[/quote']

 

The reason nobody uses it is that it's banned. Nobody deserves to lose an entire Match in the first duel.

They can destroy others instead of themselves. And especially in Shien's case, that's not nice at all.

 

I removed it because, like I said, it was just a flip. And I was actually half asleep when writing the limited, while it was just a moment ago I wrote in Card.

 

As for Victory Dragon, I see what you mean, but I'll leave it on there right now for people to discuss. After all, this was for discussion.

 

Six Samurai's anti-destruction effect doesn't generate any advantage, and is useless against mass removal. Shien happens to be one of the only current defenses against decks like DDT.

DDT doesn't exist nearly as well in this list, so there is no reason to bring that up.

 

And as I said, Shien's effect is brutal. You slap a Samurai, summon Grandmaster, and then Shien. Then what happens? Your opponent activates a Spell or Trap Card to destroy Shien? Your opponent switches the target to another Samurai, and then they lose their S/T for the turn. They'd need to summon to the field a 2100 ATK monster, and another, 2400 ATK monster to even match that field then. That's three cards wasted in one turn because of an easy summon.

 

Excellent, we have a three-card combo, two of whose components aren't searchable, and it comes complete with getting owned by Torrential.

[Zeppeli Gyro Supreme]

Shien isn't broken. Shien is making the meta better.

 

I think it was Grav who said it; meta needs more Shien/Spell Cancellor and Solemn(or soemthing along those lines).

Obviously you people don't understand what you read. Shien protects the meta? Okay. That's all fine and dandy. What about the mainly used cards for the Meta that people use which we are currently using him to block with? Where did those go?

 

As far as the listed cards fro Grav...

Eliminator: Nobody uses it

Kinetic: Easily destroyed or Solemn'd, and then combo can be restarted later if you do manage to break it.

 

 

Crab: Unlimited cards don't need to be searched nearly as much. And Torrential is limited. So that's not much of an argument.

[CrabHelmet]

Shien isn't broken. Shien is making the meta better.

 

I think it was Grav who said it; meta needs more Shien/Spell Cancellor and Solemn(or soemthing along those lines).

Obviously you people don't understand what you read. Shien protects the meta? Okay. That's all fine and dandy. What about the mainly used cards for the Meta that people use which we are currently using him to block with? Where did those go?

 

As far as the listed cards fro Grav...

Eliminator: Nobody uses it

Kinetic: Easily destroyed or Solemn'd' date=' and then combo can be restarted later if you do manage to break it.

 

 

Crab: Unlimited cards don't need to be searched nearly as much. And Torrential is limited. So that's not much of an argument.

[/quote']

 

Your opponent is more likely to have Torrential or Mirror Force (2 per deck together) than you are to have Grandmaster + Shien + another Samurai.

 

Your anti-Kinetic argument makes no sense; EVERYTHING gets Solemn'd.