Thar Posted April 4, 2015 Report Share Posted April 4, 2015 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0BXxxfc4aYc Discuss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mshends Posted April 4, 2015 Report Share Posted April 4, 2015 i felt sorry for them all, but when i see a grown man cry it just tears me apart. i wish all of them the best of luck. F""k those assholes, they don't understand what those homeless people had gone throguth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Night Posted April 5, 2015 Report Share Posted April 5, 2015 Feeling sorry for them comes just as easy as feeling animosity towards them. The shit they said isn't fucked up, what's truly fucked up is the fact that we're all just ignoring the issue. We're no better than they are, don't elude yourself into thinking otherwise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thar Posted April 5, 2015 Author Report Share Posted April 5, 2015 There are at least 3 churches in my area that make meals for the homeless people here, and I volunteer occasionally. It's very interesting to hear their stories and experiences. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PowerlinX Posted April 5, 2015 Report Share Posted April 5, 2015 It's really horrible how hard it is for these people to get help. I feel like a lot of animosity towards homeless people originates from the stereotype of alcoholic, drug-addicted people living on the streets, and much of society can't get past superficial traits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~ P O L A R I S ~ Posted April 5, 2015 Report Share Posted April 5, 2015 Feeling sorry for them comes just as easy as feeling animosity towards them. It's certainly not equally easy for me to feel animosity towards the homeless as it is sympathy given my perspective and physiological reactions. Even if it were, that wouldn't mean one isn't clearly better than the other. Animosity towards the homeless cannot bring about actions taken on their behalf whereas sympathy can. The s*** they said isn't f***ed up, what's truly f***ed up is the fact that we're all just ignoring the issue. The s*** posted on Twitter that the homeless people relayed to us was f***ed up, and if we can't recognize that then we're f***ed up. This thread is an acknowledgement of the issue and serves a greater purpose than the "Best National Stereotypes" thread, props to Thar for progress. We're no better than they are, don't elude yourself into thinking otherwise. Why wouldn't we be better than people who actively and vocally hate the homeless? If it's at all possible to better oneself (and if it wasn't there'd be no point in living), I would think that a shift from hating the homeless to sympathizing with the homeless would be a way to do so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Night Posted April 5, 2015 Report Share Posted April 5, 2015 There are at least 3 churches in my area that make meals for the homeless people here, and I volunteer occasionally. It's very interesting to hear their stories and experiences. Good on you, that's legitimate action. Every Thanksgiving my uncle and I buy about six pizza pies and go to the big cathedral in Manhatten, the amount of homeless people surrounding it at night is legitimately depressing. It's nice and the guys over there always appreciate it but even that's not enough, I should do it far more often rather than just once a year. It's certainly not equally easy for me to feel animosity towards the homeless as it is sympathy given my perspective and physiological reactions. Even if it were, that wouldn't mean one isn't clearly better than the other. Animosity towards the homeless cannot bring about actions taken on their behalf whereas sympathy can. The s*** posted on Twitter that the homeless people relayed to us was f***ed up, and if we can't recognize that then we're f***ed up. This thread is an acknowledgement of the issue and serves a greater purpose than the "Best National Stereotypes" thread, props to Thar for progress. Why wouldn't we be better than people who actively and vocally hate the homeless? If it's at all possible to better oneself (and if it wasn't there'd be no point in living), I would think that a shift from hating the homeless to sympathizing with the homeless would be a way to do so. You misunderstood me. You feeling sorry for them comes just as easy as them feeling animosity towards them. Meaning, they both take no effort whatsoever and in the grand scheme of things are irrelevant. What's really fucked up though, a few people with too much time on their hands spouting ignorant shit on twitter or us as a nation doing absolutely nothing and choosing to be ignorant towards the very real issue of homelessness. Oh congratulations on acknowledging the issue of mass poverty, it's not like we pass by homeless people every single day and do absolutely nothing about it. We all acknowledged homelessness a long time ago, this thread is nothing new. It's not better, because both parties aren't doing shit towards remedying the situation. Both are ignorant in their own way, one form of ignorance isn't any better than the other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goodfusion Posted April 5, 2015 Report Share Posted April 5, 2015 It's not better, because both parties aren't doing s*** towards remedying the situation. Some people are doing things to help the homeless, though maybe not enough to help everyone all the time. And by that I mean more than simply "oh I can just put a quid in this box and my conscience will be fine for a month" kind of thing. I do sort of agree with you though. People may think they care for each other, but in a way, if people did truly care for each other equally, surely things like poverty would be practically non-existent? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.Rai Posted April 5, 2015 Report Share Posted April 5, 2015 I kinda agree with Night. Perhaps not as strongly vocal as he would be, but my thought process it similar. Acknowledgement and sympathy is good and all, but does not affect getting rid of homelessness. Perhaps it vaguely affects public awareness, but we know about the issue, we have done for a long time. Awareness is small fish. And these people on Twitter represent a vocal minority. Educate them, sure. Hopefully, some of them are convinced to actively help. One does not sympathise to better oneself foremost (well, theoretically anyway, but we're human). That's certainly not why I volunteer at soup kitchens sometimes. I can only encourage others to do the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spinny Posted April 5, 2015 Report Share Posted April 5, 2015 I just feel sorry for them because they have to deal with more idiots than we do. Like, when someone's down, you dont kick them do you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~ P O L A R I S ~ Posted April 6, 2015 Report Share Posted April 6, 2015 It's not better, because both parties aren't doing shit towards remedying the situation. Both are ignorant in their own way, one form of ignorance isn't any better than the other. Just because homelessness hasn't been magically eradicated doesn't mean nobody is doing anything for the homeless. Acknowledgement and sympathy is good and all, but does not affect getting rid of homelessness. Without acknowledgement and sympathy nobody would do anything for the homeless. Period. I really don't see why you seem to think they're just words without meaning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miror B Posted April 6, 2015 Report Share Posted April 6, 2015 Just because homelessness hasn't been magically eradicated doesn't mean nobody is doing anything for the homeless.It's not about doing something for the homelessness, it's about both sides working towards making the homeless...well, not homeless.The homeless that are trying to get jobs (and let's be fair, that's probably 99% of them) end up getting turned away due to reasons such as lack of experience, lack of school, or similar reasons. And it's not like they can do much about that.So yes, going to your church and giving them a good meal is really great, but what Night is getting at is that homelessness is still a thing because both sides (the homeless AND businesses) aren't giving their all to try and fix things. And again, that's mostly on the businesses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G4hardcore Posted April 6, 2015 Report Share Posted April 6, 2015 Being homeless is definitely hard. It's a struggle not just against the world, but against yourself. You begin to question what it means to be human when you're so reduced. I did know some people who made a killing panhandling, but a good portion are too proud to do things like that. This was a cool video, I can appreciate it, coming from someone who's slept in questionable places for a time that felt too long. Lucky for me, I had people to help me get back on my feet and start making something of myself. I'm willing to help people get back on their feet, but I can never tell whose going to use what you do to help themselves, or get a fix. Between the two, there's a big difference, though we are all equals on this planet. If we're being honest, it's definitely less than 99 percent of homeless out there looking for jobs, even if it ought to be. In my limited experience, which I recognize varies from place to place, 50-75 percent actively seek jobs, give or take. Panhandling, like I said, can earn a killing; more than a part time job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.Rai Posted April 6, 2015 Report Share Posted April 6, 2015 Without acknowledgement and sympathy nobody would do anything for the homeless. Period. I really don't see why you seem to think they're just words without meaning. No, of course they're important. The video reflects that, of course. At the same time, active help definitely comes with acknowledgement and sympathy, while it's not necessarily true the other way round. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~ P O L A R I S ~ Posted April 7, 2015 Report Share Posted April 7, 2015 because both sides (the homeless AND businesses) You're the first in the thread to mention businesses, the sides that Night was referring to were people who hate the homeless and people who acknowledge and sympathize with the homeless, both of whom he sees as doing nothing for the homeless and sharing equal parts of the blame for the issue of homelessness. No, of course they're important. The video reflects that, of course. At the same time, active help definitely comes with acknowledgement and sympathy, while it's not necessarily true the other way round. They're not just "important", they're requisite of active help. This is why your statement that "Acknowledgement and sympathy is good and all, but does not affect getting rid of homelessness." is patently false. Sure, there are people who make a show of acknowledging and sympathizing with the homeless without acting, but that doesn't mean gestures meant to promote sympathy towards the homeless are inherently hypocritical. To say that it isn't f***ed up to hate on homeless people is wrong and we are better than those who hate the homeless in not doing so. If Night honestly feels we're just as bad as someone who'd say "I hate the homeless. I don't feel sorry for you. If you want change, let me throw it at you as hard as I can at your dirty face.", then that's lamentable and I hope he finds ways to see himself and others here in a more positive light. Those who'd kick the homeless when they're down are still worse than we are, don't delude yourself or let Night delude you into thinking otherwise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tentacruel Posted April 7, 2015 Report Share Posted April 7, 2015 I mean, to some extent, moral superiority aint helping the homeless. On the other hand, awareness is never a bad thing, and I'm gonna be that guy that mentions homeless hate sometimes goes beyond just tweeting ignorant shit. https://www.google.com/#q=bum+bashing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~ P O L A R I S ~ Posted April 7, 2015 Report Share Posted April 7, 2015 I see where you're coming from and know I look petty, but basically all I'm saying is it's bad to hate homeless people and preferable not to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G4hardcore Posted April 7, 2015 Report Share Posted April 7, 2015 Nobody is fundamentally better than anyone, despite any beliefs people might hold. I can understand that people may feel inclined to disagree with that statement, but that's like saying red is better than blue in my opinion. We all have the potential for great good, even if we've made unforgivable decisions. But it isn't for people to judge other people as if anyone at all has moral flawlessness. Live and die, we're all the same. When it's all said and done, we don't have the authority to decide whom is better than who. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.Rai Posted April 7, 2015 Report Share Posted April 7, 2015 Acknowledgement and sympathy is good and all, but does not affect getting rid of homelessness." is patently false. Sure, there are people who make a show of acknowledging and sympathizing with the homeless without acting, but that doesn't mean gestures meant to promote sympathy towards the homeless are inherently hypocritical. To say that it isn't f***ed up to hate on homeless people is wrong and we are better than those who hate the homeless in not doing so. If Night honestly feels we're just as bad as someone who'd say "I hate the homeless. I don't feel sorry for you. If you want change, let me throw it at you as hard as I can at your dirty face.", then that's lamentable and I hope he finds ways to see himself and others here in a more positive light. Those who'd kick the homeless when they're down are still worse than we are, don't delude yourself or let Night delude you into thinking otherwise.It's pretty fucked up to hate on homeless people, but I can't actively praise someone for sympathising with a homeless person. I mean, hopefully, we'd consider that the human condition; there is a vocal minority, but in general, having sympathy for the fellow man should be considered normal. Activism isn't necessarily considered the norm though. We may be kind, but we're all kinda lazy, or at least indifferent to issues like this on a daily basis.My stance isn't nearly as strong as you suggest, and it's essentially the same as yours. Don't hate homeless people, as a decent human being. And be encouraged to actively help. Since I assume the vast majority don't hate homeless people, we're halfway there c: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~ P O L A R I S ~ Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 It's pretty f***ed up to hate on homeless people Cool, that's all I really wanted us to be clear on. I'm all for action and understand that you and Night are stressing the importance of constructive actions to help the homeless in addition to words, but expression is also an action that can be constructive or destructive in of itself. Nobody is fundamentally better than anyone, despite any beliefs people might hold. I can understand that people may feel inclined to disagree with that statement, but that's like saying red is better than blue in my opinion. We all have the potential for great good, even if we've made unforgivable decisions. But it isn't for people to judge other people as if anyone at all has moral flawlessness. Live and die, we're all the same. When it's all said and done, we don't have the authority to decide whom is better than who. If everyone were equally good regardless of what they do, there would be no potential. There'd be nothing to forgive, nothing to measure, nothing at all. Nihilism is pragmatic only in despair and despair has its own agenda. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G4hardcore Posted April 9, 2015 Report Share Posted April 9, 2015 [background=#fbfdfe]Cool, that's all I really wanted us to be clear on. I'm all for action and understand that you and Night are stressing the importance of constructive actions to help the homeless in addition to words, but expression is also an action that can be constructive or destructive in of itself. [/background] If everyone were equally good regardless of what they do, there would be no potential. There'd be nothing to forgive, nothing to measure, nothing at all. Nihilism is pragmatic only in despair and despair has its own agenda.I didn't say say people were equally good despite their actions. What I said was the things you do don't make you a fundamentally better person than those around you. That kind of attitude brings on problems of its own in the form of superiority complexes and self righteousness. The potential is still there; the potential to be a better person than you were yesterday. Life shouldn't be about measuring yourself to others or their standards. It should be a personal journey, though I'll stop here for fear I'm being to presumptuous. Nihilism is far from what I was talking about, that's probably a distant tangent at best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~ P O L A R I S ~ Posted April 10, 2015 Report Share Posted April 10, 2015 The potential is still there; the potential to be a better person than you were yesterday. If you can be better or worse than you were yesterday, you've already become better than an other (who you were yesterday) and you can become a better person than others. To say that you can outdo yourself but nobody around you is to hold others to a different standard than you hold yourself. The same thing holds true for those around you, they can also better themselves, but they couldn't if their weren't a worse version of themselves to begin with. That kind of attitude brings on problems of its own in the form of superiority complexes and self righteousness. Not if you also acknowledge that you can be worse than those around you and open yourself to the perspectives of others of others, but you're avoiding comparison altogether. Life shouldn't be about measuring yourself to others or their standards. It should be a personal journey, though I'll stop here for fear I'm being to presumptuous. It might not be what life's about, but there're over 7307254319 others here who are also on their own personal journeys and on that journey a person needs to get their bearings to know where they're going. That's the basis for measurement of any sort, to define something by putting it in context. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G4hardcore Posted April 24, 2015 Report Share Posted April 24, 2015 Whoa, I just saw this! It looks like you're going through good lengths to defend your point. Maybe some people can be better than others, but that statement is restricted to opinions, to which you are very much entitled to have. I avoid comparisons because I have to acknowledge I live in a universe I barely understand. For all I know, thinking of myself as better than anyone can lead to actions that resonate with those thoughts, which in turn could lead to undesirable outcomes. All I can do is be humble and open, learn and be kind. I don't need a spiritual measuring stick for that, or a moral divider. Just my heart and body. Did you just count one's own self as technically another person? That one threw me, not gonna lie. I see what you were going for, but I think it's reaching, considering you probably know what I was going for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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