evilfusion Posted May 21, 2011 Report Share Posted May 21, 2011 Erm, both of them are mandatory In which case, you choose which is Chain Link 1 and which is Chain Link 2 and resolve it accordingly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.Nu-13 Posted May 21, 2011 Report Share Posted May 21, 2011 So if I choose Snow as Link 1, and Celri as Link 2, it means that first Celri SS itself, then I search from Snow, and then Celri activates? Awesome Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evilfusion Posted May 21, 2011 Report Share Posted May 21, 2011 So if I choose Snow as Link 1, and Celri as Link 2, it means that first Celri SS itself, then I search from Snow, and then Celri activates? Awesome Correct. Because Celri's effect by being discarded is to SS itself to opponent's field. It's "opponent discards 1" effect is a mandatory Trigger that occurs after being Successfully SSed, but is not part of its "Celri was discarded" effect. So it will activate after the resolving chain has finished resolving. At least, based on the wording. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Berserker- Posted May 22, 2011 Report Share Posted May 22, 2011 I have Speed Bird in my field and 2 Gemini Soldier and 3 Level Eater in my graveyard. Speed Bird is destroyed by battle by my opponent, and I special summon both Gemini Soldier. During my turn I play Double Summon. Tribute one of the Gemini Soldier for THE TYRANT NEPTUNE, and copy it's effect. Activate 2 Level Eaters to decrease NEPTUNE's level to 8. Tribute the other Gemini Soldier and 1 Level Eater for another THE TYRANT NEPTUNE. Activate the effect of both Level Eater in my graveyard. Xyz Number 83: Galaxy Queen and Thunder-End Dragon. Is this a valid play? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evilfusion Posted May 22, 2011 Report Share Posted May 22, 2011 I have Speed Bird in my field and 2 Gemini Soldier and 3 Level Eater in my graveyard. Speed Bird is destroyed by battle by my opponent, and I special summon both Gemini Soldier. During my turn I play Double Summon. Tribute one of the Gemini Soldier for THE TYRANT NEPTUNE, and copy it's effect. Activate 2 Level Eaters to decrease NEPTUNE's level to 8. Tribute the other Gemini Soldier and 1 Level Eater for another THE TYRANT NEPTUNE. Activate the effect of both Level Eater in my graveyard. Xyz Number 83: Galaxy Queen and Thunder-End Dragon. Is this a valid play? No. While in the Graveyard, Gemini Soldiers are treated as Normal Monsters. The Tyrant Neptune may only copy the effect of an Effect Monster in the Graveyard that was Tributed for it. Because of the "Geminis are Normal in the Graveyard" you cannot select a Gemini monster for the Tyrant Neptune's Effect. So you cannot bring out Thunder-End, because the Tyrant Neptunes are still treated as Effect monsters. Number 83 is still valid, of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ihop Posted May 22, 2011 Report Share Posted May 22, 2011 When GK Assailant attacks a Karakuri Monster, the monster switches and then can Assailant switch it back? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evilfusion Posted May 22, 2011 Report Share Posted May 22, 2011 When GK Assailant attacks a Karakuri Monster, the monster switches and then can Assailant switch it back? Karakuri have mandatory effects and Assailant has an optional effect. They occur at the same timing (Assailant declaring an attack). The Karakuri mandatory effect will be Chain Link 1, and Assailant will be Chain Link 2. Many Karakuri specifically state what position they'll be changed to, in which case, Assailant will not end up "changing them back". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darkwolf777 Posted May 22, 2011 Report Share Posted May 22, 2011 When GK Assailant attacks a Karakuri Monster, the monster switches and then can Assailant switch it back? Karakuri monster effects that switch positions are mandatory Trigger Effects. Gravekeeper's Assailant is optional. Chain Link is as follows: Chain Link #1 - Karakuri Monster changing position to specifically "Defense Position"Chain Link #2 - Gravekeeper's Assailant changing its position. Resolving... Chain Link #2 - Gravekeeper's Assailant changes Karakuri's monster from Attack to Defense position.Chain Link #1 - Karakuri Monster's position is already in Defense Position. Its effect does nothing. So no, in this case, The Karakuri monster will still be in Defense Position regardless of what you do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Airride Posted May 22, 2011 Report Share Posted May 22, 2011 Karakuri monster effects that switch positions are mandatory Trigger Effects. Gravekeeper's Assailant is optional. Chain Link is as follows: Chain Link #1 - Karakuri Monster changing position to specifically "Defense Position"Chain Link #2 - Gravekeeper's Assailant changing its position. Resolving... Chain Link #2 - Gravekeeper's Assailant changes Karakuri's monster from Attack to Defense position.Chain Link #1 - Karakuri Monster's position is already in Defense Position. Its effect does nothing. So no, in this case, The Karakuri monster will still be in Defense Position regardless of what you do.Actually, some kuris say this card changes it's position, not change to DEF. So it depends on the Kuri. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darkwolf777 Posted May 22, 2011 Report Share Posted May 22, 2011 Actually, some kuris say this card changes it's position, not change to DEF. So it depends on the Kuri. Well, I only looked at one as an example, I thought they were all the same. In that case, i'm fairly sure the all specifically change positions to another specified position, so Assailant would not have an effect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Berserker- Posted May 22, 2011 Report Share Posted May 22, 2011 No. While in the Graveyard, Gemini Soldiers are treated as Normal Monsters. The Tyrant Neptune may only copy the effect of an Effect Monster in the Graveyard that was Tributed for it. Because of the "Geminis are Normal in the Graveyard" you cannot select a Gemini monster for the Tyrant Neptune's Effect. So you cannot bring out Thunder-End, because the Tyrant Neptunes are still treated as Effect monsters. Number 83 is still valid, of course. Too bad. Because that would have been AWESOME. Other ways of spawning lv8 vanillas that can be considered? Like Ninjutsu, Art of Transformation or Celestial Transformation+IRS, Machine Duplication or something? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evilfusion Posted May 22, 2011 Report Share Posted May 22, 2011 Karakuri Komachi (mdl 224) and Karakuri Nanashick (mdl 7749), and Karakuri Watchdog (mdl 313) are the Karakuri that dont switch to a specific position, in which cases, Assailant will switch them, and their own effects will switch them back. Sadly, the only known level 8 Normals are: Blue-Eyes (duh), Cosmo Queen, Gogiga Gagagigo, Rapid Dragon (Photon Shockwave), Sengenjin, Spiral Serpent, and Tri-Horned. Phoenix Gearfried is the only level 8 Gemini monster. I'd advise cards like Ancient Rules or Swing of Memories. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evilfusion Posted May 22, 2011 Report Share Posted May 22, 2011 Now I had a quick question, less about rulings and more about the current rule. Does XX-Saber Darksoul activate multiple times if sent more than once? I've been under the impression that the ruling has been overturned, stating that it can only search once, but I haven't found any source to confirm this, and in fact, the only source I could find was Wiki, stating that it COULD search multiples. The official site with TSHD's rulings is missing the page with Darksoul entirely. Being unable to find a ruling confirming me (and only able to find one confirming the opponent), I had to let my opponent search twice. I wanted to know what the stance is on Darksoul and hopefully a source saying one or the other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darkwolf777 Posted May 22, 2011 Report Share Posted May 22, 2011 Now I had a quick question, less about rulings and more about the current rule. Does XX-Saber Darksoul activate multiple times if sent more than once? I've been under the impression that the ruling has been overturned, stating that it can only search once, but I haven't found any source to confirm this, and in fact, the only source I could find was Wiki, stating that it COULD search multiples. The official site with TSHD's rulings is missing the page with Darksoul entirely. Being unable to find a ruling confirming me (and only able to find one confirming the opponent), I had to let my opponent search twice. I wanted to know what the stance is on Darksoul and hopefully a source saying one or the other. Based on the strict wording on the card, it should only work once, but many players have the idea that it activates multiple times. Some of that I blame on the wiki and others I've heard people say actually ruled it that way in tourneys. With the way i see the card: "If this card you control is sent to the Graveyard" is the condition"During the End Phase" is the Trigger"you can add 1 "X-Saber" monster from your Deck to your hand" is the Effect. I'd rule it is as follows: "This card's effect activates during the End Phase of the turn in which is sent from your side of the field to the Graveyard"."If Darksoul is removed from the Graveyard for any reason, then it cannot activate during the End Phase." Somehow, Konami likes to rule it as (at least the idea that most people currently have): "If this card you control is sent to the Graveyard" is the Trigger"During the End Phase" is a latent unchainable trigger that occurs if the effect resolved successfully."you can add 1 "X-Saber" monster from your Deck to your hand" is the Effect Which in turn means:"XX-Darksoul's effect activates when it is destroyed and sent to the Graveyard.""During the End Phase of the turn this effect resolves, you can add 1 "X-Saber" monster to your hand. This does not start a chain.""You can add 1 X-Saber monster to your hand for each time a Darksoul successfully resolved after being sent to the Graveyard." Unfortunately, I don't know the official tournament TCG standing on the card. I could only hope its the first way that I described it. I wish I had a source, and if they rule it the multi-use way, I wish to knock Konami upside their heads. In any case, Version B is the most widely accepted rulings, which I disagree with completely x.x Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evilfusion Posted May 22, 2011 Report Share Posted May 22, 2011 Previously, it was a TCG Exclusive, but Japan should have gotten it by now, so I thought a new ruling would have been made on it now. I normally tell people who sent Darksoul twice that they only get 1 search, and they accept that without question. But one person evidently knew it to be ruled otherwise, and told me to check the ruling sites as a source. Wiki was the only source and it had a link to a (quoted) Konami email that confirmed it. Can anyone verify on WC11? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Airride Posted May 22, 2011 Report Share Posted May 22, 2011 Darksoul's not on there. It's still TCG-Exclusive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boss Z Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 I want to make 4 Types of Decks... DWs, Laval, Fairies and Worms Faires(Hyperion) and Worms are the only 2 capible of being built now/soon... and I was wondering... Factoring in Cost, Playability and Win-ability... which of the two Decks should I work of creating First?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greiga Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 Fairies and Worms are easy to make and will only get better once Xyz are out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evilfusion Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 Darksoul's not on there. It's still TCG-Exclusive. Seriously? Ugh, guess that crappy ruling is still valid and X-Sabers wont get hit for a while. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greiga Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 I have Kristya on the field. They have Dimensional Fissure/Macro Cosmos/whatever on the field. What happens if Kristya is destroyed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evilfusion Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 I have Kristya on the field. They have Dimensional Fissure/Macro Cosmos/whatever on the field. What happens if Kristya is destroyed? Kristya says "If this card would be sent from the field to the Graveyard..." Because Macro/D-Fissure tells you to RFG instead of going to the Graveyard, Kristya being destroyed would not be going from the field to the Graveyard, but instead would be RFGed. Therefore it will be RFGed, not returned to the deck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boss Z Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 Okay... My Scrap Dragon blows up my Cardtrooper, can I draw 1 AND SS my Granel? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evilfusion Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 Okay... My Scrap Dragon blows up my Cardtrooper, can I draw 1 AND SS my Granel? I'm pretty sure you can. Scrap Dragon destroys both cards simultaneously, so Granel won't miss the timing. Both Card Trooper and Granel have the same timing (when Card Trooper is destroyed and sent to the Graveyard). Card Trooper's mandatory effect activates and is Chain Link 1. Granel's Special Summon Effect can be Chained as Chain Link 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darkwolf777 Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 Okay... My Scrap Dragon blows up my Cardtrooper, can I draw 1 AND SS my Granel? Meklord Emperor Summons are Trigger Effects that activate. You can activate the effect, with Card Trooper would be Chain Link #1, and Granel would be Chain Link #2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boss Z Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 Thanx Guys, I now have my own incredibly Teched out Scrap Variant (I think)Sadly it'll be posted b4 I can Get Back to a computer to Edit my Deck... Its the same thing with Tengu, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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