Naruto

[Mr.WHAM]

That is what I said. And that was Obito who attacked Konoha which actually supports the theory. It's possible that it may have been Madara and he died while helping Itachi, but I think that they would've noticed his hair change. Or something.

[Blake]

Madara probably died after Recruiting members of Akatsuki like Kisame and assiting Nagato.

 

Then Pain took over and Tobi joined. This theory is obviously lacking in points but it could be right

Dame dame!

 

When Obitobi removed his mask, he was recognized as the man manipulating the Mizukage. The Tobi we see now is clearly the same Tobi, as Madara has been dead.

 

Also, your theory on Nagato "taking over" the Akatsuki is also no good, no good. Akatsuki was originally led by Yahiko (if that was his name, I forget), and was then taken over by Nagato. Tobi is the leader, somehow, but it was by Nagato.

[Phantom Roxas]

I think Itachi was a baby during Kakashi Gaiden.

 

Keep in mind we don't exactly know how Madara died yet. I'm more concerned with how he was revived in his armor and looking young, since Edo Tensei seems to revive people as they were at the time of their deaths. Either that or it just gives them the clothes they typically wore.

[Mr.WHAM]

Dame dame!

 

When Obitobi removed his mask, he was recognized as the man manipulating the Mizukage. The Tobi we see now is clearly the same Tobi, as Madara has been dead.

 

Also, your theory on Nagato "taking over" the Akatsuki is also no good, no good. Akatsuki was originally led by Yahiko (if that was his name, I forget), and was then taken over by Nagato. Tobi is the leader, somehow, but it was by Nagato.

 

 

Yahiko was already dead by this tie though. In time frame I'm speaking of Nagato is using Yahiko's body as Pein. As far as it being the same Obito, we do not know that to be fact at all.It actually looks more like Madara from the chapter.

They actually say it is Madara

http://www.mangahere.com/manga/naruto/v54/c507/13.html

 

Yahiko dies during the Third Ninja war and Nagato takes over as leader of Akatsuki. This is also the Time frame that Obito and Madara meet. I think it is plausible that they faked deaths. I just have a bit more researching to do.

[Blake]

Yahiko was already dead by this tie though. In time frame I'm speaking of Nagato is using Yahiko's body as Pein. As far as it being the same Obito, we do not know that to be fact at all.It actually looks more like Madara from the chapter.

They actually say it is Madara

http://www.mangahere.com/manga/naruto/v54/c507/13.html

Good to know you didn't comprehend a word I said.

 

Nagato IMMEDIATELY took control of Akatsuki from Yahiko. Tobi somehow came into power, presumably by revealing he (Or Madara) was the one to give Nagato his eyes.

 

As for the link, are you dense? Tobi called himself Madara for half the freaking series! Citing Tobi calling himself Madara is the stupidest defense you could have produced. Of COURSE he claimed to be Madara. Kisame recognized the current Tobi as the Tobi that controlled the Mizukage. As such, they are, indeed, both Obito. This also shoots down the stupid "but the hair doesn't match" nonsense.

[Mr.WHAM]

Good to know you didn't comprehend a word I said.

 

Nagato IMMEDIATELY took control of Akatsuki from Yahiko. Tobi somehow came into power, presumably by revealing he (Or Madara) was the one to give Nagato his eyes.

 

As for the link, are you dense? Tobi called himself Madara for half the freaking series! Citing Tobi calling himself Madara is the stupidest defense you could have produced. Of COURSE he claimed to be Madara. Kisame recognized the current Tobi as the Tobi that controlled the Mizukage. As such, they are, indeed, both Obito. This also shoots down the stupid "but the hair doesn't match" nonsense.

 

Nagato, was definately incontrol of Akatsuki. I'm not debating that. He had to be else they would not have discussed their plan with him. What I am saying is that AT SOME POINT Obito and Madara were both alive and operating under the names "Tobi" and "Uchiha Madara". I believe that for a brief moment in time Madara was doing his own dirty work. The best possible timeframe for this to have happened would be the attack on Konoha with Obito using the Nine-Tails. If the two of them were both alive then it is possible for the actual Madara to have been manipulating the Mizukage. Hence why I showed the picture, because I'm saying that it was Madara who was manipulating and NOT Obito. I know that there's a chance that it can be Obito just simply lying.

 

Tobi came into Akatsuki when Sasori died, or rather started making more appearances and being apart of the group/plot. However, he had probably planned this alongside Nagato. And raises the question of didn't Itachi notice...whatever.

 

It's a lot of speculation that will hopefully be cleared up in the next 3 chapters.

[Blake]

Nagato, was definately incontrol of Akatsuki. I'm not debating that. He had to be else they would not have discussed their plan with him. What I am saying is that AT SOME POINT Obito and Madara were both alive and operating under the names "Tobi" and "Uchiha Madara". I believe that for a brief moment in time Madara was doing his own dirty work. The best possible timeframe for this to have happened would be the attack on Konoha with Obito using the Nine-Tails. If the two of them were both alive then it is possible for the actual Madara to have been manipulating the Mizukage. Hence why I showed the picture, because I'm saying that it was Madara who was manipulating and NOT Obito. I know that there's a chance that it can be Obito just simply lying.

Are you a moron? Madara and Obito look NOTHING alike beyond small clan traits that are almost a century of dilution/inbreeding apart. Kisame's not retarded, he can tell the difference between the two. There's no chance, your picture just proved your argument had nothing air tight to hold it together. Your major plan relies on Kisame being as horrible at remembering people as Guy, which has shown to be pretty much the opposite.

 

Kisame says Tobi is the one who was manipulating the Mizukage. When Kisame said this, Madara was long since a corpse and Obito was Tobi. As such, the one that recruited Kisame and was undeniably the one in control of the Mizukage at that time.

 

Madara could have set the plan in motion, but he most definitely was not the one to recruit Kisame, and I doubt he was alive at that time. Also, Nagato never met the real Madara, at least not knowing who he was. Akatsuki wasn't necessarily planned by Madara, but he might have factored it into his plans. Obito probably became leader upon revealing the Rinnegan were from "him", aka "Madara", which has been hinted more than ever at this point.

[Phantom Roxas]

The chapter should be up tomorrow, or in a few hours depending on your time zone. Why don't we hold the speculation until then?

[Flame Dragon]

http://www.mangapanda.com/naruto/603

 

Or now.

[Fusion X. Denver]

[spoiler=603]

WOULDJA LOOK AT THAT LONG HAIR

So that's where Tobi's 1st personality came from...

Anyways, not much else to say for this chapter aside from several small interesting tidbits.

 

I wonder if this scuffle with the Mist is what leads to Obito acting as the Mizukage -____0

 

[Mr.WHAM]

That chapter....did nothing but start a back story but it does prove that they were both alive. And explains Tobi's mask and why his personality DRASTICALLY changed from Deidara to Obito. Good lord...there were 3 different....NARUTOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

[Monkey]

 

 

Gah! It'll be at least 3 more chapters if not more before we get back to the main fight! I'm interested in Obito's development but I really want to see the rest of the battle!

 

It's weird to see that the White Zetsu are what gives Tobi his goofball personality. So it's implied that the entire time that Tobi was with Akatsuki, he was fused with a white Zetsu?

[Merci]

Is it so preposterous to believe Obito grew his hair out over the years leading to the Massacre?

I could believe it.

 

Apparently, you're absolutely correct.

 

The whole Zetsu thing is actually interesting now. Remember before, when we were all afraid that Tobi was exactly that; Obito fused with a white Zetsu? Well, Kishi's at least doing it in a better light. It also explains his goofball personality, and presumably how he came to manipulate the Mizukage.

 

Though now this raises the question of when exactly the Kakashi Gaiden occurred, and how old Kakashi really is...

[Blake]

Apparently, you're absolutely correct.

The whole Zetsu thing is actually interesting now. Remember before, when we were all afraid that Tobi was exactly that; Obito fused with a white Zetsu? Well, Kishi's at least doing it in a better light. It also explains his goofball personality, and presumably how he came to manipulate the Mizukage.

Though now this raises the question of when exactly the Kakashi Gaiden occurred, and how old Kakashi really is...

None of that needs an answer, though.

 

Kakashi was 13 when Obito was crushed. 14-15 when Kurama and Tobi. 26 when plot starts, 27 before timeskip. Was 29 when Naruto got back, and is 30 now. Thus, Kakashi Gaiden was 17 or so years before this fight.

 

And I'm still not fond of this, at all, though Tobi Zetsu is amusing.

[Phantom Roxas]

Yeah, I liked that Tobi Zetsu is silly enough to justify the drastic change in personality. I didn't like that the chapter spent so much time between Obito and the Zetsus arguing with each other, but I love that we're showing all the threads come together. Also, the fact that he had his spiral mask just makes it more confusing on who was the Tobi that used Kurama and then worked with Itachi.

[Tentacruel]

So Tobi really is a good boy...

[Phantom Roxas]

The fact that it was White Zetsu who said it made it all the more hilarious.

 

Although now I'm curious where Black Zetsu came from.

[Fusion X. Denver]

Apparently, you're absolutely correct.

Indeed.

The whole Zetsu thing is actually interesting now. Remember before, when we were all afraid that Tobi was exactly that; Obito fused with a white Zetsu?

I thought people were just afraid that he was an ordinary Zetsu?

Well, it's still Obito, he's just wearing Tobi to move (f*ck did I just say).

 

This chapter also explained that one panel a few chapters ago where Obito healed his wound from the Rasengan

But yeah, I'm also curious about Black Zetsu. Maybe Madara somehow leaves his will when he dies into Black Zetsu?

idk

 

I really want to see what happens with these Mist ninja.

[Phantom Roxas]

Even during the battle with Danzo, we saw him take off his arm and it seemed to be made of Zetsu. There's also the fact that Konan blew up his arm.

[Fusion X. Denver]

Looking back, he lost his right arm then too.

I'm guessing if they damaged the left side of his body, it wouldn't heal. Unless he's modified himself since then.

[Northern Sage]

So, does the whole thing bear a striking resemblance to Darth Vader or is it just me?

Kind of curious what the heck Zetsu actually is…

[Fusion X. Denver]

So, does the whole thing bear a striking resemblance to Darth Vader or is it just me?

Kind of curious what the heck Zetsu actually is…

 

...

Maybe.

Give it more time.

 

Zetsu is apparently an artificial human created by the Gedo Mazo statue which is/was a giant mass of Senju cells.

[Phantom Roxas]

So, does the whole thing bear a striking resemblance to Darth Vader or is it just me?

Kind of curious what the heck Zetsu actually is…

 

...

 

Damn it, that means Obito is Anakin. It also probably explains why I find the real Madara to be a boring villain, since I apparently hate emperor villains, although I don't really have any problem with Palpatine.

[Kakashi Hatake]

Zetsu is apparently an artificial human created by the Gedo Mazo statue which is/was a giant mass of Senju cells.

Still loving Tobizetsu. Obito looks so f*cking badass inside of him. This also pretty much explains how Obtio is going to figure out that Kakashi let Rin die.

 

Also, what if the Tobi that faught Minato was also Obito inside of Tobizetsu?

[Fusion X. Denver]

Also, what if the Tobi that faught Minato was also Obito inside of Tobizetsu?

 

That's a distinct possibility, although we caught sight of his bare arms during that fight, so unless they took it a step further and literally fused Tobi into Obito after whatever happens here, then I'd say it's just Obito having gotten better.