Synchronized Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 [quote name='mido9' timestamp='1330618667' post='5849807'] And a free dark bribe-ish monster is comparable to a solemn judgment-ish monster how...? [/quote] [quote name='evilchris' timestamp='1330618952' post='5849812'] Six Sams spam Shi En every turn. Shi En negates less than Laggia. Laggia just so happens to be just as easy, if not easier, to spam. Honestly YCM is full of idiots. [/quote] You're missing the entire point. Six Samurais are a spam-based archetype. That's what they do. They fill the field up ridiculously fast and with almost no cost. Plus, Shi En is once per turn, not just once. Second of all, with no Rabbit, Laggia is just a solid boss monster for a Deck that requires dedication to build. I don't understand why you keep trying to compare other cards instead of just addressing the fact that Rescue Rabbit is not a balanced card and it is the card that makes Laggia so easy to summon. Without Rabbit, the easiest way to bring out Laggia would be Guaiba, and that actually takes more than just "Summon, Banish, Repeat" to pull off. Am I wrong? In turn, it makes Evols good by having a bunch of different options. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
This Account is Unplayable Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 >Provide valid argument >Get irritated kid bickering that "Evols need to be good" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Synchronized Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 [quote name='evilchris' timestamp='1330619507' post='5849831'] >Provide valid argument >Get irritated kid bickering that "Evols need to be good" [/quote] Whether or not that was directed at me, I'm not sure. Nor am I saying Evols need to be good. But while Evols have the potential to be a competitive, good, yet balanced Deck, Dino Rabbit is not balanced in the slightest because Rescue Rabbit, which I've already argued a few times now. That said, I don't understand how your valid argument is comparing a spammable Level 5 Synchro that got limited because of how easy it is to bring out AND is once per turn negation with a built-in self protection effect on top of that to a one-time negation effect that (without broken cards such as Rabbit which I've addressed already) would just be [b]good[/b], not broken. But whatever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legend Zero Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 Errata Laggia to need 3 materials -> Problem solved Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
This Account is Unplayable Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 Yes because an easy-to-summon Judgment on legs is incredibly balanced. Have you read Evoltile Najash? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CommanderVolt Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 Dat Input. For the most part the list is pretty nice. [quote name='byakklon Omega' timestamp='1330551589' post='5848241'] Forbidden: [b]Black Luster Soldier - Envoy of the Beginning - DIe Die Die, should have never came back in the first place.[/b] [b]Card Destruction - Dat World Hate.[/b] [b]Future Fusion - I honestly would rather see Brio go, but, arguably, it's still just as bad. [/b] [b]Gateway of the Six - Die in a hole.[/b] [b]Leviair the Sea Dragon - Not entirely sure why banned, perhaps a bit ignorant of it's current uses in the meta, as i my self rarely find the decks i run going into this. [/b] [b]Pot of Avarice - Agreed. Far too abuse able in many cases.[/b] [b]Wind-Up Hunter - I'd figure hitting Zenmaighty (or Maybe Rat for luls?) Would be enough, but hitting Hunter i suppose would shut it down entirely.[/b] Limited: [b]Evolzar Laggia - I never found my self running more then 2, and not often did i drop more then 1 in a duel, Dolkka too good. [/b] [b]Grapha, Dragon Lord of Dark World - Grapha y u so banished.[/b] [b]Inzektor Centipede - Would perfer Hornet to go to 0 so i could run HornetlessRK5Zektors without Criticism tldr Red-Eyes Darkness Metal Dragon - Shame, i just picked up Chaos Dragons irl, but i've long since been a complainer of this card and can proudly say "Nothing of value was lost"[/b] [b]Rekindling - Dat Laval Hate[/b] [b]Spirit Reaper - Dat Waller (Black Corn y u no in TCG)[/b] [b]Tsukuyomi - Oh god how i wish this would come back[/b] [b]Wind-Up Carrier Zenmaity - See Hunter[/b] Semilimited: [b]Book of Moon - Yes plis, i've got my dad to main deck this at 3 in most of his decks in Duel Transer. [/b] [b]Lonefire Blossom - Eh...with Glow and Spore gone, is that enough merit for this to leave 1?[/b] [b]Rescue Rabbit - Is bound to happen. Inevitable, no discussion needed. [/b] [b]Tour Guide From the Underworld - Yes Please (Oh no, my Urknight Rush qq) Wind-Up Factory - Same logic as Gateway pretty much. [/b] Unlimited: [b]Debris Dragon - Why @3 with Dandy still around?[/b] [b]Destiny Draw - Seems legit. [/b] [b]Formula Synchron - I don't see why not with Rekindling @ 1 and Glow gone.[/b] [b]Gladiator Beast Bestiari - ... [color=#ffffff]F**k that archetype to high hell[/color][/b] [b]Marshmallon - Um...okay?[/b] [b]Shien's Smoke Signal - Eh, would rather this have stayed @1[/b] [/quote] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Synchronized Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 [quote name='Legend Zero' timestamp='1330619848' post='5849842'] Errata Laggia to need 3 materials -> Problem solved [/quote] I almost think it wouldn't be worth running at that point. ._. [quote name='evilchris' timestamp='1330619876' post='5849845'] Yes because an easy-to-summon Judgment on legs is incredibly balanced. Have you read Evoltile Najash? [/quote] Yeah, it's what, Tribute, grab an Evolsaur from the Deck, right? It's still not a one card combo, like Rabbit, which is the point I'm making. D: I guess I just feel like the resources you use in Evols (and I keep referencing them only because I feel like it's the best option you have to bring Laggia out if Rabbit's gone) would more than likely balance it out. The problem there is the fact that while Rabbit requires no skill to play, this would. That, and dropping Laggia is far from "game", regardless of what anyone says. Even then, Dolkka can sometimes be a better option if it's not first turn. I just don't think Laggia's the problem everyone is making it out to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 Honestly, if Laggia went to 1, Rabbit could stay @3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Welche the crab Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 Ban all rank 1-2-3-4 monsters. Problem? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mido9 Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 Evols need setup to get out even ONE laggia,they're also inconsistent in how if you get najasho without a tributer you're done,or get too many evolsaurs,or too many tribute cards,or etc,and need to expend resources to get out laggia,so they're fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Synchronized Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 [quote name='Canadian' timestamp='1330620290' post='5849856'] Honestly, if Laggia went to 1, Rabbit could stay @3 [/quote] Rabbit's still a problem in general because it's a +1 from the Deck that can be an instant Rank (insert Rank here). It's the same reason Rescue Cat was a problem, as long as Synchros exist, Rescue Cat will be an issue, just like Xyz with Rabbit. Otherwise you could've argued that once Brionac got banned, Cat could come back. It's still not skillful at all. [quote name='Welche' timestamp='1330620347' post='5849858'] Ban all rank 1-2-3-4 monsters. Problem? [/quote] Pretty much the only way to have a balanced Rabbit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
byak Posted March 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 [quote name='Brandon Michael Geren' timestamp='1330607530' post='5849626'] Do you want those decks to be good? You're making them more playable :s I felt sorry for Jack on the first few pages [spoiler=Jesse] jesse 8:44:54 PM I feel sorry for Jack brandon geren 8:44:58 PM y jesse 8:45:09 PM like, everyone just sucks his dick 45:16 and he wants to actually argue with people brandon geren 8:45:24 PM really 45:25 well s*** 45:30 i want to argue with him 45:33 but not look stupid 45:35 got alts? 45:42 no wait that wont work 45:46 he wont accept a random. jesse 8:45:46 PM hmz brandon geren 8:45:47 PM hm 45:50 hmmmm jesse 8:45:52 PM hmz 45:57 well 46:07 I would argue that limited reaper is stupid brandon geren 8:46:32 PM it is jesse 8:46:39 PM hmz 46:45 okay arguments 47:35 so, tsukuyomi shouldn't come back because its a constant +1 and can be used in more than one way brandon geren 8:47:44 PM its not a +1 jesse 8:47:51 PM it is depending on how you use it brandon geren 8:47:52 PM argue that tsuku can go to 3 47:58 it should be at 3 jesse 8:48:00 PM OH s*** 48:03 HE FELL FOR IT 48:04 HAHAHA brandon geren 8:48:08 PM theres no difference between 1 and 3 48:10 fell for wat 48:11 link jesse 8:48:17 PM Limited: Inzektor Centipede 48:20 t1t2 brandon geren 8:48:22 PM idgi 48:24 whats the joke jesse 8:48:35 PM remember when I told you to do that 48:36 ? brandon geren 8:48:38 PM ya 48:41 what about it jesse 8:48:46 PM so I told him brandon geren 8:48:48 PM is it a bad idea? jesse 8:48:52 PM yes brandon geren 8:48:57 PM k go on 49:01 what did you tell him jesse 8:49:02 PM but like 49:05 lol he bought the idea 49:13 what a dumb ass brandon geren 8:49:15 PM what is the better way? 49:23 to hit the deck jesse 8:49:39 PM dragonfly duh 49:48 stupid b**** 49:50 <__< 50:08 dragonfly banned though 50:13 also 51:00 leviair shouldn't be banned because it discourages people to use gold sarcophagus 51:09 no that was a dumb argument 51:10 <__< 51:33 honestly, zenmaines should be banned 51:40 over banned leviair 51:55 since for a lot of people they can just sit their ass behind it and be like lol u mad 52:34 it also encourages stupid s*** like beating the crap out of someone then going for that and they have no outs [/spoiler] idk if i agree with Jesse's arguments, but just putting them here since he won't. [spoiler=Dave] [2/29/2012 8:50:35 PM] David Hommersen: each move makes sense in its own [2/29/2012 8:50:38 PM] Brandon Geren: and explain his thought [2/29/2012 8:50:39 PM] Brandon Geren: s [2/29/2012 8:50:40 PM] David Hommersen: but the format it creates is bad [2/29/2012 8:50:46 PM] Brandon Geren: yes exactly [2/29/2012 8:51:06 PM] Brandon Geren: also mention that jack played gbs awhile ago so he's biased and did that s*** with besti and book [2/29/2012 8:51:14 PM] David Hommersen: but like, [2/29/2012 8:51:19 PM] David Hommersen: 2 lonefire, 1 dandy, 3 debris [2/29/2012 8:51:20 PM] David Hommersen: dafuq? [2/29/2012 8:51:30 PM] Brandon Geren: oh ass [2/29/2012 8:51:36 PM] Brandon Geren: what other targets are there for plant s*** [2/29/2012 8:51:46 PM] David Hommersen: tyannial? [2/29/2012 8:51:53 PM] Brandon Geren: what else [2/29/2012 8:51:56 PM] David Hommersen: gigaplant [2/29/2012 8:52:02 PM] Brandon Geren: ew [2/29/2012 8:52:45 PM] David Hommersen: yeah [2/29/2012 8:52:50 PM] David Hommersen: since spore + glow are banned [2/29/2012 8:52:57 PM] David Hommersen: its bad now [2/29/2012 8:53:09 PM] David Hommersen: card dest is a great choice [2/29/2012 8:53:17 PM] David Hommersen: stops mjar otk's too [2/29/2012 8:53:43 PM] David Hommersen: Smoke Signal I disagree. [2/29/2012 8:53:54 PM] David Hommersen: Should have stayed at 1 imho [2/29/2012 8:53:56 PM] Brandon Geren: yeah [2/29/2012 8:53:59 PM] Brandon Geren: pretty much [2/29/2012 8:54:11 PM] David Hommersen: also, idgi [2/29/2012 8:54:17 PM] David Hommersen: why reaper to 1, marsh to 3 [2/29/2012 8:54:17 PM] Brandon Geren: you dont get what [2/29/2012 8:54:20 PM] Brandon Geren: oh [2/29/2012 8:54:20 PM] David Hommersen: like [2/29/2012 8:54:21 PM] Brandon Geren: well [2/29/2012 8:54:22 PM] David Hommersen: i've never understood [2/29/2012 8:54:24 PM] Brandon Geren: reaper is a much better card [2/29/2012 8:54:28 PM] Brandon Geren: are you f***ing serious [2/29/2012 8:54:29 PM] David Hommersen: but nobody uses 3. [2/29/2012 8:54:36 PM] Brandon Geren: i use 3 all the time [2/29/2012 8:54:38 PM] Brandon Geren: and people use 2 [2/29/2012 8:54:39 PM] David Hommersen: and marsh is still a good card in chain burn [2/29/2012 8:54:45 PM] Brandon Geren: so the 1 argument is a good one [2/29/2012 8:54:59 PM] Brandon Geren: 3 was good before windups and inzektors [2/29/2012 8:55:12 PM] Brandon Geren: in that part of the format around christmastime, 3 reaper was good stuff, just not very common [2/29/2012 8:55:31 PM] Brandon Geren: 0 veiler was played [2/29/2012 8:55:37 PM] David Hommersen: just bugs me about marsh monsters [2/29/2012 8:55:41 PM] David Hommersen: like the fool [2/29/2012 8:55:42 PM] David Hommersen: ect.. [2/29/2012 8:55:45 PM] Brandon Geren: well [2/29/2012 8:55:54 PM] Brandon Geren: im not saying that marshmallon should be at 3 [2/29/2012 8:55:59 PM] Brandon Geren: but reaper at 1 is ok [2/29/2012 8:56:05 PM] Brandon Geren: and marshmallon is worse than reaper [2/29/2012 8:56:06 PM] David Hommersen: I like reaper to 1 [2/29/2012 8:57:47 PM] David Hommersen: banning of leviair is awk [2/29/2012 8:57:55 PM] Brandon Geren: i agree with it [2/29/2012 8:58:01 PM] Brandon Geren: and i can see where he's coming from [2/29/2012 8:58:09 PM] David Hommersen: limiting it would suffice [2/29/2012 8:58:11 PM] Brandon Geren: if you've ever seen him or his teammates play, you would know [2/29/2012 8:58:15 PM] Brandon Geren: no it really wouldn't [2/29/2012 8:58:17 PM] Brandon Geren: are you retarded [2/29/2012 8:58:24 PM] Brandon Geren: everybody runs 1 leviair [2/29/2012 8:58:28 PM] Brandon Geren: except in windups and rabbit [2/29/2012 8:58:32 PM] David Hommersen: well like [2/29/2012 8:58:35 PM] David Hommersen: I think TGU is the main problem [2/29/2012 8:58:43 PM] Brandon Geren: plus leviair has loops with windups [2/29/2012 8:58:45 PM] David Hommersen: decks that abuse leviair all run tgu [2/29/2012 8:58:49 PM] Brandon Geren: "" [2/29/2012 8:59:05 PM] Brandon Geren: loops for deckout under maxx c mostly tho [2/29/2012 8:59:13 PM] Brandon Geren: dont achieve a thing [2/29/2012 8:59:21 PM] David Hommersen: oh [2/29/2012 8:59:23 PM] David Hommersen: im not gonna lie [2/29/2012 8:59:31 PM] David Hommersen: I don't know the leviar loop [2/29/2012 8:59:38 PM] David Hommersen: maybe its just me [2/29/2012 8:59:40 PM] Brandon Geren: i dont either [2/29/2012 8:59:45 PM] Brandon Geren: it has to do with rabbit and rat [2/29/2012 8:59:49 PM] Brandon Geren: and leviair obv [2/29/2012 8:59:50 PM] David Hommersen: but i don't feel like leviair is as huge of a card as other stuff [2/29/2012 8:59:54 PM] David Hommersen: but like [2/29/2012 8:59:56 PM] David Hommersen: Its only 9 more ss's [2/29/2012 8:59:58 PM] David Hommersen: idk [2/29/2012 9:00:02 PM] David Hommersen: im bad [2/29/2012 9:00:06 PM] Brandon Geren: but [2/29/2012 9:00:07 PM] Brandon Geren: again [2/29/2012 9:00:14 PM] Brandon Geren: he could see it as a better card than us [2/29/2012 9:00:22 PM] David Hommersen: yeah, i dont play w/ him [2/29/2012 9:00:24 PM] Brandon Geren: i dont think youve ever watched him or his teammates war [2/29/2012 9:00:32 PM] Brandon Geren: they use leviair all the time [2/29/2012 9:00:34 PM] Brandon Geren: and win with it [2/29/2012 9:00:42 PM] Brandon Geren: they use leviair more than anyone ive ever seen [2/29/2012 9:00:43 PM] David Hommersen: chaos engine is still good [2/29/2012 9:00:45 PM] Brandon Geren: and they use it properly [2/29/2012 9:00:48 PM] David Hommersen: with chaos sorc [2/29/2012 9:00:48 PM] David Hommersen: grabbing rai-oh [2/29/2012 9:00:53 PM] David Hommersen: ect.. [2/29/2012 9:00:58 PM] Brandon Geren: OH f*** [2/29/2012 9:00:58 PM] David Hommersen: thats how it should be. [/spoiler] [/quote] Centipede is the ideal card to hit, and now that I think about it more I'd limit United to go with Smoke Signal going to three.[quote name='ɢαlαхy' timestamp='1330620470' post='5849863'] Rabbit's still a problem in general because it's a +1 from the Deck that can be an instant Rank (insert Rank here). It's the same reason Rescue Cat was a problem, as long as Synchros exist, Rescue Cat will be an issue, just like Xyz with Rabbit. Otherwise you could've argued that once Brionac got banned, Cat could come back. It's still not skillful at all. Pretty much the only way to have a balanced Rabbit. [/quote] Rabbit becomes less of a problem because Leviair doesn't exist in this format. It's comparable to Rescue Cat but Rabbit requires you to play Normal Monsters, while with Cat you only had to play Airbellum/Darksoul/Test Tiger/Samnite Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Synchronized Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 [quote name='byakklon Omega' timestamp='1330620795' post='5849875'] Centipede is the ideal card to hit, and now that I think about it more I'd limit United to go with Smoke Signal going to three. Rabbit becomes less of a problem because Leviair doesn't exist in this format. It's comparable to Rescue Cat but Rabbit requires you to play Normal Monsters, while with Cat you only had to play Airbellum/Darksoul/Test Tiger/Samnite [/quote] I suppose that's true to an extent, but wouldn't hitting Rabbit make it possible for Laggia to be at a number other than 1, allowing other Decks a chance to play competitively? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
byak Posted March 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 Laggia is still a problem on its own due to Jurrac Guaiba and Evols. I'd rather keep it at one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mido9 Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 [quote name='byakklon Omega' timestamp='1330620795' post='5849875'] Centipede is the ideal card to hit, and now that I think about it more I'd limit United to go with Smoke Signal going to three. Rabbit becomes less of a problem because Leviair doesn't exist in this format. It's comparable to Rescue Cat but Rabbit requires you to play Normal Monsters, while with Cat you only had to play Airbellum/Darksoul/Test Tiger/Samnite [/quote] Are you byak on DN? The same person who got 30 admins to come to his duel to fix a ruling issue? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
This Account is Unplayable Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 [quote name='ɢαlαхy' timestamp='1330620956' post='5849882'] I suppose that's true to an extent, but wouldn't hitting Rabbit make it possible for Laggia to be at a number other than 1, allowing other Decks a chance to play competitively? [/quote] If you limit Laggia you don't kill any decks but you balance one with the fact Leviair is also banned. If you hit Rabbit you kill an entire deck for no good reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CDDRodrigo Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 Tour Guide makes some decks viable, and Leviair is a big nuisance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mido9 Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 [quote name='evilchris' timestamp='1330621060' post='5849885'] If you limit Laggia you don't kill any decks but you balance one with the fact Leviair is also banned. If you hit Rabbit you kill an entire deck for no good reason. [/quote] Limiting laggia kills evols. Hitting tour guide or leviair kills rabbit competitively. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
byak Posted March 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 [quote name='mido9' timestamp='1330621021' post='5849884'] Are you byak on DN? The same person who got 30 admins to come to his duel to fix a ruling issue? [/quote] :3[quote name='mido9' timestamp='1330621295' post='5849887'] Limiting laggia kills evols. Hitting tour guide or leviair kills rabbit competitively. [/quote] Dolkka is a card and you still play Dolkka. It's just that Laggia is pretty damn good while Dolkka can be countered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Synchronized Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 I definitely see the logic behind it. I guess it's just personal experience finding that Laggia in theory is broken, but in play doesn't really come across as such. I actually like that it requires you to think a bit more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mido9 Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 [quote name='byakklon Omega' timestamp='1330621341' post='5849889'] :3 Dolkka is a card and you still play Dolkka. It's just that Laggia is pretty damn good while Dolkka can be countered. [/quote] Dolkka isnt enough of a reward with all the downsides they have to go through it,laggia is an exact reward for the inconsistency and setup they have to go through with. Also,you crazy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
This Account is Unplayable Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 ITT: Evols are deathly inconsistent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 The thread: [b]Byak: [/b]posts list [b]YCM: [/b]best list ever, Byak is a genius [b]Good YCM Players:[/b] I actually disagree to some of this list [b]YCM: [/b]No, Byak`s list is perfect and you are all idiots except for him, he is a god and his divine wisdom cannot be questioned [b]Byak: [/b]Hmm, ya I can see your point with some of the problems, I agree with your suggestions [b]YCM: [/b]Oh, now that Byaks says so, I can completely agree with it [b]Good YCM Players:[/b] What the hell is wrong with all of you? Oh YCM, you so funny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Synchronized Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 [quote name='evilchris' timestamp='1330622876' post='5849915'] ITT: Evols are deathly inconsistent. [/quote] Not saying they're inconsistent, but Laggia does give them a strong win condition of sorts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evilhorus Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 dem fanboys can i have some of them plz i'm sure if you suggested it they'd agree Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.