Left-Hand Shark and Right Hand Shark [Manga]

[~British Soul~]

[center][img]http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20120618182654/yugioh/images/thumb/1/18/LeftHandShark-JP-Manga-ZX-NC.jpg/300px-LeftHandShark-JP-Manga-ZX-NC.jpg[/img][/center]

[center]Unknown Attribute/???/Effect[/center]
[center]Level 3[/center]
[center]If you control a "[url="http://yugioh.wikia.com/wiki/Right_Hand_Shark"]Right Hand Shark[/url]", you can [url="http://yugioh.wikia.com/wiki/Special_Summon"]Special Summon[/url] this card from your [url="http://yugioh.wikia.com/wiki/Hand"]hand[/url] or [url="http://yugioh.wikia.com/wiki/Graveyard"]Graveyard[/url]. When this card is Special Summoned from your hand or Graveyard, you can increase this card's [url="http://yugioh.wikia.com/wiki/Level"]Level[/url] by 1.[/center]
[center]1300/???[/center]

[center][img]http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20120618183045/yugioh/images/thumb/e/e1/RightHandShark-JP-Manga-ZX-NC.jpg/300px-RightHandShark-JP-Manga-ZX-NC.jpg[/img][/center]

[center]Unknown Attribute/???/Effect[/center]
[center]Level 4[/center]
[center]If you [url="http://yugioh.wikia.com/wiki/Control"]control[/url] no [url="http://yugioh.wikia.com/wiki/Monster_Card"]monsters[/url], you can [url="http://yugioh.wikia.com/wiki/Special_Summon"]Special Summon[/url] this card from your [url="http://yugioh.wikia.com/wiki/Graveyard"]Graveyard[/url].[/center]
[center]1500/???[/center]

[center]Le Discuss[/center]

[Kingdom Xathers]

Lefty and Righty seem pretty awesome, since they don't waste your hand advantage. Plus, by the looks of it, they both just laugh at Torrential/Dark Hole

[Organized Chaos]

Self reviving easy Xyz monsters with no costs seems worrying but if they ever do get released, both of their effects will probably be limited to the hand. Their attributes wil probably be abusable : WATER or DARK probs.

[Synchronized]

The first one is bad and the second will be nerfed so that once it's Special Summoned, it's banished. Otherwise, it's way too powerful and won't just be used in Fish, it see play in plenty of other places.

[-Berserker-]

First one is ok, but will probably have Plaguespreader clause. Second one is lolbroken, even without Mass Driver.
The names make me think we will eventually have a Shark Voltron.

[Synchronized]

The first one doesn't seem that bad at all. I mean, it's decent, but if Right-Hand Shark gets the "When this card leaves the field after being Special Summoned by this effect: Banish it" clause, there really won't be too many issues with Left-Hand Shark outside of a dedicated build. Which, realistically, would be good for the game because it would allow Fish-style Decks that aren't FTK's to actually have a chance at being competitive.

[Blake]

[quote name='Neo Galaxy' timestamp='1340054502' post='5958883']
Which, realistically, would be good for the game because it would allow Fish-style Decks that aren't FTK's to actually have a chance at being competitive.
[/quote]
Whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

No, that's absolutely wrong. A +1 from the grave for no cost other than the same as CyDra is terrible design. It's level 4, so banishing it doesn't do even the slightest bit of good for balance. Nothing deserves to be competitive if it requires broken cards to do so. Even if it's not the most broken thing, it's broken.

Also, said banishing clause doesn't work, cause Xyz just laugh =|

[Synchronized]

[quote name='Yuzuru Otonashi' timestamp='1340062551' post='5958928']
Whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

No, that's absolutely wrong. A +1 from the grave for no cost other than the same as CyDra is terrible design. It's level 4, so banishing it doesn't do even the slightest bit of good for balance. Nothing deserves to be competitive if it requires broken cards to do so. Even if it's not the most broken thing, it's broken.

Also, said banishing clause doesn't work, cause Xyz just laugh =|
[/quote]

By that logic why aren't cards like W. Nebula Meteorite and Rekindling banned?

They offer ridiculous plusses and yet they don't make much of an impact at all.

To think with the sense that "any card that does 'x' is broken", while accurate, isn't really effective when dealing with the Metagame. Sure, it's not necessarily the most balanced card, but it's not significant enough to do anything to any of the top Decks, and it existing allows other Decks to have a chance to be competitive.

Even [i]with[/i] a card like that, Fish aren't going to go around beating Dino Rabbit and Chaos Dragons. Why waste time hitting something like that when there are way more important cards to be hit?

[TheTurtleOnceCalledGod]

They might release these with slight nerfs/limits, or even once per duel clauses. But overall, Shark is awesome.

[Blake]

[quote name='Neo Galaxy' timestamp='1340066223' post='5958962']
By that logic why aren't cards like W. Nebula Meteorite and [u][i][size=6][b]Rekindling[/b][/size][/i][/u] banned?

They offer ridiculous plusses and yet they don't make much of an impact at all.
[/quote]
This just proves how incredibly ignorant of the game you are. Guess what's Tier 1 in the OCG right now? LAVALS.

Exodia's bad for the game, why isn't [i]it [/i]banned? Because Konami doesn't care unless it tops regularly. Tewart spelled this out like a month ago, for those who had trouble figuring it out.

[quote name='Neo Galaxy' timestamp='1340066223' post='5958962']
To think with the sense that "any card that does 'x' is broken", while accurate, isn't really effective when dealing with the Metagame. Sure, it's not necessarily the most balanced card, but it's not significant enough to do anything to any of the top Decks, and it existing allows other Decks to have a chance to be competitive.
[/quote]
Logic used here: It's not as broken as other stuff, so it's fine.

If a broken card is needed to BE meta, it shouldn't be meta, and there's no way you argue that anything deserves broken cards. It existing is begging for some weird O/FTK to come along. Hell, as is, it's a 2 card OTK with Mass Driver, despite Driver being banned, other stuff could use it in a similar sense, I'm sure.. It allows you to normal summon Xyz provided you have no field and would allow ridiculous combos that shouldn't exist. How on Earth is that GOOD for the game?

[quote name='Neo Galaxy' timestamp='1340066223' post='5958962']
Even [i]with[/i] a card like that, Fish aren't going to go around beating Dino Rabbit and Chaos Dragons. Why waste time hitting something like that when there are way more important cards to be hit?
[/quote]
Why waste time printing broken cards like this when balanced stuff could be printed?

[Synchronized]

[quote=Yuzuru Otanashi]
This just proves how incredibly ignorant of the game you are. Guess what's Tier 1 in the OCG right now? LAVALS.

Exodia's bad for the game, why isn't [i]it [/i]banned? Because Konami doesn't care unless it tops regularly. Tewart spelled this out like a month ago, for those who had trouble figuring it out.[/quote]

Lavals aren't really Tier 1, they're much closer to Tier 2. They top some events and stuff, but Inzektors are the most dominant Deck over there by a longshot. I just had a long debate over this exact topic with some people at Locals yesterday, and I take the same stance. Until Lavals give a reason that they should be hit, there's no point. Banning things just because in theory they look as though they could be damaging to the game is just a stupid mentality, in my opinion.

That said, I do agree that Rekindling will eventually get hit, and I agree with that, as well. But do I think it needs to go to 0? No. Because that makes Lavals a useless Deck, when putting it to 1 would still allow some plays, albeit nowhere near as effective. Sure, cards like Rekindling [i]shouldn't[/i] have been printed, but they are, and yet they've still yet to make too much of an impact here in the TCG, at least.

[quote=Yuzuru Otanashi]Logic used here: It's not as broken as other stuff, so it's fine.

If a broken card is needed to BE meta, it shouldn't be meta, and there's no way you argue that anything deserves broken cards. It existing is begging for some weird O/FTK to come along. Hell, as is, it's a 2 card OTK with Mass Driver, despite Driver being banned, other stuff could use it in a similar sense, I'm sure.. It allows you to normal summon Xyz provided you have no field and would allow ridiculous combos that shouldn't exist. How on Earth is that GOOD for the game?[/quote]

Did I say that? No, what I meant was, if you want to ban every card that could be broken in theory, we'd have an extremely boring game full of Normals. Unfortunately, the power creep in this game has made it so a lot of cards that used to be broken are no longer so, or at least not as much as they were. I do agree that a lot of cards need to be look at on a case-by-case basis instead of just making one of those "theory" lists that just bans anything that looks like it could do tons of damage.

Mass Driver is banned, as it should be, and as it has proven it should be. However, there's no other OTK's with this because you can't use it with things like Cannon Soldier due to the fact that you can't control another monster to bring it back. Like I said, the "banish" clause would balance it greatly. Even if you use it for Xyz, that doesn't make it any different than things along the lines of Plaguespreader Zombie and Quillbolt Hedgehog. It's not broken; it's just a [i]good[/i] card. Of course, as is, it is broken, but you and I both know it won't be released without a nerf so it's pointless to pretend.

[quote=Yuzuri Otanashi]
Why waste time printing broken cards like this when balanced stuff could be printed?
[/quote]

I have no idea why they print or make cards like this, but the fact is they do, and as players we adapt and build different Decks depending on what we're given. Trust me, there are plenty of cards much more broken than this that have way more of an effect on the game. It Special Summons itself from the Graveyard, allowing you to make an easy Xyz. Okay. So? It's good, but it's not broken if you can only plus off it once.

Without knownig what they're actually going to do with it once it's released IRL, there's only so much of an argument I can make. But the card is here, and assuming it gets printed, it's not like it's going to be so broken that it requires list attention. It'll just boost the plays that some Decks can make.

[Blake]

[quote name='Neo Galaxy' timestamp='1340069213' post='5958982']
Lavals aren't really Tier 1, they're much closer to Tier 2. They top some events and stuff, but Inzektors are the most dominant Deck over there by a longshot. I just had a long debate over this exact topic with some people at Locals yesterday, and I take the same stance. Until Lavals give a reason that they should be hit, there's no point. Banning things just because in theory they look as though they could be damaging to the game is just a stupid mentality, in my opinion.
[/quote]
Just because it's not THE best deck doesn't mean it's not Tier 1. They've given a reason to be hit.

The "only hit if it tops" is just as idiotic as Konami. Care to address the Exodia point? You didn't even reply to the one thing that completely shatters any stance you have.

[quote name='Neo Galaxy' timestamp='1340069213' post='5958982']
That said, I do agree that Rekindling will eventually get hit, and I agree with that, as well. But do I think it needs to go to 0? No. Because that makes Lavals a useless Deck, when putting it to 1 would still allow some plays, albeit nowhere near as effective. Sure, cards like Rekindling [i]shouldn't[/i] have been printed, but they are, and yet they've still yet to make too much of an impact here in the TCG, at least.
[/quote]
A +4 that summons Multiple Synchros and/or Xyz shouldn't be banned...? It's like Gateway of the Six. 1 can be GG. Lavals don't deserve it and it's idiotic to let something hideous live in the name of "diversity". I suppose dragons "deserve" REDRUM and FuFu?

[quote name='Neo Galaxy' timestamp='1340069213' post='5958982']
Did I say that? No, what I meant was, if you want to ban every card that could be broken in theory, we'd have an extremely boring game full of Normals. Unfortunately, the power creep in this game has made it so a lot of cards that used to be broken are no longer so, or at least not as much as they were. I do agree that a lot of cards need to be look at on a case-by-case basis instead of just making one of those "theory" lists that just bans anything that looks like it could do tons of damage.
[/quote]
No, I'm not saying ban every card. I'm saying you have such a small scope of what could be broken and what is broken. W. Nebula, Rekindling, Judgment Dragon, and lots of other stuff need to die because broken cards do NOT need to exist. I'm not protesting power creep, because I like the speed of the game, but some things are simply problem cards on paper so much so that they need to die. Exodia, Countdown, Brionac, things that make burn viable, Rekindling, Judgment Dragon, Gaia Dragon, etc. Just because the impact isn't there does NOT mean that they restrict the very design you treat as something that should be free to exist. Gaia Dragon's a BIG one here because of how it makes otherwise balanced cards much more broken because it takes away their drawbacks.

[quote name='Neo Galaxy' timestamp='1340069213' post='5958982']
Mass Driver is banned, as it should be, and as it has proven it should be. However, there's no other OTK's with this because you can't use it with things like Cannon Soldier due to the fact that you can't control another monster to bring it back. Like I said, the "banish" clause would balance it greatly. Even if you use it for Xyz, that doesn't make it any different than things along the lines of Plaguespreader Zombie and Quillbolt Hedgehog. It's not broken; it's just a [i]good[/i] card. Of course, as is, it is broken, but you and I both know it won't be released without a nerf so it's pointless to pretend.
[/quote]
I never said it had to be a burn OTK. Banish clause doesn't do much because then you just Leviair it back and move on, waiting for another time your field is clear to get back on your feet for free. It's not the most broken thing in the world, but more broken stuff shouldn't be printed, even if it is subtle, especially when it's a +1 from grave.

[quote name='Neo Galaxy' timestamp='1340069213' post='5958982']
I have no idea why they print or make cards like this, but the fact is they do, and as players we adapt and build different Decks depending on what we're given. Trust me, there are plenty of cards much more broken than this that have way more of an effect on the game. It Special Summons itself from the Graveyard, allowing you to make an easy Xyz. Okay. So? It's good, but it's not broken if you can only plus off it once.
[/quote]
Logic used here: It's not as broken as other stuff, so it's fine.

You can claim that's not your logic all you want, but your actions prove otherwise repeatedly. What makes it even BETTER is that you're advocating Konami's printing of this, then act like you don't know why they would. Pick a side and stick to it.

You can plus off of it multiple times. I mean, you can SS CyDra multiple times in one duel, why not this? Oh, right, it banishes... But Xyz don't care about that and it makes a Lv. 4 Leviair Target. Sure, Quillbolt isn't used much in Synchro Decks, but that doesn't mean it's not abusable. It's a viable tech in most of them.

[quote name='Neo Galaxy' timestamp='1340069213' post='5958982']
Without knownig what they're actually going to do with it once it's released IRL, there's only so much of an argument I can make. But the card is here, and assuming it gets printed, it's not like it's going to be so broken that it requires list attention. It'll just boost the plays that some Decks can make.
[/quote]
The same was said of Grapha

Look where that ended.

I only say Grapha because it's a ridiculous +1 from the Grave for no reason whatsoever, not actually comparing it to Grapha. Revival cards are bad design in general. Even though they don't always push the envelope, more of them existing is certainly NOT a good idea.

[Synchronized]

[quote name='Yuzuru Otonashi' timestamp='1340070735' post='5958995']
Just because it's not THE best deck doesn't mean it's not Tier 1. They've given a reason to be hit.

The "only hit if it tops" is just as idiotic as Konami. Care to address the Exodia point? You didn't even reply to the one thing that completely shatters any stance you have.[/quote]

I actually meant to address the Exodia point, but I didn't, and I apologize for that. With Exodia, the problem becomes it's a strategy that the opponent (for the most part) has no way to play around. It completely eliminates player interaction. If I'm just playing a bunch of draw cards while my opponent just sits there, not only does my opponent have no realistic way of getting around my plays (especially if I'm going first), it's not really a game of skill anymore, it's just me drawing and the game ending. Exodia has no counters, and the more draw cards are printed, the faster the Deck gets.

With Rekindling, sure, it generates a ton of plusses. I definitely don't think it should be at 3, or even 2. As for completely banned, I'm not sure. I haven't actually played the Deck enough to know it if makes enough of an impact. But at least there are ways to play around Rekindling, and I'm not just sitting and doing nothing while my opponent draws until he wins.

I could be completely wrong. Maybe it should be banned. But I've yet to see that actually put into action - that was my point. Just because a card looks great in theory doesn't mean it's necessarily going to [i]be[/i] great. Lavals seem like they might be really good here. If that's the case, I'll certainly change my stance because I was proven wrong.

[quote=Yuzuru Otanashi]A +4 that summons Multiple Synchros and/or Xyz shouldn't be banned...? It's like Gateway of the Six. 1 can be GG. Lavals don't deserve it and it's idiotic to let something hideous live in the name of "diversity". I suppose dragons "deserve" REDRUM and FuFu?[/quote]

Absolutely not. Future Fusion is [i]extremely[/i] broken and way more Decks than Dragons can make use of it. Normally, I would've advocated for it to stay at 1 and hit FHD because it allows some Decks the ability to make good plays, but that was 2-3 years ago. Now, with cards like the Omni-Heroes and stuff, in addition to Five Headed Dragon and the proven impact it's had on the game, I think Future Fusion should go.

Red-Eyes Darkness Metal Dragon is again, bad card design, but only now that it [i]can[/i] be utilized. When it was printed, I wouldn't have said it should be banned because there was no way to consistently run it and win with it. That's what I meant. Now, the power creep has made it so REDMD is far too powerful, and I think it needs list attention, as well.

[quote=Yuzuru Otanashi]No, I'm not saying ban every card. I'm saying you have such a small scope of what could be broken and what is broken. W. Nebula, Rekindling, Judgment Dragon, and lots of other stuff need to die because broken cards do NOT need to exist. I'm not protesting power creep, because I like the speed of the game, but some things are simply problem cards on paper so much so that they need to die. Exodia, Countdown, Brionac, things that make burn viable, Rekindling, Judgment Dragon, Gaia Dragon, etc. Just because the impact isn't there does NOT mean that they restrict the very design you treat as something that should be free to exist. Gaia Dragon's a BIG one here because of how it makes otherwise balanced cards much more broken because it takes away their drawbacks.[/quote]

Gaia Dragon I agree needs list attention, as well. I think it should go to 1, if not 0, because it doesn't serve much of a purpose [i]aside[/i] from removing drawbacks. Brionac I diagree with, but that's only because the loops it has aren't really that significant anymore, and there's a reason it's hardly run anymore outside of select Decks. Now if Xyz become less relevant and Brionac becomes more impactful, then I'll agree it should go.

I guess where you and I differ is that I prefer to actually see the card in action and know it should get hit. I personally think the forbidden list shouldn't have anything it doesn't need to have. I don't think that cards that don't top tournaments need to be banned. I mis-worded that in my last post and I realize where the misconception came from. Cards like Wind-Up Hunter that have proven to be a problem and decrease player-player interaction are not good for the game because of what they symbolize, and they detract from the actual point of the game.

Judgment Dragon was broken at one point, and I suppose in theory it still is, but the power creep has made it irrelevant. Why bother putting it on the list when it's at 3 and people don't even use it because it just doesn't compare to the game's top bosses right now?

[quote=Yuzuru Otanashi]I never said it had to be a burn OTK. Banish clause doesn't do much because then you just Leviair it back and move on, waiting for another time your field is clear to get back on your feet for free. It's not the most broken thing in the world, but more broken stuff shouldn't be printed, even if it is subtle, especially when it's a +1 from grave.

Logic used here: It's not as broken as other stuff, so it's fine.

You can claim that's not your logic all you want, but your actions prove otherwise repeatedly. What makes it even BETTER is that you're advocating Konami's printing of this, then act like you don't know why they would. Pick a side and stick to it.

You can plus off of it multiple times. I mean, you can SS CyDra multiple times in one duel, why not this? Oh, right, it banishes... But Xyz don't care about that and it makes a Lv. 4 Leviair Target. Sure, Quillbolt isn't used much in Synchro Decks, but that doesn't mean it's not abusable. It's a viable tech in most of them.

The same was said of Grapha

Look where that ended.

I only say Grapha because it's a ridiculous +1 from the Grave for no reason whatsoever, not actually comparing it to Grapha. Revival cards are bad design in general. Even though they don't always push the envelope, more of them existing is certainly NOT a good idea.
[/quote]

I agree as it pertains to Grapha. Especially because with Grapha, there are more plays than just the Special Summon. The fact that it pops things [i]and[/i] has the potential to do even more than that, as well as making it nearly impossible to eliminate is the problem. Grapha generates way too many plusses for little to no effort. However I do think that if Grapha had a banish clause, meaning you could only use it once, it would be significantly less of a problem.

I want a balanced game, too, but looking at a card like Right Hand Shark, I don't see something broken, I see something that would allow Fish Decks more plays and options, while not being so devastating that it needs list attention.

[Blake]

[quote name='Neo Galaxy' timestamp='1340072517' post='5959007']
I actually meant to address the Exodia point, but I didn't, and I apologize for that. With Exodia, the problem becomes it's a strategy that the opponent (for the most part) has no way to play around. It completely eliminates player interaction. If I'm just playing a bunch of draw cards while my opponent just sits there, not only does my opponent have no realistic way of getting around my plays (especially if I'm going first), it's not really a game of skill anymore, it's just me drawing and the game ending. Exodia has no counters, and the more draw cards are printed, the faster the Deck gets.
[/quote]
This... in no way supports your point, it's just you going "Exception".


[quote name='Neo Galaxy' timestamp='1340072517' post='5959007']
With Rekindling, sure, it generates a ton of plusses. I definitely don't think it should be at 3, or even 2. As for completely banned, I'm not sure. I haven't actually played the Deck enough to know it if makes enough of an impact. But at least there are ways to play around Rekindling, and I'm not just sitting and doing nothing while my opponent draws until he wins.
[/quote]
If cards are played right, you can OTK with Rekindling. You pretty much are on a clock until they have Grave/Hand set up (Y'know, that double Foolish and Card Car D?), and then have to survive the assault if they make it in time.


[quote name='Neo Galaxy' timestamp='1340072517' post='5959007']
I could be completely wrong. Maybe it should be banned. But I've yet to see that actually put into action - that was my point. Just because a card looks great in theory doesn't mean it's necessarily going to [i]be[/i] great. Lavals seem like they might be really good here. If that's the case, I'll certainly change my stance because I was proven wrong.
[/quote]
There's a difference between Rekindling in Theory and Quillbolt in Theory. Rekindling was [i]always[/i] blatantly broken. The term "Rekindling Syndrome" applie(d)(s) to cards that were hideously broken but their decks weren't quite good enough. When you have 6 Foolishes with monster foolishes, it is pretty easy for Rekindling to be beyond broken.


[quote name='Neo Galaxy' timestamp='1340072517' post='5959007']
Absolutely not. Future Fusion is [i]extremely[/i] broken and way more Decks than Dragons can make use of it. Normally, I would've advocated for it to stay at 1 and hit FHD because it allows some Decks the ability to make good plays, but that was 2-3 years ago. Now, with cards like the Omni-Heroes and stuff, in addition to Five Headed Dragon and the proven impact it's had on the game, I think Future Fusion should go.
[/quote]
Uhhh, FuFu was always the problem and what should've gone. Omnis changed nothing. Multi Foolish = bad.


[quote name='Neo Galaxy' timestamp='1340072517' post='5959007']
Red-Eyes Darkness Metal Dragon is again, bad card design, but only now that it [i]can[/i] be utilized. When it was printed, I wouldn't have said it should be banned because there was no way to consistently run it and win with it. That's what I meant. Now, the power creep has made it so REDMD is far too powerful, and I think it needs list attention, as well.
[/quote]
REKINDLING SYNDROME. It was always hideously bad card design and there's no way to defend that. It's been broken from the moment it was made IRL. Consistency has nothing to do with if an individual card is broken, and look now. It's all in the damn meta because it was printed and never prevented.


[quote name='Neo Galaxy' timestamp='1340072517' post='5959007']
Gaia Dragon I agree needs list attention, as well. I think it should go to 1, if not 0, because it doesn't serve much of a purpose [i]aside[/i] from removing drawbacks. Brionac I diagree with, but that's only because the loops it has aren't really that significant anymore, and there's a reason it's hardly run anymore outside of select Decks. Now if Xyz become less relevant and Brionac becomes more impactful, then I'll agree it should go.
[/quote]
So, Gaia Dragon, something with lots of Theory Uses should go? This contradicts your entire point. While it does make a meta impact, it, alone, does not make enough of one to have you behind it dying. There are 4 other big problem cards in Hieratics, all but one of which need to be hit/go before this does. One of them is only broken BECAUSE of this.

Anything that makes loops like Brio does should go, because one of them will eventually be significant. You cannot deny that, your point just says "If it tops, it goes". Or, we could send it NOW, it could stop making loops, and card design could be more free.


[quote name='Neo Galaxy' timestamp='1340072517' post='5959007']
I guess where you and I differ is that I prefer to actually see the card in action and know it should get hit. I personally think the forbidden list shouldn't have anything it doesn't need to have. I don't think that cards that don't top tournaments need to be banned. I mis-worded that in my last post and I realize where the misconception came from. Cards like Wind-Up Hunter that have proven to be a problem and decrease player-player interaction are not good for the game because of what they symbolize, and they detract from the actual point of the game.
[/quote]
But other stuff, like Rekindling and REDRUM, just sleep below, waiting to be woken, then wreak hell. Some cards are plain broken, and need to hit the list nonetheless because of how broken they are. You cannot call cards like that good design, and it's incredibly close minded to say "I WON'T BELIEVE UNTIL I SEE". It's that idiocy that causes Konami to overlook problems.



[quote name='Neo Galaxy' timestamp='1340072517' post='5959007']
Judgment Dragon was broken at one point, and I suppose in theory it still is, but the power creep has made it irrelevant. Why bother putting it on the list when it's at 3 and people don't even use it because it just doesn't compare to the game's top bosses right now?
[/quote]
Because if it was @0, Lightsworns could have other stuff back and actually be viable in a higher tier because the stuff is no longer broken? JD's the big problem with the deck and it weighs them down because of it.


[quote name='Neo Galaxy' timestamp='1340072517' post='5959007']
I agree as it pertains to Grapha. Especially because with Grapha, there are more plays than just the Special Summon. The fact that it pops things [i]and[/i] has the potential to do even more than that, as well as making it nearly impossible to eliminate is the problem. Grapha generates way too many plusses for little to no effort. However I do think that if Grapha had a banish clause, meaning you could only use it once, it would be significantly less of a problem.
[/quote]
Then why is Foolishing Grapha not only a viable move, but a good one? Because it's a series of +1s. Yes, the popping is busted, but that's just icing on top of the already sweet, sweet cake. It would still be extremely broken if that had been left off.

And the banish thing just promotes using it for Xyz more after the swing. Yes, it balances it a bit, but not an insane amount. As more R8s come out, that matters less and less. As it is, we have Heliopolis, Giant Killer, etc. who can just put the Graphas right back in the Grave.


[quote name='Neo Galaxy' timestamp='1340072517' post='5959007']
I want a balanced game, too, but looking at a card like Right Hand Shark, I don't see something broken, I see something that would allow Fish Decks more plays and options, while not being so devastating that it needs list attention.
[/quote]
Even a small push can be too much at times, fairly commonly at that. Not saying it itself would deserve it, but it could do way too much because it's a terribly designed card in its own right. Not all badly designed cards deserve the list, but you shouldn't be vying for them to be released, either. Blindly following Konami's viewpoint just leads to ruining the game even more than it already has, because Konami pretty much chooses who it listens to. We don't want Right and Left hand printed.

[Synchronized]

We can agree that perhaps, if both cards were given a "once per duel" clause, they'd be far less impactful, no?

[WhoAreYou?]

These two would become limited if they were released. It's obvious why, too.

[HSektor]

Unknown Attribute/???/Effect

Level 4

If you control no monsters, you can Special Summon this card from your Graveyard. This card cannot be Tributed except for a Tribute Summon. When this card is send to the graveyard or is banished after being Special Summoned by this effect: return it to the bottom of your deck.

1500/???

SO HARD TO NERF.

[Blake]

[quote name='HSektor' timestamp='1340560284' post='5961907']
Unknown Attribute/???/Effect

Level 4

If you control no monsters, you can Special Summon this card from your Graveyard. This card cannot be Tributed except for a Tribute Summon. When this card is send to the graveyard or is banished after being Special Summoned by this effect: return it to the bottom of your deck.

1500/???

SO HARD TO NERF.
[/quote]
Congrats, you turned it into absolute crap, thus proving it's hard to nerf.

[DARKPLANT RISING]

Right:
"Cannot be Tributed for a Tribute Summon or an activation of an effect. When you control no monsters, you can Special Summon this card from your Graveyard. If this card is Special Summoned by its own effect, Banish it when it becomes an Xyz Material Monster, or it is removed from the field."

Done.

[Blake]

[quote name='Darkplant - VENOM' timestamp='1340573574' post='5961988']
Right:
"Cannot be Tributed for a Tribute Summon or an activation of an effect. When you control no monsters, you can Special Summon this card from your Graveyard. If this card is Special Summoned by its own effect, Banish it when it becomes an Xyz Material Monster, or it is removed from the field."

Done.
[/quote]
And then Leviair exists and, as mentioned, banishing means nothing anymore.

=T

[Synchronized]

[quote name='Yuzuru Otonashi' timestamp='1340576224' post='5962007']
And then Leviair exists and, as mentioned, banishing means nothing anymore.

=T
[/quote]

This is true, but with the changes he made, that's irrelevant. Why waste a Leviair to bring this back? Without being able to be Tributed, it becomes far less significant, and isn't necessarily "broken" anymore.

[WhoAreYou?]

Dear Grapha,
We're sick and tired of you reviving yourself so damn often, so we made a water clone of you... No, we made TWO waters clones of you. So you can SUCK IT!!
Sincerely,
Left- and Right-Hand Shark

[HSektor]

[quote name='Yuzuru Otonashi' timestamp='1340564960' post='5961938']
Congrats, you turned it into absolute crap, thus proving it's hard to nerf.
[/quote]

I don't see why it turned into crap. If it was WATER or DARK you could just send it to the graveyard again using Undine or Armageddon Knight after it hits the deck.

Alternative wording:
"When you control no monsters, you can Special Summon this card from your Graveyard. Each player can only activate the effect of 'Right Hand Shark' once per Duel."