Agro Posted December 9, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 9, 2012 [quote name='slayer_supreme' timestamp='1355019433' post='6088683'] And Heavy Storm and Dark Hole. [/quote]Dark Hole I don't mind. Heavy, maybe, but honestly, I feel it would force better play by both players so they won't set their entire hand after the opponent uses Heavy early. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeppeli Gyro Supreme Posted December 9, 2012 Report Share Posted December 9, 2012 [quote name='Agro' timestamp='1355022431' post='6088713'] Dark Hole I don't mind. Heavy, maybe, but honestly, I feel it would force better play by both players so they won't set their entire hand after the opponent uses Heavy early. [/quote] You shouldn't be using heavy early unless it's going to give you massive advantage or pushing for game, and being able to break the opponent twice or be a bad player is BS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toffee. Posted December 9, 2012 Report Share Posted December 9, 2012 [quote name='Agro' timestamp='1355019279' post='6088681'] But could you come back from them? Do they end the game if Magician adds them and you use them again? Not from what I can see. The majority of those cards are fine being used an extra time, especially considering how slow Magician is. Goat Control didn't worry about broken cards like Delinquent Duo or BLS because they could still make plays to come back from them, no problem. [/quote] I guess. And I think it might prompt people to maindeck a few Apprentice Magicians, just because of it. So I dunno', we would have to see what happens, if this card actually [i]did[/i] come off the list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ihop Posted December 9, 2012 Report Share Posted December 9, 2012 We have to ban- Gateway Card Destruction Storm Reborn Rekindling Miracle Fusion Mind Control Limiter Removal Avarice (you don't need to ban Royal Tribute, it can't be targeted) Which would be detrimental to the game as some of these aren't even broken. It's not coming back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agro Posted December 9, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 9, 2012 [quote name='Kettleblack' timestamp='1355048243' post='6088969'] Mind Control Limiter Removal [/quote]I disagree and everything else listed should be hit anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Expelsword Posted December 9, 2012 Report Share Posted December 9, 2012 Limiter Removal is completely busted. They practically made it up just so Duke and Zane could make people look the fool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Expelsword Posted December 9, 2012 Report Share Posted December 9, 2012 Oh, and isn't Tsukuyomi unbanned? That makes the possibility of this card returning somewhere on the order of 0%. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mido9 Posted December 9, 2012 Report Share Posted December 9, 2012 Tsuk + MoF is a lot more situational than it looks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strider Tigerwolf Posted December 9, 2012 Report Share Posted December 9, 2012 ....I don't want this to come back. I really don't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sleepy Posted December 10, 2012 Report Share Posted December 10, 2012 I agree that this card should get a chance. If we talk about Aprentice Magician, it means it needs some dedication. If we talk about the problematic Spells, most of those deserve the baned position anyways. Plus, as a FLIP, that should count a bit as a balancing factor. You'll use up your Normal Summon to Set a weak monster that will most likely be destroyed in the process, and it's not like many decks Set that many monsters nowadays. Some key cards very occationally, so you'll know when you see it coming. it's a relatively slow play. This is more of a control card, because your opponent should see what you are getting back and adjust accordingly. Unless everything in the game is OTKs... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmpoleMew Posted December 10, 2012 Report Share Posted December 10, 2012 everything in the game [i]is [/i]otks and the stuff that isn't (so like 2 decks) are prevent otks and cherry-tap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lonk Posted December 10, 2012 Report Share Posted December 10, 2012 Ban those problematic Spells that promote spam, and this card can come back. I honestly don't mind seeing multiple Heavy Storms and Dark Holes anymore, since they aren't really problematic nowadays (Was that Konami's intention with the recent sets they have made!?). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strider Tigerwolf Posted December 10, 2012 Report Share Posted December 10, 2012 I say balance the meta by bringing everything into a much more slower format. Instead of hitting just the cards, hit the game's design as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Expelsword Posted December 10, 2012 Report Share Posted December 10, 2012 No one will tolerate an overhaul of the rules. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strider Tigerwolf Posted December 10, 2012 Report Share Posted December 10, 2012 Overhaul vs. Current FTK/OTK meta... I'll go with Overhaul thank-you very much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ihop Posted December 10, 2012 Report Share Posted December 10, 2012 I'll quit if game mechanics are overhauled. The game is fine as it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan Alda Posted December 10, 2012 Report Share Posted December 10, 2012 Isn't it funny how all of the really cool cards that first came out are now either totally irrelevant or broken to bits? Magician of Faith could cause so much trouble if it came back. A retrained version with a minor cost or caveat, on the other hand, could be nice (see Lightning Vortex, Radiant Mirror Force, Fishborg Launcher). My good old Vilewares would love it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agro Posted December 10, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 10, 2012 [quote name='Stan Alda' timestamp='1355159870' post='6089896'] Isn't it funny how all of the really cool cards that first came out are now either totally irrelevant or broken to bits? Magician of Faith could cause so much trouble if it came back. A retrained version with a minor cost or caveat, on the other hand, could be nice (see Lightning Vortex, Radiant Mirror Force, Fishborg Launcher). My good old Vilewares would love it. [/quote]Honestly speaking, Dark Hole and Torrential are fine... @1 -.- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan Alda Posted December 10, 2012 Report Share Posted December 10, 2012 [quote name='Agro' timestamp='1355168043' post='6089979'] Honestly speaking, Dark Hole and Torrential are fine... @1 -.- [/quote] Those aren't bad, I guess. But apart from those...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agro Posted December 10, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 10, 2012 Call of the Haunted, Soul Release (technically), Fissure... Sangan, Musician King (because Instant Fusion and Arcanite), Solemn Judgment, Mirror Force, Heavy Storm partially, Upstart Goblin, Mystical Space Typhoon, any of the destroyed-by-battle searchers, and Messenger of Peace. And that's all in the first 3 packs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan Alda Posted December 10, 2012 Report Share Posted December 10, 2012 [quote name='Agro' timestamp='1355169003' post='6089994'] Call of the Haunted, Soul Release (technically), Fissure... Sangan, Musician King (because Instant Fusion and Arcanite), Solemn Judgment, Mirror Force, Heavy Storm partially, Upstart Goblin, Mystical Space Typhoon, any of the destroyed-by-battle searchers, and Messenger of Peace. And that's all in the first 3 packs. [/quote] ...dammit. This would probably turn into a "What have the Romans ever done for us" gag if it went further, so I'll just say I stand corrected. I still think that MoF could use a less cheap retrained version. Viz: [i]FLIP: [/i][i]Add 1 Spell Card from your Graveyard to your hand; you cannot activate that card during the turn you activated this effect[/i][i]. [/i]Correct my grammar if need be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agro Posted December 10, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 10, 2012 [quote name='Stan Alda' timestamp='1355169335' post='6090002'] ...dammit. This would probably turn into a "What have the Romans ever done for us" gag if it went further, so I'll just say I stand corrected. I still think that MoF could use a less cheap retrained version. Viz: [i]FLIP: [/i][i]Add 1 Spell Card from your Graveyard to your hand; you cannot activate that card during the turn you activated this effect[/i][i]. [/i]Correct my grammar if need be. [/quote]>Sets MoF > Opponent runs it over on their turn > Adds Spell > Plays it on my turn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan Alda Posted December 10, 2012 Report Share Posted December 10, 2012 [quote name='Agro' timestamp='1355169627' post='6090010'] >Sets MoF > Opponent runs it over on their turn > Adds Spell > Plays it on my turn [/quote] Does not compute. Elaborate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agro Posted December 10, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 10, 2012 [quote name='Stan Alda' timestamp='1355169766' post='6090012'] Does not compute. Elaborate further. [/quote]I'm activating the effect on the opponent's turn... so I can activate the spell on mine... just like normal... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan Alda Posted December 10, 2012 Report Share Posted December 10, 2012 [quote name='Agro' timestamp='1355169797' post='6090013'] I'm activating the effect on the opponent's turn... so I can activate the spell on mine... just like normal... [/quote] Apparently my knowledge isn't just rusty, it's outright corroded. Lemme rephrase that: [i]FLIP: Add 1 Spell Card from your Graveyard to your hand; you cannot activate that card until your next End Phase after you activated this effect. [/i]How about that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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