Survival of the Fittest [SHSP]

[Blake]

Target 1 Dinosaur-Type monster you control; it gains 1000 ATK. When it destroys a monster by battle and sends it to the Graveyard: You can have it attacks 1 monster your opponent controls once more only.

 

Apparently, it's a permanent effect placed on the target.

 

Mistrans pls

[Althemia]

Jurrac Guaiba becomes the nuts. Good god.. 

[Lonk]

All of my yes for this card, just yes.

[ihop]

It's great if it's permanent, Jurracs become actually decent as you can actually make a Shock Master with Guaiba while clearing their field which is amazing.

[Lonk]

Target 1 Dinosaur-Type monster you control; it gains 1000 ATK. When it destroys a monster by battle and sends it to the Graveyard: You can have it attacks 1 monster your opponent controls once more only.

 

Apparently, it's a permanent effect placed on the target.

 

Mistrans pls

 

Well, since it doesn't say "End Phase", the eff IS permanant.  However, the mutliple attack thing looks like an "only once" thing.

[newhat]

Yes, I'd imagine the extra attack is once only, since it says "once more only".

 

There's still no easy way to use Jurrac Impact.

[玄魔の王]

Guys, it's an Equip Trap.

[Blake]

Guys, it's an Equip Trap.

... Uh?

 

Unless you have a translation that explicitly says so, no, it isn't.

[玄魔の王]

I do, Manjyoume Thunder's translation.

[Lonk]

... Uh?

 

Unless you have a translation that explicitly says so, no, it isn't.

 

The translation is updated and says that it is an equip trap.  It also says that the double attack feature is continuous as well.

[evilfusion]

I figured the attack thing was just like BLS, it attacks once more per Battle Phase, even if the second attack destroys a monster.

 

Being an Equip Trap just makes it inherently true.

[玄魔の王]

Sadly, being an Equip Trap kills it, because now it'll just get MST'd at attack declaration.

[evilfusion]

Sadly, being an Equip Trap kills it, because now it'll just get MST'd at attack declaration.

 

Damage Step?

[Blake]

Sadly, being an Equip Trap kills it, because now it'll just get MST'd at attack declaration.

Sadly, being a continuous trap kills Horn of the Phantom Beast, because now it'll just get MST'd at attack declaration.

[Toffee.]

Lets face it, if this truly was a permanent gain, and not an equip, Guiba/Hydrogeddon would be flat-out ridiculous.

[heraldry_lord]

Thank goodness it's not permanent ATK gain.  Hydrogeddon and Guaiba (mostly because of the Evolzars) are pretty annoying as is, though I could see this as a tech in Dino Rabbit builds that still exist.

[玄魔の王]

Yeah, you can activate it in the Damage Step initially. Then upon second attack declaration they'll simply blow it up. Yes it'd be broken as a permanent gain, but unlike Horn this doesn't replace itself after one attack.

[Blake]

Yeah, you can activate it in the Damage Step initially. Then upon second attack declaration they'll simply blow it up. Yes it'd be broken as a permanent gain, but unlike Horn this doesn't replace itself after one attack.

It's a +1 if it goes off, a +3 if on Guaiba/Hydrogeddon. Oh no, it can be MST'd, whatever shall I do.

 

You have your head up your ass if you think this isn't better than Horn, as a support card, considering Horn is winmoar as can be. The reason this is good is because it contributes to monsters that float on a swing by allowing them to swing twice with large bodies. Hell, it's good on a generic Dino because it's a free +1000 and a double swing which, you know, kills the opp's advantage.

[玄魔の王]

You say it's a +1 like that's guaranteed. If you get MST'd on that second attack, your 1700 or 1600 dies to whatever your opponent had, meaning you net even and your plans went to pot. 1700 won't stand up to anything anymore, not with nigh every deck in the past two years devoted to spamming Xyz. And apart from Guaiba and Hydrogeddon, there aren't any good generic Dinosaurs. The reason Horn is so good is the abundance of good targets. If Dinosaurs get a Barbaros, a Tengu, a Bear, a Yamato or a Susanooo (and not Ultimate Tyranno), call me back.

[Blake]

You say it's a +1 like that's guaranteed. If you get MST'd on that second attack, your 1700 or 1600 dies to whatever your opponent had, meaning you net even and your plans went to pot. 1700 won't stand up to anything anymore, not with nigh every deck in the past two years devoted to spamming Xyz. And apart from Guaiba and Hydrogeddon, there aren't any good generic Dinosaurs. The reason Horn is so good is the abundance of good targets. If Dinosaurs get a Barbaros, a Tengu, a Bear, a Yamato or a Susanooo (and not Ultimate Tyranno), call me back.

First off, it activates in the Damage Step for the double swing. They cannot stop the Double Swing.

 

OH MY, YOU MADE THEM USE MST ON SOMETHING THAT ISN'T BACKROW TO DISRUPT THEM? HOW HORRIBLE!

 

Lance is a Card. This is a card. 1700 gets over a good deal with those factors, especially with Guaiba being able to ram for the search, and the fact that you're downplaying it because it's JUST 1700 with a +1 swing is ignorant as can be. Bear's only 1600 if you summon it without a Formation and can't pop with it. I don't see how this argument holds up.

 

Furthermore, using a lack of generic, solid dinos as an arguing point as to why this card is bad is among the most ignorant arguments you can make. Rekindling's only as good as its targets as well. Was it ever a bad CARD? No.

 

No one puts Horn on Barbaros. Horn is EXTREMELY winmoar in Bujin, so using that as an example falls totally flat and shows you don't know what you're talking about, at all. Same for Fire Fists.

 

Horn's absolutely awful and winmoar now. Almost any deck that can utilize it has no desire to because they can do things better without it. The difference here is that this happens to support cards that DO greatly benefit from it, as opposed to simply getting a draw that benefits no one.

[玄魔の王]

First of all, when I said "kills it", I'm not referring to its playability, but its impact. Is the card good at supporting Guaiba and Hydrogeddon? Absolutely. Does that mean Dinos can suddenly start beating top decks? Uh, nope. For a month and a half, we still have Prophecy and Dragons running the show. After them, we still have decks like Fire Fists. This helps a type that's in short supply of good cards to use, but it's far from bein the amazing "be all and end all" card I see it being inevitably hyped as.

[Althemia]

If

 
oh boy here comes the argument that "x card is bad because y card exists" that has been proven to be idiotic tons.
 
 

MST'd

 
wait people still play that card lol
 
 

1700 won't stand up to anything anymore

 
http://yugioh.wikia.com/wiki/Jowgen_the_Spiritualist
http://yugioh.wikia.com/wiki/Spellbook_Magician_of_Prophecy
 
 

And apart from Guaiba and Hydrogeddon, there aren't any good generic Dinosaurs. 

 
http://yugioh.wikia.com/wiki/Hyper_Hammerhead
 
 

The reason Horn is so good is the abundance of good targets. If Dinosaurs get a Barbaros, a Tengu, a Bear, a Yamato or a Susanooo (and not Ultimate Tyranno), call me back.

 
Oh boy, look how much good playing 0 Horns did the decks that you mentioned!
 
The card's good (obviously not in big numbers) because you can equip it to a card tutor in order to get incredible advantage that Dinosaurs actually want. Also Grenosaurus with this is kinda funny but that's just me I guess.

It's far from bein the amazing "be all and end all" card I see it being inevitably hyped as.

Then get glasses because you're obviously not reading how everyone else feels about this card.

[Blake]

ITT: I said a card that's a superior horn for Dinos will redefine the Metagame, as opposed to it being a good card

The fact tat you're playing the meta card while simultaneously citing MST makes your entire argument collapse.

[玄魔の王]

Gah, I'm just gonna translate for myself because I've just realised I've been using my own short-hands ineffectively:

MST: I'm using this as a catch-all term for "thing that gets rid of spells and traps", since it's among the oldest way to do so.
Tengu etc: Cards with those effects, not members of an archetype per se. I'm not gonna splash this in a deck with 3-4 dinos, I'm gonna want a larger base than that.
Meta comment: not aimed at what's being said but what will inevitably be said.

And as for the rest... No, it's not valid to say "x card ys bad because y card exists", but how many outs exist to this card? Hammerhead often gets killed in battle, and a lot of monsters can even get over the 2500. Jowgen and Magician are often backed up by Fate anyway.

[Toffee.]

For the record, MST as a counter-argument is silly.
You have to view the card as a whole, for what it truly is, and disregard all forms of countering it. Cuz' that's the part you can worry about in-game. But if the subject is a single stand-alone card, then you have to take into consideration all of it's forms of versatility and fully visualize all aspects of it.
The card nets you ridiculous advantages off cards like Guaiba and at the same time is ideally supportive of it's Type because Dinosaurs tend to be raw ATK. So giving them something that gives them +1000 out of nowhere is PERFECT for what they are going for. The double-attack is just icing on the cake, since more often then not, you just need Gauiba/Hydro/etc to run over something to net a plus. The double attack is just to make the card more of a prominent force and gives you something truly fearsome.

Oh, and guys~
Natural Bone Saurus says hi.