Stardust Dragon [And Synchros]

[Blake]

 
I have come to the unfortunate conclusion that Synchros are actually the worst mechanic to design/build a deck around, nowadays. Still the best designed core, mind you, but the worst.
 
Synchros are naturally inconsistent, much like Rituals and Fusions, but not too inconsistent to work. At least, back in the day.
 
Nowadays, we have Nekroz that fit the creep perfectly. They take away the inconsistency by incorporating the monsters themselves, which... they really should have done all along, though not to this degree. Fusions, in HEROes, Shaddolls, and even Fluffals now have ways to search Polymerization without having to run bad cards or waste a turn. They have ways to recur the advantage that isn't too powerful modern day.
 
Xyz are the same as ever; You throw generic cards on the board and make stuff with them. This is always going to be fairly easy to do, which means this mechanic will always be strong. Burning Abyss just do this a bit too well, with a side of Virgil.
 
Pendulum... Pendulum is the new baby, and will be getting babied along the way. It's already potent in theory, and very easy to break.
 
The issue with Synchros is that... due to Tuners and non-Tuners being different cards, unlike Xyz, and not having the ability to use stuff in the hand, unlike Fusions and Rituals... So you can't put generic cards on the board, and you can't use them from your hand, so you need a plethora of special summoning to make it live... but then you lose advantage, and you need to have ways to float or it's not worth it, which just leaves you up a creek.
 
This also explains Spiritual Beasts, as their bosses are glorified loopy Synchros in a fusion skin. Just think about it: A tamer and a beast bind into a solitary being from the board. Tuners and non-Tuners become Synchros.
 
And Yang Zing... are way too passive, bar Jiaotu. It's really cute, but that's really it. They attempt to remedy the need to have the monsters on the board, but that doesn't help. They're like a synchro ghostrick; Annoying as fuck and can sometimes do mean shit, but that's all.
 
And then there's the fact that they made cards like Quasar to prevent its design from being advanced reliably as more than a side gimmick. Synchrons are just Neo-Fabled now, and they're completely inconsistent. Being able to ladder with the mechanic is so neat and really speaks to the character OF the mechanic, but they made Quasar and, to an extent, Stardust Warrior, and those limit the mechanic next to the others.
 
Even decks like DDD don't really need their Synchro side, as it is by far the weakest part of the deck. Rubic's fine, but it's still only a tuner/SSer, which means it can't inherently offer an advantage like the other BAs do. It offers you one in tandem with the others. 
 
Konami has created a gamestate where Synchros are either QUASAR GOGOGO or a secondary, tertiary, etc. gimmick to the deck. This means that they're either going to be shafted in the consistency department or never going to shine as a deck, which really makes me feel like Yugo, etc. coming up are going to be the weakest in this era... or the most power creeped to hell and back. Either way, not pretty. And Quasar's not getting banned despite negative impact on the game, due to not having a presence in the gamestate much, Sifr is surely coming soon, Ultimaya Tzolk'in is basically another Quasar, and so on.
 
It really makes me sad that they ruined a mechanic that had the best core design of all 5 this much...

[heraldry_lord]

If it's any consolation, Ultimaya Tzolk'in tries to make Synchro Monsters (rather than the Synchro Summon mechanic) something you can build a deck around without focusing on stuff like Quasar.

[Blake]

If it's any consolation, Ultimaya Tzolk'in tries to make Synchro Monsters (rather than the Synchro Summon mechanic) something you can build a deck around without focusing on stuff like Quasar.

I mentioned it because it's basically just another Quasar.

Most decks can't summon it without using at least a Synchro Tuner, if not 2 Synchros.

[iCherries]

I sort of wish Konami could've tried going the extra mile and made Majestic Star more worth it/easier to play.

I really, really do hope Sifr is a good card, but not Quasar's level of... well, boring. Something gimmicky, but something still good. I think Tzolk'in was a nice step up. On paper it's insane, but so few decks can actually do it, and it doesn't feel as stale as dropping a Quasar on the board.

[heraldry_lord]

I sort of wish Konami could've tried going the extra mile and made Majestic Star more worth it/easier to play.

I really, really do hope Sifr is a good card, but not Quasar's level of... well, boring. Something gimmicky, but something still good. I think Tzolk'in was a nice step up. On paper it's insane, but so few decks can actually do it, and it doesn't feel as stale as dropping a Quasar on the board.

 

I do not think Quasar is boring; I do think he's been overused as far as Synchro bosses go.  Majestic Star and Red would need a new Majestic Dragon that isn't terrible IMO.

[iCherries]

I do not think Quasar is boring; I do think he's been overused as far as Synchro bosses go.

It's an opinion. To each their own.

I don't like how Quasar becomes "herpderp solemn something and then drop a ssd if ded". Some people find challenge in taking it on or enjoyment in seeing their opponent -3 to put it down fully without Warning.

[Toffee.]

To be fair, Black, this shit happens all the time whenever they try to "modernize" and old mechanic.
The shit either has to broken/game-breaking/etc or they won't even bother supporting it; In a forever state of things trying to 1-up the last 'thing'.

And it's pretty damn sad...

[CLG Klavier]

I'll just say one thing - in all of your theoryzing and shit, you guys keep forgetting the most basic thing - fun.

 

This is a game. We play it for fun. Unless you're playing on YCS-level tournaments...why do you care Synchros are "the worst mechanic to build around"? If you like them you will play them. Simple as it gets. Let's not think we're better than we are, because honestly, from playing on DN/YGP/DEVP, we can say shit about this game.

 

My 2 cents.

[heraldry_lord]

It's an opinion. To each their own.

I don't like how Quasar becomes "herpderp solemn something and then drop a ssd if ded". Some people find challenge in taking it on or enjoyment in seeing their opponent -3 to put it down fully without Warning.

 

Let's look at the other Delta Accel we currently have; Halberd Cannon isn't being used, and I believe it's not just because Quasar powercreeped him out.  I believe if Cannon was genuinely a good option to go for with 1 Tuner Synchro + 2 or more non-Tuner Synchros, he'd be used sometimes.

[Slinky]

I agree whole-heartedly.

 

Its a severe shame that Synchroes went down this path, considering they are my favorite extra deck monsters

Let's look at the other Delta Accel we currently have; Halberd Cannon isn't being used, and I believe it's not just because Quasar powercreeped him out.  I believe if Cannon was genuinely a good option to go for with 1 Tuner Synchro + 2 or more non-Tuner Synchros, he'd be used sometimes.

 

But he was power-creeped.

 

It was literally either choose between opt summon negator, or opt Solemn Judgment that floats without having to dedicate, as well as being able to attack twice.

 

Choice was obvious, he is by no means a bad card, but Quasar is just so significantly better, it doesn't even matter.

[CLG Klavier]

I agree whole-heartedly.

 

Its a severe shame that Synchroes went down this path, considering they are my favorite extra deck monsters

And let me ask you - do you realizing this and agreeing with it suddenly makes you dislike Synchros and not play them ever again since they're "not worth it"?

[Slinky]

And let me ask you - do you realizing this and agreeing with it suddenly makes you dislike Synchros and not play them ever again since they're "not worth it"?

 

When did I say this?

 

I'll still use them, I'm just disappointed in the way Konami handled them.

[CLG Klavier]

I didn't mean to say you implied it.  Wondered what will you answer is all.

[Blake]

I'll just say one thing - in all of your theoryzing and shit, you guys keep forgetting the most basic thing - fun.
 
This is a game. We play it for fun. Unless you're playing on YCS-level tournaments...why do you care Synchros are "the worst mechanic to build around"? If you like them you will play them. Simple as it gets. Let's not think we're better than we are, because honestly, from playing on DN/YGP/DEVP, we can say shit about this game.
 
My 2 cents.

And let me ask you - do you realizing this and agreeing with it suddenly makes you dislike Synchros and not play them ever again since they're "not worth it"?

I think you're the one who forgot that this is a section for TCG discussion/theory and a site for card design.

I still love synchros, I still play them... but you can only have so much fun with a deck if it's going to crash and burn repeatedly, no matter how much you like the playstyle.

There's no problem with talking about theory, and it has nothing to do with thinking I'm better at the game than I am. It's game theory. And there is nothing wrong with discussing it in a section for theory and a site for design... Seems the right place to talk about it.

[CLG Klavier]

I think you're the one who forgot that this is a section for TCG discussion/theory and a site for card design.

I still love synchros, I still play them... but you can only have so much fun with a deck if it's going to crash and burn repeatedly, no matter how much you like the playstyle.

There's no problem with talking about theory, and it has nothing to do with thinking I'm better at the game than I am. It's game theory. And there is nothing wrong with discussing it in a section for theory and a site for design... Seems the right place to talk about it.

Maybe.

 

I believe you really make the deck sounds more inconsistent than it is. Sure, it bricks at times. But not as much as you claim it to.

[Darj]

I think the Synchro mechanic is fine. It just needs a different kind of support/love.

For instance, if Konami made more archetypes like Tellarknights except that their Altair was a Tuner and couldn't be used for Xyzs, plus less potent archetype Synchros (unlike Michael, Virgil, etc.), then most likely Synchros would be as popular and easy to Summon as Xyzs.

 

I agree that the mere existence of Quasar holds Synchros back (they can't be too good, or otherwise we would have Quasars everywhere), but really, if Konami was interested in making Synchros more consistent, they would already have banned Quasar and other "endgame" Synchros.

 

In short, Synchros are not better because Konami doesn't want to; I wouldn't say it's entirely the fault of their mechanics.

[heraldry_lord]

But he was power-creeped.

 

It was literally either choose between opt summon negator, or opt Solemn Judgment that floats without having to dedicate, as well as being able to attack twice.

 

Choice was obvious, he is by no means a bad card, but Quasar is just so significantly better, it doesn't even matter.

 

Quasar actively deals with the "real threats", which are card effects, and floats into a decent Synchro if he gets spirited away.   Halberd might not even get the chance to negate a Summon, and he can float into what, Librarian?

 

I don't think Halberd is "OMG so terrible", but Quasar power-creeping him was just too easy from my point of view.  If Halberd had Warning tacked on, rather than Horn/Black Horn of Heaven, and floated into better Synchros, he might have been more of a viable option.

[iCherries]

Let's look at the other Delta Accel we currently have; Halberd Cannon isn't being used, and I believe it's not just because Quasar powercreeped him out. I believe if Cannon was genuinely a good option to go for with 1 Tuner Synchro + 2 or more non-Tuner Synchros, he'd be used sometimes.

I'm sort of miffed by that too because Halberd Cannon doesn't take an arm and a leg to take down. But can be a hell of a semi-lockdown with combined with Quasar, or even Stardust Warrior for double Summon negates. However, what is that to just two Quasars? Or just Quasar and Stardust Warrior who both float into 3000/3300 sticks if you actually manage to kill them? Halberd Cannon can't bring back something that isn't just steamrolled in a second.

Maybe if he pulled a T.G. out of Extra like Stardust, he'd be a little more worth it.
 

I'll just say one thing - in all of your theoryzing and s***, you guys keep forgetting the most basic thing - fun.
 
This is a game. We play it for fun.

 
This is actually the reason why I really like Tzolk'in and Shooting Star. They're gimmicky and fun without being terrible. Quasar felt stagnant but Synchroing was still incredibly fun. The combos to make a Quasar are really entertaining too.
 

And let me ask you - do you realizing this and agreeing with it suddenly makes you dislike Synchros and not play them ever again since they're "not worth it"?

Not exactly.

You can call something terrible and still like it. Sort of like finding guilty pleasure in playing a terrible video game over and over but acknowledge that from a critical point of view it's really bad.

[heraldry_lord]

I would like to see more Double-Tuning Synchros; in all this Synchro talk, l haven't seen Red Nova mentioned once. You people disappoint me.

[iCherries]

I find it truly ironic that Red Nova was the better of the two evolved Synchros, yet now is literally non-existent.

Still calling for that Resonator structure deck.

Though, imo, I think basic Synchros are okay as they are. We could definitely go for more evolving themes with more Double Tuning or Accels.

[Blake]

Synchrons, which are after edits maybe 4-5 card difference from your build, have like a 70% brick hand 20% playable 10% nuts.

In the brick includes hands that you can stall with, yes, but not to a consistent degree when playing against anything. The deck straight-up loses to even Volcanics of all things, due to REQUIRING successful summons to maintain advantage, and it lacks removal that isn't destruction based outside of Trishula (OCG list) and Jet Warrior. And destruction is still limited to Scrap Dragon/Junk Destroyer.

And this doesn't change my points about both Spiritual Beasts (again, basically Synchros) and Yang Zing, because it's not just Synchrons I'm talking about, it's the mechanic as a whole. How the design of the mechanic is so out-creeped, that the only way to keep up is to beyond break the cards used, because all of the other mechanics are still capable of being mitigated with less absurdity. It has semi-specific materials, exact levels needed, and required board prescence, which takes weaknesses from the other pre-Pendulum mechanics, and then it puts them together. This was fine in the day, it allowed you fair bosses for the effort without really compromising yourself, but it's not the same wit the game speeding up.

I'm merely speaking of theory, and how the mechanic cannot be designed around efficiently without being even more balls to the wall than BA or being inconsistent as fuck like Synchron. Even the OCG seems hesitant to pick it up, and they pick up anything new.

[Slinky]

I would like to see more Double-Tuning Synchros; in all this Synchro talk, l haven't seen Red Nova mentioned once. You people disappoint me.

 

Red Nova hasnt been mentioned because the original RDA has been outcreeped by its Hot form. And because it isn't usually run anyway (if at all)
 

Also, in continuance with Halberd.

• "T.G. Halberd Cannon" can only negate the Summon of a monster that is Summoned through its owninherent Special Summon effect that does not start a Chain.^[1][2]

 

If I'm reading it right, it looks as though it actually can't stop a Synchro Summon or Xyz Summon because those types of summons aren't an effect. 

So in essence, it appears as though Halberd was further shafted from the beginning.

[heraldry_lord]

Red Nova hasnt been mentioned because the original RDA has been outcreeped by its Hot form. And because it isn't usually run anyway (if at all)

 

To be fair, the original RDA wasn't very good period.  Also, I felt Red Nova deserves a mention, because his gimmick (Double Tuning) was essentially dropped after 2 Synchros, and he himself has suffered terribly from the Synchro decline in addition to RDA being mediocre.

 

Also, honorable mention should go to the Synchros we have that are still banned TCG-side, and the Superheavy Synchros.

[The Warden]

Admittedly, I agree somewhat with how Synchros are taking a backseat. I rarely used them if at ever though; granted, I have taken to adding 2 PSZ to my Performapal deck so I can use Metaphys Horus. Cause that bastard is just too damn good.