Abortion

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

Pro-Life vs Pro-Choice is stupid

 

Pro-Abortion, if that exists, is sickening

 

Instead of arguing for PL vs PC, we should funnel the lobbyist money towards advancing technology towards being able to grow a child outside the womb. It's not unrealistic to achieve.

 

Benefits?

 

1) Woman have full control over their body, instead of a expensive risky procedure or carrying a child you don't want, it's a simple removal of the Zygote from the body to a fetal serum environment where it can grow. Women's rights over her body intact? - Check 

2) Child will grow and have a life, maybe someday the birth parent will regret giving away her child and even come after to look for him/her. Child Life/Potential Life (I don't care about the when does life start debate) not infringed upon? -Check

3) MANY people want kids and can't have them. Problem solved -Check

 

Cons?

 

1) I guess people can be more careless about safe sex

 

What I will NOT stand behind is people who want to end their child's potential when there is a low involvement alternative available for them

[epicmemesbro]

Adoption is essential to our society unfortunately many people don't see that. How else will infertile couples and the LGBT community get to have children? It feels as though some people take it for granted.

 

I was born with a faint heartbeat and I was put on life support, I made it out ok and my parents we very grateful that I had lived. I suppose many people don't know how valuable a life is until they experience a near loss.

[Simping For Hina]

1. Provide more information on these environments, because upon my research; They don't exist.
2. Most majority of woman don't even regret abortions, and it is more haunting to them for the issue that someone born from themselves in lieu of trouble exists in the world.
3. You actually make the adoption services worse by doing this, even more children will be parentless when it is already estimated that 300,000+ children are, while only 7,000 children have been adopted since 2012.

Before we even bother with the abortion ideology, fix our funking adoption process.

[(GigaDrillBreaker)]

Am I pregnant? No? Then it shouldn't be up to me.

[King K. Azo]

Look, there's gotta be a balance. I don't agree people that go "Oops, I forgot protection, time to kill the life growing in me."

But on the flipside, if the mother's life is in danger, or the child won't survive... I mean, I can't argue for against that.

Rape... is a difficult one. I know it used to be less than one percent went because of rape. I understand... you know, the reasoning behind that... I just dunno how I feel about it.

[Simping For Hina]

Am I pregnant? No? Then it shouldn't be up to me.

Rather exclusive response when it is also the father who is part of the issue, not just the mother.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

 

1. Provide more information on these environments, because upon my research; They don't exist.
2. Most majority of woman don't even regret abortions, and it is more haunting to them for the issue that someone born from themselves in lieu of trouble exists in the world.
3. You actually make the adoption services worse by doing this, even more children will be parentless when it is already estimated that 300,000+ children are, while only 7,000 children have been adopted since 2012.

Before we even bother with the abortion ideology, fix our f***ing adoption process.

 

They don't exist yet, but it would be theoretically possible. Proof? Eptopic Pregancies

 

http://www.livescience.com/44009-healthy-baby-rare-abdominal-pregnancy.html

 

If they can survive in hydrochloric acid, we can find something to make them survive outside the womb. Point being, funnel lobbyist money towards that.

 

The woman has rights over her body. That's it. She does not have rights over her child or it's potential if an alternative exists. She feels haunted? Well sucks, she has no right to deprive the world of it's next Einstein potentially.

 

Correct, Uncle Sam should adopt them, raise them, and make them have roles in the government, we have no shortage of need for willing workers, where better to get them from then from someone who has literally NOTHING, not even a mother's love?

 

Proof? Hispanics fighting to work in sheet cause it's still a better life than what they used to have

[Simping For Hina]

They don't exist yet, but it would be theoretically possible. Proof? Eptopic Pregancies

 

http://www.livescience.com/44009-healthy-baby-rare-abdominal-pregnancy.html

 

If they can survive in hydrochloric acid, we can find something to make them survive outside the womb. Point being, funnel lobbyist money towards that.

 

The woman has rights over her body. That's it. She does not have rights over her child or it's potential if an alternative exists. She feels haunted? Well sucks, she has no right to deprive the world of it's next Einstein potentially.

 

Correct, Uncle Sam should adopt them, raise them, and make them have roles in the government, we have no shortage of need for willing workers, where better to get them from then from someone who has literally NOTHING, not even a mother's love?

 

Proof? Hispanics fighting to work in sheet cause it's still a better life than what they used to have

Technology this is not created yet is a building block and shouldn't serve as a statement of argument until it is proven to do something more that helps support your claim, not the possibility of it being proven. It can't do anything now, and there is no stable claim of it or when it will work.

 

The fetus is part of the woman's body as all of her actions are what conflict with the child's, and vice-versa. They are together, and the only one capable of decisions is the mother. It isn't about depriving life of potential, but about instilling the capabilities of life that already is putting that potential to use. If you want to conflict one life for another, that is fine but illy worth it when there is impact on this world already being created by one that can live on their own.

 

Uncle Sam, so America? You keep wanting America to do something like it can do everything, and then get working without giving effort to fundamentally give up what is either already working or is in a position to work. Adopting children for the Government isn't suitable for children through because of the lack of personal interaction that will prominently not exist, which is the foundation for child growth and ability to work with the future of the child's life.

 

Hispanics aren't children and children aren't Hispanics? You can't correlate the two because they are different groups. Children as the foundation for the future while, I am going to change Hispanics with the Working Class because it is the same category you positioned, the Working Class is that which is trying to keep the installment of the present together.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

If a child can literally grow in the most dangerous part of the human body outside it's amniotic sack, it can be grown elsewhere. Potentially even an animal fetus could work.

 

Children can grow outside of the "protection" of the mother, ie, eptopic pregnancies, they are distinct entities.

 

Train them to be FBI, train them to be CIA, train them to be M16. Orphans make the best recruits. Loyalty can be grown.

 

A child who has never known love, or any affection, will earn loyalty to the first one they are close to, it's called imprinting. You can make a incredibly loyal government force from orphan recruits

[(GigaDrillBreaker)]

A child who has never known love, or any affection, will earn loyalty to the first one they are close to, it's called imprinting.

Speaking from the experience of having two adopted younger siblings, I can immediately say this is not true. People aren't as simple as you imply.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

Speaking from the experience of having two adopted younger siblings, I can immediately say this is not true. People aren't as simple as you imply.

When were they adopted? (Rhetorical not tryna creep). Were your parents the first thing they ever saw? Cause otherwise it's not the same. My idea kids would be grown in these test tubes, be given a caretaker, who would teach them to be utterly loyal to the gov. 

 

I'm not talking about taking a 5 year old and handing him over to new parents. Not talking about any adoption facility. They will be trained to love only their country, and be guided thru piage's stages with that goal in mind

[Simping For Hina]

If a child can literally grow in the most dangerous part of the human body outside it's amniotic sack, it can be grown elsewhere. Potentially even an animal fetus could work.

 

Children can grow outside of the "protection" of the mother, ie, eptopic pregnancies, they are distinct entities.

 

Train them to be FBI, train them to be CIA, train them to be M16. Orphans make the best recruits. Loyalty can be grown.

 

A child who has never known love, or any affection, will earn loyalty to the first one they are close to, it's called imprinting. You can make a incredibly loyal government force from orphan recruits

Children grown through that means actually end up physically and mentally ill from birth, and rather inefficient as soldiers by that point. It is also that the children have a very limiting factor that the children survive when it is claimed in the Fallopian tube. Most of the children who do survive have can have a number of birth defects. Cloning in other animal fetus don't work, so birth of other species is rather heinous. Birth and cellular growth outside the mother is unsuitable for children, though, that is the problem.

 

Anything else, I honestly hope you're kidding. That is simply pushing more lines out of something that shouldn't even be pushed.

When were they adopted? (Rhetorical not tryna creep). Were your parents the first thing they ever saw? Cause otherwise it's not the same. My idea kids would be grown in these test tubes, be given a caretaker, who would teach them to be utterly loyal to the gov.

"Teach"

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

"Teach"

using "Condition" would make you all call me cold and twisted

[Simping For Hina]

using "Condition" would make you all call me cold and twisted

No, it isn't the word that is bothering. The fact that you're willingly okay with children being brainwashed when you apparently already have a kid and openly put it in the best position to be with the mother, especially when you aren't even going to attempt to be in the kid's life because it is better for them. Slavery never works out. Willingly be open to slavery and openly ignite ignorance for kids is, by itself, even worse.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

No, it isn't the word that is bothering. The fact that you're willingly okay with children being brainwashed when you apparently already have a kid and openly put it in the best position to be with the mother, especially when you aren't even going to attempt to be in the kid's life because it is better for them. Slavery never works out. Willingly be open to slavery and openly ignite ignorance for kids is, by itself, even worse.

Well that's more, I can barely take care of myself, and her Ray is far less likely to slip. A child needs a stable home, and that wasn't with me. It was the logical decision despite the pain it brought to me personally. That has nothing to do with brainwashing. Although I'm sure Ray and my parents will fill her with stories about her worthless father who never cared about her.

 

Less brainwash and be raised with patriotism that so many of us lack these days after being spoiled with life's luxuries. Remember your roots, Uncle Sam is the one who made it possible for you to be you today.

 

http://motherboard.vice.com/read/artificial-wombs-are-coming-and-the-controversys-already-here

 

http://www.geneticliteracyproject.org/2015/06/12/artificial-wombs-the-coming-era-of-motherless-births/

 

FYI. 10 years, tops 

[.Rai]

What I will NOT stand behind is people who want to end their child's potential when there is a low involvement alternative available for them

What's this low involvement alternative? If we're talking about technology that doesn't exist and will take tens of years to develop, there isn't one available for them. And let's not use this:

 

If a child can literally grow in the most dangerous part of the human body outside it's amniotic sack, it can be grown elsewhere. Potentially even an animal fetus could work.

like, this is plain dumb

 

dunno about uncle sam tho

 

pretty sure im not american

[Simping For Hina]

Well that's more, I can barely take care of myself, and her Ray is far less likely to slip. A child needs a stable home, and that wasn't with me. It was the logical decision despite the pain it brought to me personally.

 

Less brainwash and be raised with patriotism that so many of us lack these days after being spoiled with life's luxuries. Remember your roots, Uncle Sam is the one who made it possible for you to be you today.

 

http://motherboard.vice.com/read/artificial-wombs-are-coming-and-the-controversys-already-here

 

http://www.geneticliteracyproject.org/2015/06/12/artificial-wombs-the-coming-era-of-motherless-births/

 

FYI. 10 years, tops 

That is still brainwashing. It isn't about teaching kids through bias, but giving them the evidence to have their own bias in life. Let kids learn without being forced to learn with contingencies to what they learn. Lack of such is still brainwashing and already occurs in basic classrooms, that my teachers have hated.

 

Not putting a time limit on technology that can be created.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

What's this low involvement alternative? If we're talking about technology that doesn't exist and will take tens of years to develop, there isn't one available for them. And let's not use this:

 

 

like, this is plain dumb

 

dunno about uncle sam tho

 

pretty sure im not american

I agree. Pro-Choice is lesser of the two evils at the moment, however instead of arguing, funneling the lobbyist money towards the research could make this a option in the near future. It's not 10's of years, a single 10 at the most.

 

Tell me how it's dumb, the animal part? Sure, I was just throwing an idea out there, and use potentially because I was not equipped with the knowledge to know its issue

[Simping For Hina]

double post gg 

[Astolfo]

So like, what does that make the US/whatever country that decides to do this then?

So far, to the extent of my memory, most of the Western world/first-world countries look upon child soldiers with horror/huge criticisms, saying that children are being brainwashed and taught to become merciless killers/etc.

Wouldn't doing this be a bit hypocritical?

 

Just because one can do something doesn't mean they should do it.

[epicmemesbro]

Lack of education on birth control and a group within this generation that wishes to do away with responsibility is to blame. If it wasn't for that abortion wouldn't be such a controversial issue.

[.Rai]

I agree. Pro-Choice is lesser of the two evils at the moment, however instead of arguing, funneling the lobbyist money towards the research could make this a option in the near future. It's not 10's of years, a single 10 at the most.

 

Tell me how it's dumb, the animal part? Sure, I was just throwing an idea out there, and use potentially because I was not equipped with the knowledge to know its issue

Firstly, the embryo isn't growing in an environment of hydrochloric acid. That would be insane, and it would be dead. Abdomen ≠ Stomach. Sure, it would potentially grown elsewhere, but this is ongoing research, nowhere near medical trials or even touching the commercial market.

 

You underestimate how long things take in the medical community. It will be tens of years. Even if you gave it tons of funding, it still would probably be tens of years.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

Firstly, the embryo isn't growing in an environment of hydrochloric acid. That would be insane, and it would be dead. Abdomen ≠ Stomach. Sure, it would potentially grown elsewhere, but this is ongoing research, nowhere near medical trials or even touching the commercial market.

 

You underestimate how long things take in the medical community. It will be tens of years. Even if you gave it tons of funding, it still would probably be tens of years.

That's fair. Sorry, I heard over the news about that child, and guess I should have read it more carefully for this discussion. Realize how ignorant that made me sound. Sorry. 

 

I'm not sure I agree here however, how much of this research is being held back by right (and Left maybe) ethics critics? We would be able to clone by now if not for all the red tap around it.

Lack of education on birth control and a group within this generation that wishes to do away with responsibility is to blame. If it wasn't for that abortion wouldn't be such a controversial issue.

What can I say, we're the trophy generation. Life? Hard? Unthinkable!

 

 

So like, what does that make the US/whatever country that decides to do this then?

So far, to the extent of my memory, most of the Western world/first-world countries look upon child soldiers with horror/huge criticisms, saying that children are being brainwashed and taught to become merciless killers/etc.

Wouldn't doing this be a bit hypocritical?

 

Just because one can do something doesn't mean they should do it.

 

We're not sending them off to kill villagers while making them snort cocaine and gun powered. This isn't Kony.

 

Soviets did it iirc (some correct me here) and many former officers are still loyal to that idea. It works if nothing else

[Astolfo]

I should clarify, I think first-world countries/Western countries are generally against the "forcing/brainwashing kids into doing things" kind of thing.

The whole point of various laws in said countries are to try and ensure rights/safety/etc for said kids.

So wouldn't doing this kind of thing sort of be entirely contradictory?

[epicmemesbro]

Technically, socialization is a means of brainwashing. Ever since we are young we are taught the norms on values within our society. Which of course varies according to nation.