Ryusei the Morning Star Posted April 22, 2016 Report Share Posted April 22, 2016 Limited Beatrice, the Eternal LadyThe Phantom Knights of Break SwordBlue-Eyes Spirit DragonPeformage PlushfireMajespecter Unicorn - KirinEl Shaddoll ConstructEl Shaddoll WindaCard of DemiseChicken GameUpstart GoblinSky IrisTwin TwisterThe Melody of the Awakened DragonSolemn Notice Semi-LimitedSanganInzektor DragonflyDragon's RavineGospel of Revival UnlimitedMagician of FaithMezukiReborn TenguEvigishki GustkrakenGoyo GuardianSuper RejuvenationSinister Shadow Games Brief Reasoning: Beatrice: The current problem isn't so much the Phantom Knights as the selective mill power the deck is afforded with the Cir-Dante loop with Beatrice. Detaching Dante to send Cir, summoning back the Dante, adding the Cir. Discarding another BA...but wait, only one Beatrice. A quick-play lavaval chain is only hindered in that r6nk is harder to access thank r4nk. Beatrice can only get better as time progresses Break Sword: That being said, this card is what allows the deck's major extension plays, and much like Dante and Beatrice only can get better as scrap-dragon on a rank 3 that floats into Meta relevant answers such as #80 and Dark Reb will continue to only be better. Currently run at 2, they'll have to make room to Run Avarice if this card means so much to them. It will also force the deck to widen it's extra deck. The lack of Beatrice and Break #2 might pave the way for Trishula or more Synchro plays. This is also a indirect hit to F0. With Dante and Break both limited, the high utility options wane for easy F0 access Spirit Dragon: Does too much on one damn card in a nutshell. Blue Eyes can negate grave effects for free, the card can float into Azure dodging Targeting and paying for itself. It's the go to answer for Blue Eyes and stops any relevant manner of pendulums from being used. Limitation will make room for Neo-BEUD and Cipher potentially as well. Plushfire: Juggler stays banned, which leaves Trick Clown and Mirror as the best targets. The top two meta decks still will be Blue Eyes with switching the A/D has a minor effect upon. Furthermore, with the existing limitations on Wavering, Wizard, and Ignister and lack lack of senergy with Luster at one, the mage engine is the weak link in the deck. The card has a functional twice per turn, but running more mages will also have the impact of causing the deck to brick more often. Weaken'd further my Cosmic Cyclone's existance Kirin: A card that is toeing the line between being banned or not. Notoriously hard to get rid of, but a limitation makes the the 6 copies of kirin drop down to 4. Given the other hits coming to Pendulums, one must decide if it is indeed worth running an additional three bun-bun especially seeing that Kerin's utility vs Blue Eyes and soon to be Kozmo is dropping rapidly. Furthmore, the popular side of Wavering+2/3 Rektor can fairly easily deal with Pendulums (odd Eyes Variant). This should have the desired effect of moving Metalphosis to a better position as the top pendulum deck of the format. El Shaddoll Construct: This one irks me. Construct opens many many doors for Shaddolls and serves as the boss removal card they've been needing. The additional senergy with being a lv 8 for DMoC and the Envoys is troubling. But there is a solution other than banning Shaddoll Fusion. No significantly broken r4nk exist in the game mildly weakening the effect Trick Clown will have for the deck El Shaddoll Winda: Despite not being quite as potent as it was in 2014, Winda remains a deadly floodgate, especially if summoned off a quick-play El or Super Poly. This combined with the Construct limit should greatly weaken the power of Shaddoll Fusion to facilitate the grave for plays with say Dark Magic Veil. In addition, with the top two fusions limited, techs such as the Ice and Fire Hands, or potentially the Plush and Clown engines will need to be played access the fusions. Card of Demise: Generic +2 (or +3 in heros) for backrow decks such as Qli's. Set all the backrow, draw 3, set a few more. This manner of play, especially coupled with a later hit in the list creates the set 5 format that makes playing a chore. Chicken Game & Upstart Goblin: Pendulum Deck and Blue Eyes are going to lose support, the idea behind those hits is not to allow the deck to turn to these two card and simply make up for lost ground. Indirect hits to the Cupidity engine of running 50+ and offsetting w/ blank draws. Sky Iris: Can turn any combination between scale+monster/scale into a fully functional 2-8 scale set up. Interactions with Ariadne and Plushfire. Makes running multiple Terraforming a poor choice and the lack of easy scale-formation (atleast in Odd-Eyes hybrids) force pre-planning and careful usage of cards such as this and Pendulum Call. Twin Twister: Makes setting any manner of backrow dangerous. Banning Duster and leaving this at 2-3 was an option, but the quick-play nature of this card is more damaging to chain-able traps than Duster is. Also one less of a discard outlet for Blue-Eyes and PK Fire. Melody: Focuses the deck too much on the Alternate build. Limitation should help builds like the Ritual and Fusion and Felgrand variants to prosper. Discard often ends up not even being a cost and the card in aggregate functions as a +1-2 Solemn Strike: Frankly the best solemn in it's usage. While Judgment and Warning are more powerful, the heftier costs associated makes them harder to use correctly. 1500 is a measly cost to negate a Synchro or XYZ summon, and with the top 3 decks losing some of their scale formation and extra deck bosses, a limitation seems fair in copulation with Twin Twister Sangan: Slow, could likely safely go to 3 Inzektor Dragonfly: Slow Targetting destruction with Hornet. Cleaning out the list to mildly help a retro deck. Dragon's Ravine: More focus on Blue Eyes towards the Chaos and Felgrand Builds, doesn't net an immediate + as often as Awakening would, but offset's Blue Eye's loss in the limited section Gospel: Does too damn much for the deck. With Reborn, SC, 3 Silver, the ceiling is still plenty high for the deck. Just a minor nudge to suggest focusing on other angles for the deck (such as maybe incorporating Red Eyes Darkness Metal Dragon) Magician of Faith: DMoC is better, Nirvana is better, even Magical Stone is better Mezuki: Has existed at 3 in TCG forever, Shiranui really only need 2 to function optimally, three is just icing on the cake. Might maybe help diversify the meta. But unlikely Reborn Tengu: Doesn't trigger off XYZ's. Pendulums have enough consistency issues. Might be a neat tech in Monarchs (doubtful) or maybe Metalphosis. Plant Pals is a cool deck, Trumpeter might have something to say in that regard. Also doesn't wall well vs Castel or Ignister for that matter Gusty: Prep is limited, doesn't work with pre-prep. Nekroz are an infinitely better ritual deck. Didn't see play at 2, won't at three either. Goyo: Trash: Kozmo and BA trigger, Pendulums don't hit the grave, Blue Eyes are too big Super Rejuv: Blue Eyes lost 4 discard outlets and 2 tribute outlets, gained 1 from the list.It was slow at 2, and getting hand traps at the EP isn't worth as much as it was back in 2014 Sinister Shadow Games: Shaddoll took enough of a hit with Winda to 1. Card might honestly clog at three. Easier Shaddoll Fusion I guess, but nothing major I'm far from perfect, so feel free to criticize anything and everything you desire Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(GigaDrillBreaker) Posted April 22, 2016 Report Share Posted April 22, 2016 Honestly, aside from Rejuv at three (I started in ruler format, so Rejuv into Rejuv into Rejuv is just too much ptsd) this is something I can really get behind. Mezuki feels a tad risky, with Shiranui on the horizon, but what's a good banlist without risk? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryusei the Morning Star Posted April 22, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 22, 2016 Honestly, aside from Rejuv at three (I started in ruler format, so Rejuv into Rejuv into Rejuv is just too much ptsd) this is something I can really get behind.Mezuki feels a tad risky, with Shiranui on the horizon, but what's a good banlist without risk?Uh well, Rejuv is currently at 2, and I did remove more Discard and Tribute outlets from the deck than I gave it (-6+1). If they werent running it back then, I don't really see why they would run it now when it's less likely to net you more +'s. But yeah, Ruler format Draw 4's were a terror As for Mezuki. Mera rel3vance. Card is at 2. Shiranui sees 0 play. Risk is wanted, I'm hoping they'll be able to do something. But I rather doubt it. The most interesting deck IMO honestly seems like DollMages. Plush opens Grysta for the deck incase you already burnt your construct. But the loss of 2 Winda should drastically kill the power of doll fusion otherwise *shrugs* I tried to be as fair as I could to the top three and tier 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Amazing Avian Posted April 22, 2016 Report Share Posted April 22, 2016 Your list is my favorite because 2 Dragonflies Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryusei the Morning Star Posted April 26, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 26, 2016 Your list is my favorite because 2 DragonfliesWell I tried to hit all of the Meta pretty evenly without killing them. It's kinda hard to do cause the bifecta of Blue Eyes and Speedroid Phantom Abyss is really nice and most decks in tier 2 have a good chance at winning But yeah! Free Dragonfly! WU have everything (except Hunter) at three and so does Bunny! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VCR_CAT Posted April 26, 2016 Report Share Posted April 26, 2016 Beatrice: Okay Breaksword: This feels completely unnecessary. I understand that you're trying to hit the meta evenly without killing them, but hitting Breaksword would kill PK's. The R3 pool is lacking overall, even with Dante and Grampulse, and PK's absolutely need multiple Breakswords to function properly. Hitting it and expecting the deck to function properly by running Avarice cards is rather short-sighted and poorly thought out. Not only does this remove the freedom of being able to use the suicide effect pro-actively, or really as anything but a last-resort, but, again, it requires that the deck run a card they can't search as a means to recycle it, seeing as they have no means of getting it back themselves or really any easy way of going into something like Emeral. Basically put, you get that card in hand, or your deck won't be able to function the way it's intended. Not only that, but it really just does not deserve the hit. It's a good card, sure, but it's not THAT good. If you want to hit PK's without killing them, Breaksword isn't the answer. Blue-Eyes Spirit: Okay; I dig this hit. BEWD has plenty of viable options to go into, and hitting this card in particular encourages better variety between the builds and variation in the strategies. While, like PK's, this is hitting one of their aces; BEWD actually has other options to go into; options that aren't explored because of this card. Plushfire: This is a really bad idea. As Black has probably told you plenty of time, this card completely deserves the ban and needs to stay banned. I don't honestly care if limiting it removes the aspect of floating into a second copy; the fact that it's a pendulum at all means that it's going to be recurring plusses and constant mitigation. It's a poorly designed card and it honestly needs to stay banned. Kirin: No, just ban it. As I explained before, hitting Raccoon does nothing to prevent the decks from searching what is an entirely unfair and stupid card. Don't limit and hit Raccoon and call it a day; because that's not going to solve any problem. As I also said, pendulum decks still have other means of effectively searching this out, and even if it's limited that's not going to change its constant use. Instead of making a bunch of round-about hits; just kill it and be done with it. It's completely unhealthy, and killing it means that the decks that tech Majespecters won't run Majespecters anymore. Honestly, I don't understand why this is hard for you to get; it's a stupid card that isn't enabled by its own consistency engine (considering there are others); so just kill it and the problem's solved. Construct: Okay Winda: Honestly, not really needed. Winda was "2gud" back in its hayday because the game was still at the tail-end of the Xyz era and most other decks absolutely needed to Special Summon more than once in a turn to deal with this in any way. But, the decks today each have their own way of dealing with this, or playing around it. Even PK's have their own methods of getting over this card and playing around it without needing to run any specific cards. It's a strong card, sure, but it's not one that's going to cause as many problems as it used to. The gamestate today is way different than when this card was considered broken, and there aren't really any prominent decks that have a problem with being limited to one Special Summon a turn. Card of Demise: There's not much I can say on this card, if for any reason but because my experience with this card and knowledge of its applications is way too limited. Chicken Game: Yeah, I think that would be fine. Upstart: If there was any reason that led me to realize you were working off the OCG list (you really should specify, considering this site is otherwise TCG-first), it was this. Sky Iris: Again, a really unneeded and unwise hit. Essentially, you're murdering the consistency of any and all Magician variants considering where the OCG list is at. Plushfire should be dead anyways, and Ariadne isn't really a problem if a certain something else gets hit as well. Killing this kills the use of Terraforming for deck thinning, and ultimately, kills the consistency for the deck and, in turn, kills the deck itself in the end. Pendulums need the ability to setup their scales effectively with one card, and while some cards (Monkeyboard) do this way too effectively, Sky Iris has been in alright position since its release. If Kirin gets killed, that should be enough of a hit against Pendulum Magician decks for this to be alright where it's at; especially considering that Odd-Eyes decks really aren't doing that much in either the OCG or the TCG meta. Not only is this hit entirely unnecessary, it's something that makes me notice that "unbiased" is false advertising on this thread. Twin Twister: I've been looking over this card, and the gamestate as a whole regarding backrow, and honestly I think you need to rethink this hit. Where the game is at now, I've realized that it's false to say that backrow is crap because of Twin Twister. On the contrary; because of how many Solemns are running around, you will basically lose any given duel if you're going second and don't open with Twin Twisters. But, Backrow isn't the only factor. Considering how Pendulums have shaped up to be and how Konami has been designing Field Spells, there has begun to be way too many targets for a single MST to be considered terribly effective anymore. Twin Twisters answers this need by allowing a given player to hit multiple targets. And while side-deck options for dealing with Pendulums do exist (Spell Shattering Arrow, etc.); the "Side deck" part makes this issue very apparent; maining side-deck cards is not something any deck should do, and there are too many important targets for a single MST for me to think that the game would be in a fine state with this being hit alongside Notice. I'm not necessarily saying "Punch this to 3 and keep it there", but more than just your boner for backrow needs to be kept into consideration for how this card is used and why it's used. Personally, I do think banning Duster and leaving this at 2-3 would be perfectly fine. Melody: I guess? I mean, the deck has enough consistency as it is and this card is lauded for being able to set-up Alternative with one card. It just doesn't feel 100% necessary to me, but that's more just opinion than anything. Solemn Notice: This couldn't happen soon enough. Sangan: Sure Inzektor: Just let them die. The Hornet combo was never good for the game, and the deck was degenerate overall. Just let them die and lay there. Dragon's Ravine: Sure Gospel: Sure Magician of Faith: Whatever Mezuki: Okay Reborn: Okay Gishki: I'd seriously rather not. "Cleaning up the list" is never a good-enough reason for letting degenerate cards off, and you seriously should realize this by now. Goyo: Sure Super Rejuv: Not a fan, personally. Hand-presence is one of the main weaknesses of BEWD as a deck, and I feel that should remain a weakness to exploit, rather than something to be fixed inherently in the build. Sinister Shadow: Okay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryusei the Morning Star Posted April 27, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 27, 2016 Beatrice: Okay Breaksword: This feels completely unnecessary. I understand that you're trying to hit the meta evenly without killing them, but hitting Breaksword would kill PK's. The R3 pool is lacking overall, even with Dante and Grampulse, and PK's absolutely need multiple Breakswords to function properly. Hitting it and expecting the deck to function properly by running Avarice cards is rather short-sighted and poorly thought out. Not only does this remove the freedom of being able to use the suicide effect pro-actively, or really as anything but a last-resort, but, again, it requires that the deck run a card they can't search as a means to recycle it, seeing as they have no means of getting it back themselves or really any easy way of going into something like Emeral. Basically put, you get that card in hand, or your deck won't be able to function the way it's intended. Not only that, but it really just does not deserve the hit. It's a good card, sure, but it's not THAT good. If you want to hit PK's without killing them, Breaksword isn't the answer. Blue-Eyes Spirit: Okay; I dig this hit. BEWD has plenty of viable options to go into, and hitting this card in particular encourages better variety between the builds and variation in the strategies. While, like PK's, this is hitting one of their aces; BEWD actually has other options to go into; options that aren't explored because of this card. Plushfire: This is a really bad idea. As Black has probably told you plenty of time, this card completely deserves the ban and needs to stay banned. I don't honestly care if limiting it removes the aspect of floating into a second copy; the fact that it's a pendulum at all means that it's going to be recurring plusses and constant mitigation. It's a poorly designed card and it honestly needs to stay banned. Kirin: No, just ban it. As I explained before, hitting Raccoon does nothing to prevent the decks from searching what is an entirely unfair and stupid card. Don't limit and hit Raccoon and call it a day; because that's not going to solve any problem. As I also said, pendulum decks still have other means of effectively searching this out, and even if it's limited that's not going to change its constant use. Instead of making a bunch of round-about hits; just kill it and be done with it. It's completely unhealthy, and killing it means that the decks that tech Majespecters won't run Majespecters anymore. Honestly, I don't understand why this is hard for you to get; it's a stupid card that isn't enabled by its own consistency engine (considering there are others); so just kill it and the problem's solved. Construct: Okay Winda: Honestly, not really needed. Winda was "2gud" back in its hayday because the game was still at the tail-end of the Xyz era and most other decks absolutely needed to Special Summon more than once in a turn to deal with this in any way. But, the decks today each have their own way of dealing with this, or playing around it. Even PK's have their own methods of getting over this card and playing around it without needing to run any specific cards. It's a strong card, sure, but it's not one that's going to cause as many problems as it used to. The gamestate today is way different than when this card was considered broken, and there aren't really any prominent decks that have a problem with being limited to one Special Summon a turn. Card of Demise: There's not much I can say on this card, if for any reason but because my experience with this card and knowledge of its applications is way too limited. Chicken Game: Yeah, I think that would be fine. Upstart: If there was any reason that led me to realize you were working off the OCG list (you really should specify, considering this site is otherwise TCG-first), it was this. Sky Iris: Again, a really unneeded and unwise hit. Essentially, you're murdering the consistency of any and all Magician variants considering where the OCG list is at. Plushfire should be dead anyways, and Ariadne isn't really a problem if a certain something else gets hit as well. Killing this kills the use of Terraforming for deck thinning, and ultimately, kills the consistency for the deck and, in turn, kills the deck itself in the end. Pendulums need the ability to setup their scales effectively with one card, and while some cards (Monkeyboard) do this way too effectively, Sky Iris has been in alright position since its release. If Kirin gets killed, that should be enough of a hit against Pendulum Magician decks for this to be alright where it's at; especially considering that Odd-Eyes decks really aren't doing that much in either the OCG or the TCG meta. Not only is this hit entirely unnecessary, it's something that makes me notice that "unbiased" is false advertising on this thread. Twin Twister: I've been looking over this card, and the gamestate as a whole regarding backrow, and honestly I think you need to rethink this hit. Where the game is at now, I've realized that it's false to say that backrow is crap because of Twin Twister. On the contrary; because of how many Solemns are running around, you will basically lose any given duel if you're going second and don't open with Twin Twisters. But, Backrow isn't the only factor. Considering how Pendulums have shaped up to be and how Konami has been designing Field Spells, there has begun to be way too many targets for a single MST to be considered terribly effective anymore. Twin Twisters answers this need by allowing a given player to hit multiple targets. And while side-deck options for dealing with Pendulums do exist (Spell Shattering Arrow, etc.); the "Side deck" part makes this issue very apparent; maining side-deck cards is not something any deck should do, and there are too many important targets for a single MST for me to think that the game would be in a fine state with this being hit alongside Notice. I'm not necessarily saying "Punch this to 3 and keep it there", but more than just your boner for backrow needs to be kept into consideration for how this card is used and why it's used. Personally, I do think banning Duster and leaving this at 2-3 would be perfectly fine. Melody: I guess? I mean, the deck has enough consistency as it is and this card is lauded for being able to set-up Alternative with one card. It just doesn't feel 100% necessary to me, but that's more just opinion than anything. Solemn Notice: This couldn't happen soon enough. Sangan: Sure Inzektor: Just let them die. The Hornet combo was never good for the game, and the deck was degenerate overall. Just let them die and lay there. Dragon's Ravine: Sure Gospel: Sure Magician of Faith: Whatever Mezuki: Okay Reborn: Okay Gishki: I'd seriously rather not. "Cleaning up the list" is never a good-enough reason for letting degenerate cards off, and you seriously should realize this by now. Goyo: Sure Super Rejuv: Not a fan, personally. Hand-presence is one of the main weaknesses of BEWD as a deck, and I feel that should remain a weakness to exploit, rather than something to be fixed inherently in the build. Sinister Shadow: Okay.So I'll just go over the ones we disagree on Break: There has not been a OCG decklist in the recent future that has run 3 swords, and some already run 1. The common value is 2. The other possible hits to Speedroid Phantom Abyss are: Cir, but Beatrice is a better hit. Terrortop: Enough other lv 3 fodder engines exist, and it's minor after opening plays. My point on Avarice was shortsighted sure, because relying on a limited card is a bit silly, but they can and maybe should play things like JoA. The bottom line is they function well enough with just 2 breaks and don't even use all the rank 3 and synchro options they could otherwise use. Like Plague+Omega or Trish for example. It's not that unfair of a hit if you really play the deck. Plush: Just because Black, and I'm a big fan of Josh, says something doesn't make it the word of law. Plush is simple to understand, you're likely not going to get more than 1 float off it, maybe two, but that's pushing it. If you do want to get multiple usages out of it, you're gonna run more mages which increases your chances of bricking. There are better 2 scales than conductor, and brick clown in multiples, especially without Chain is bad. Wavering is largely being sided, Wizard is limited, and Iris is already problematic. Plush was never and currently is not the problem with mages. The more utility you try to grind out of plush, the more you weaken your deck. It's a safe card to have at 1, not at multiples. Kirin: This is me being unbais. I hate this card. It kills my dolls g1, and g2 I have to side 4 cards (WE+3 Rektor) to deal with it. I say limiting it is fine, because it's not that good vs the Meta. Blue Eyes, DDD, and PK Fire have too high of a ceiling. Nekroz have anti-target. Qli have immunity, monarchs don't give a flying funk, and game 2 it becomes terrible once people side in card that they would ALREADY DO SO, like WE vs pendulums. I'm saying limit it because it would hurt the cupidity engine and much like Plush force you to run "bad" card in coon in multiples to get it immediately. (Majester as you suggested, has to wait till the EP). Three coon for one Kirin that's only decent vs the top meta decks and will get worse come Kozmo seems like a terrible idea. Winda: Fine, I didn't want people to think I was favoring my deck unfairly so I hit this. Shaddolls were most skillful to play in OCG when both Winda and Con were at one, so I guess I kinda missed that format where you had to run techs like Sinister and the Hands to get other fusions. It can stay at three I guess. Card of Demise: It's a +2 for decks that run a lot of backrow. It's also the best way to hit qlis and heros a bit. They'll still be fine with one, but set all your traps, and draw into two more and a scout is unfair. Or even worse, set everything, summon stratos, add mist, discard mist, add ddude and do the coth-mask plays on your opponent's turn. Failing that, enjoy the Draw three of Dude Demise Sky Iris: Plush is and was not a problem. There are enough other counter traps to run excluding the Solemns...such as ones already being run like Magic Drain. They already run Scolding in the past, why would they not run it now. You use Warning/Notice first, and Scolding last. It's not the "best," but it's not terrible either. Pendulum's biggest power is their easy scale makers. Iris does a lot more than just open scales though, it can get you the decks exclusive Infinity+Compuls for starters. There is a lot of utility in the card. Hell Metalphosis are using it even just to get a generic scale 8. The deck has enough scale makers in the form of Wizard and such. And the chances are you can get one usage out of Iris anyway if Twin is gone. That should put you in a decent spot to set up future plays. And one Terra for 2 targets isn't the worse. Games isn't limited mate. Not sure why you think cramming in 2-3 terra is healthy. Twin: Backrow extends game plays and makes you use resources conservatively. Twin is superior to Duster in that Duster usually nails 2-3 backrow, but doesn't really weaken something like Compuls that's already chainable. Duster punishes set 3 Torrential and pass plays. Setting Twin just makes playing backrow terrible unless you're something like qli that can get backrow at a +2 or something like Phantoms that has floating backrow. Are there too many targets for just MST to hit, sure. But you have to remember, nobody is realistically going to run 20 traps normally. The number will likely go up from the bare bones 5 to maybe ten in most decks. This is ignoring that Strike is also getting hit, so the number will likely stay the same realistically. With three good solemns running around, you likely WON'T lose a game if you open w/o Twin anymore. Also too many decks can + off the discard cost. Be it PKBA or Blue Eyes. It's as much a meta hit as a stasis mediator Awakening: Easy Alternate is kinda degenerate, especially when you can discard something like a Stone and make it a +1 instead of a +0. If ravine moves up, the CED-Ark combo becomes better too. Hitting this to one, just weakens the cohesiveness of the deck a fair bit, but doesn't damage it much, because much like Spirit, Blue Eyes has more than enough toys to mix in. Dragonfly: Everything in that meta is basically at full power again. WU have everything but hunter, DinoRabbit has 3 Rabbit. It might not have been "healthy" in 2012, but we're past the era where targeting destruction is all that amazing. Inzektor ain't good even with multiple Fly, throwing them a bone won't hurt Gishki: Did nothing at 2, hand loop might even neg you more than + in the current day. Said handloop is trash also. I see not the problem Rejuv: Something similar, Blue Eyes lost more discard/tribute outlets than they gained. If they wouldn't run the two they can now, why would they run 3 later on when it's more likely to be dead? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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