Chaos Pudding Posted July 29, 2011 Report Share Posted July 29, 2011 Also, justify banning Premature Burial but at the same time having Monster Reborn legal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.Nu-13 Posted July 29, 2011 Report Share Posted July 29, 2011 Elaborate on title? Also, Premature Burial can be easily searched by stuff like Hidden Armory, Iron Blacksmith Kotetsu etc. And can be bounced with Giant Trunade, Dewloren, Gavel Crane and various otehr stuff, thus reusing it and letting the monster survive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Resident Fascist Posted July 29, 2011 Report Share Posted July 29, 2011 Premature Burial is more searchable, can be recycled almost infinately with Brionac, and recylced a few times with Birdman, too. In short, it's a broken card. EDIT: DAMN, NINJAD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaos Pudding Posted July 29, 2011 Author Report Share Posted July 29, 2011 I guess my time has come as well. YCM ill needs a savior such as myself. And you forgot to justify why Monster Reborn is allowed to be legal. Also, guy above me: Are you sure you're reading Birdman right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.Nu-13 Posted July 29, 2011 Report Share Posted July 29, 2011 [quote name='Chaos Pudding' timestamp='1311975259' post='5399304'] I guess my time has come as well. YCM ill needs a savior such as myself. [/quote] Are you leaving or something? [quote name='Chaos Pudding' timestamp='1311975259' post='5399304'] And you forgot to justify why Monster Reborn is allowed to be legal. [/quote] Well, Monster Reborn is a lucksack card, as there are barely any ways to search it. It's also one time use only Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zauls Posted July 29, 2011 Report Share Posted July 29, 2011 Monster Reborn hasn't really affected the meta too badly this format. Just like Dark Hole, it's just a good staple cards that the vast majority of decks should run, they don't make a massive impact on the meta. It's probably because the meta is too fast anyway, but they aren't really problems. Also Premature Burial has many OTKs and is more searchable while Monster Reborn doesn't and isn't. I IZ NINJA!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Resident Fascist Posted July 29, 2011 Report Share Posted July 29, 2011 [quote name='Chaos Pudding' timestamp='1311975259' post='5399304'] And you forgot to justify why Monster Reborn is allowed to be legal. [/quote] Mainly because it's not that bad in 1. I've never really lost a game or won one because of it. While there are some lolcombos with it, they're actually quite inconsistent. While Reborn is a good card, it's ok at 1, or atleast in my opinion. The game is so fast now that 3K beaters out of nowhere that can nuke the field for almost no cost are considered bad. Yeah. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaos Pudding Posted July 29, 2011 Author Report Share Posted July 29, 2011 Why is being a lucksack card justification for keeping it around? Wouldn't you want to try to eliminate luck as a factor as much as you could? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.Rai Posted July 29, 2011 Report Share Posted July 29, 2011 Because decks still need a revival card. Keep one, even if it's broken as it helps all decks and not specific ones. If it specifically helped one particular high tier archetype, it would have been long banned. So basically it just helps increase constistency of all decks. It's like when Call of the Haunted and Reborn kept on swapping between Banned and Limited. They could have easily kept both banned, or both Limited. There's only really one option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.Nu-13 Posted July 29, 2011 Report Share Posted July 29, 2011 [quote name='Chaos Pudding' timestamp='1311975500' post='5399319'] Why is being a lucksack card justification for keeping it around? Wouldn't you want to try to eliminate luck as a factor as much as you could? [/quote] Well, in my opinion, Monster Reborn is a good lucksack. It doesn't really give that major advantage like Pot of Greed, but allows a losing played to somehow get back into the game Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evilfusion Posted July 29, 2011 Report Share Posted July 29, 2011 Monster Reborn constantly bounces between banned and unbanned. Just the most recent time it was unbanned, it evidently wasn't nearly as destructive to the format, and like Dark Hole, was left alone in the following list. Justification for leaving it unbanned? Hmm...only that it doesn't seem as detrimental any more. Which probably says something about the meta. Premature is easily recycled with Trunade, Brionac, Dewloren, etc. It has Equip Spell support, as well, and since Hidden Armory can grab from the Grave, it's even MORE recyclable. In a day where LP is considered negligable, the cost doesn't hinder its use any more than Brain Control's cost would limit its use. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Resident Fascist Posted July 29, 2011 Report Share Posted July 29, 2011 [quote name='Chaos Pudding' timestamp='1311975500' post='5399319'] Why is being a lucksack card justification for keeping it around? Wouldn't you want to try to eliminate luck as a factor as much as you could? [/quote] All card games rely on luck as a factor. All of them. Keep in mind that Yu-Gi-Oh is a card game aimed at younger TCG players, so hence the luck being a factor means that it's more appealing to them. Depending on Konami's Choices this year, I might jump over to MTG or C!!V. They seem to be doing ok though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zauls Posted July 29, 2011 Report Share Posted July 29, 2011 [quote name='Chaos Pudding' timestamp='1311975500' post='5399319'] Why is being a lucksack card justification for keeping it around? Wouldn't you want to try to eliminate luck as a factor as much as you could? [/quote] Luck must always be a factor of the game because it makes it more fun. It would basically be best player always wins if it weren't for luck. It would be very boring that way. Even so, it isn't the best justification for Reborn being unbanned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaos Pudding Posted July 29, 2011 Author Report Share Posted July 29, 2011 But if people want to play a luck-based card game, why not play poker? And saying that there's luck involved in every card game isn't an excuse nor is it actually addressing my point. My point was wouldn't you want to [b]cut down on the factor that luck brings to the game[/b] as much as possible? That way the better player is more likely to win, and it allows an incentive for players to actually get better instead of lucksacking their way to victory through herp derp broken cards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zauls Posted July 29, 2011 Report Share Posted July 29, 2011 [quote name='Chaos Pudding' timestamp='1311975758' post='5399337'] But if people want to play a luck-based card game, why not play poker? And saying that there's luck involved in every card game isn't an excuse nor is it actually addressing my point. My point was wouldn't you want to [b]cut down on the factor that luck brings to the game[/b] as much as possible? That way the better player is more likely to win, and it allows an incentive for players to actually get better instead of lucksacking their way to victory through herp derp broken cards. [/quote] That's a valid point, and I do agree that it obviously should be more likely that the best player wins. Banning Reborn wouldn't change that factor much though, because both players can run it and the better player would probably make better use of it than the worse player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EHN. Posted July 29, 2011 Report Share Posted July 29, 2011 [quote name='Chaos Pudding' timestamp='1311975758' post='5399337'] But if people want to play a luck-based card game, why not play poker? [/quote] Because in poker you don't have holofoil shiny cards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.Rai Posted July 29, 2011 Report Share Posted July 29, 2011 It's one of those tricky cards because it promotes good and bad play. Removing it would make duels where one player is winning hard to recover from the duel for the other player. Bad play with this is increasing your advantage even though you already clearly have some. But it generally promotes better duels and consistency so that's why. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaos Pudding Posted July 29, 2011 Author Report Share Posted July 29, 2011 You don't need to be that smart to chose the best monster in either player's Graveyard and then proceed to win with it. And I beg to differ. I have seen holofoil decks of playing cards before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.Rai Posted July 29, 2011 Report Share Posted July 29, 2011 Well, that's why you have duel-evening cards like Dark Hole, Warning, Judgment, BTH, CED, Fiendish Chain, Effect Veiler, Dimensional Prison etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian Posted July 29, 2011 Report Share Posted July 29, 2011 I remember when the format was so fair, that book of moon and solemn judgement were both at 3 and weren't played. The game has gotten a lot more defensive if you think about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.Rai Posted July 29, 2011 Report Share Posted July 29, 2011 [quote name='Canadian' timestamp='1311976428' post='5399368'] I remember when the format was so fair, that book of moon and solemn judgement were both at 3 and weren't played. The game has gotten a lot more defensive if you think about it. [/quote] Totally agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toffee. Posted July 29, 2011 Report Share Posted July 29, 2011 I was at Target all day, and missed a Hikaru-thread? DAMN IT!!! [sadface.jpg] Premature would be legal if cards like Trunade, Brionac, and Dewloren went to 0. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ieyasu Tokugawa Posted July 29, 2011 Report Share Posted July 29, 2011 If the only objective of the card game was to make it as non-reliant on luck as possible, the game would only consist of draw cards and search cards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Airride Posted July 29, 2011 Report Share Posted July 29, 2011 Premature, as many have said, Is too searchable, and its cost is tiny. If the cost were larger, or have a condition, say when you have 0 monsters on your field, It may be @1/2. Reborn is tricky. It's a faster Call for both graves, and doesn't have the killed if killed. It's a little less abuseable though, but personally, It's fine for the game;We already have giant combos that bring more stuff out with searchable stuff that's @3, so I believe Reborn is fine. But, due to how it is, it jumps around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaos Pudding Posted July 29, 2011 Author Report Share Posted July 29, 2011 [quote name='Miror B.' timestamp='1311976645' post='5399384'] If the only object of the card game was to make it as non-reliant on luck as possible, the game would only consist of draw cards and search cards. [/quote] The object of a card game should first and foremost be making it as fun as possible (unless you're Konami, in which you're focused on making as much money as possible and since your target audience isn't mature enough to know the difference you don't have to focus on fun). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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