El Majishan Posted July 31, 2012 Report Share Posted July 31, 2012 [center][img]http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20110701214314/yugioh/images/thumb/d/d2/RoyalOppression-GLD4-EN-GUR-LE.png/300px-RoyalOppression-GLD4-EN-GUR-LE.png[/img][/center] [center]So lets talk about this card...a few people I know would love to see this card return...Their argument being "with 3 mst and heavy its no big deal"[/center] [center]I disagree because I have a problem with cards that shut down entire game mechanics...and I have a bigger problem with people going "summon, summon, summon, summon...set set..pass. I flip oppression, I win"[/center] [center]People also say we need something to keep all the SS'ing thats in the game in check...again I disagree. The problem is not the SS'ing...but all the broken stuff that gets SS'ed.[/center] [center]So YCM do your thing. [/center] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toffee. Posted July 31, 2012 Report Share Posted July 31, 2012 [quote name='Le Magician' timestamp='1343761440' post='5993652'] summon, summon, summon, summon...set set..pass. I flip oppression, I win[/quote] Oppression in a nutshell, no matter how you look at it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lonk Posted July 31, 2012 Report Share Posted July 31, 2012 It SHOUD come back. I would love to see this wonderful piece of art return and take a crap on everybody. Also, Madolches like this card. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Majishan Posted July 31, 2012 Author Report Share Posted July 31, 2012 [quote name='Tentalus Therapist' timestamp='1343763345' post='5993667'] It SHOUD come back. I would love to see this wonderful piece of art return and take a crap on everybody. Also, Madolches like this card. [/quote] Why should it come back? What is your reasoning? Like Armz and myself said...the format would just be "I summon all my stuff, set oppression and protection and proceed to win phase." Just like it was in Synchro Cat and Saber format. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bringerofcake Posted July 31, 2012 Report Share Posted July 31, 2012 "If a player controls no Special Summoned monsters: They can pay 800 Life Points..." There. Fixed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeppeli Gyro Supreme Posted July 31, 2012 Report Share Posted July 31, 2012 I wish I had it back just so I could put it back in my Ratbox deck. Was so cash. The only time I Special Summoned was during the Damage Step, when this can't activate, and occasionally for a Synchro. Still, I know that's not happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newhat Posted July 31, 2012 Report Share Posted July 31, 2012 I miss this baby. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b0b3rt Posted July 31, 2012 Report Share Posted July 31, 2012 Lol Vayu Turbo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lonk Posted July 31, 2012 Report Share Posted July 31, 2012 [quote name='Le Magician' timestamp='1343763600' post='5993675'] Why should it come back? What is your reasoning? [/quote] This card was meant to punish Spam-Spam-Spam decks, and it wouldn't be harmful to have it come back for a format. People generally complain that this card is used by Spam-Spam-Spam decks as a mean to control the field. First of all, Spam-Spam-Spam Decks are not designed well and deserve to die, and banning Oppression really doesn't help kill them. In fact, this card could help undermeta decks achieve a level of control over the higher tier decks, especially in decks that can go past this card's effect. This card only saw Red Lights with Six Samurais after STOR, which (again) deserves to die for being spam and S/T control. My reasoning is that this card was never broken, but the fact is that spammy decks that shouldn't have been made like to use this and now everyone considers it broken because of that. It is as simple as that. I could see that people find it annoying (the limit solved that aspect), but I really do not like that people use the [url="http://yugioh.wikia.com/wiki/Scapegoat"]Scapegoat[/url] Effect on this card just because they are butthurt by the decks that use it. It should come back because the format we are playing in likes to spam cards out of nowhere, and that it is very useable by undermeta decks. Because of that, it could cause a shift in tiers and cause a more diverse playing field. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agro Posted July 31, 2012 Report Share Posted July 31, 2012 [quote name='Bringer☆de Cake' timestamp='1343763638' post='5993676'] "If a player controls no Special Summoned monsters: They can pay 800 Life Points..." There. Fixed. [/quote]Tier 1: evilfusion.dek; Macro Monarchs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bringerofcake Posted July 31, 2012 Report Share Posted July 31, 2012 [quote name='Agro' timestamp='1343767962' post='5993758'] Tier 1: evilfusion.dek; Macro Monarchs? [/quote] Well, it fixes the primary complaint about the card, in that the "both players" clause functionally doesn't exist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newhat Posted July 31, 2012 Report Share Posted July 31, 2012 Macro Monarchs? Can't you just negate the banished Survivor? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HSektor Posted July 31, 2012 Report Share Posted July 31, 2012 Maybe adding "This card can only be activated if you control no monsters" or "This card cannot be activated in your turn". It's a good card, but it's not used in the way that it was supposed to be used. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MK-ultra Posted July 31, 2012 Report Share Posted July 31, 2012 this card is to broken i ran it in a TELEDAD rental deck for a banned deck tourney if i drew into this it was preety much GG because i had to broke of a feild wont come back shouldnt come back </thread> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sleepy Posted July 31, 2012 Report Share Posted July 31, 2012 [quote name='Tentalus Therapist' timestamp='1343767330' post='5993739'] This card was meant to punish Spam-Spam-Spam decks, and it wouldn't be harmful to have it come back for a format. People generally complain that this card is used by Spam-Spam-Spam decks as a mean to control the field. First of all, Spam-Spam-Spam Decks are not designed well and deserve to die, and banning Oppression really doesn't help kill them. In fact, this card could help undermeta decks achieve a level of control over the higher tier decks, especially in decks that can go past this card's effect. This card only saw Red Lights with Six Samurais after STOR, which (again) deserves to die for being spam and S/T control. My reasoning is that this card was never broken, but the fact is that spammy decks that shouldn't have been made like to use this and now everyone considers it broken because of that. It is as simple as that. I could see that people find it annoying (the limit solved that aspect), but I really do not like that people use the [url="http://yugioh.wikia.com/wiki/Scapegoat"]Scapegoat[/url] Effect on this card just because they are butthurt by the decks that use it. It should come back because the format we are playing in likes to spam cards out of nowhere, and that it is very useable by undermeta decks. Because of that, it could cause a shift in tiers and cause a more diverse playing field. [/quote] Pretty much all the formats of more or less the last 6 years have liked to spam-spam-spam. and you said it yourself " Spam-Spam-Spam Decks are not designed well and deserve to die", so that'd mean killing a humongous amount of cards for the sake of making this card not as broken. I don't know about that, since this card would come back under the same conditions of "spam spam spam" we were in when it was banned, odds are that it'll just be used the abusive "spam-spam-spam-Royal activate- gg" way. My point is, the game has kind of, gone too far down that road of making Special Summons they key mechanic to play most Decks, even down to the casual level. Realistically, is not gonna come back as "anti-meta-only" if it comes back in the current state of the game. Inb4Konami's next series will have a new mechanic revolving around extra-Normal Summons and will be treated as Normal Summons from the Extra De-*shot* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lonk Posted July 31, 2012 Report Share Posted July 31, 2012 [quote name='Sleepy' timestamp='1343776702' post='5993865'] Pretty much all the formats of more or less the last 6 years have liked to spam-spam-spam. and you said it yourself " Spam-Spam-Spam Decks are not designed well and deserve to die", so that'd mean killing a humongous amount of cards for the sake of making this card not as broken. [b]There are only so many decks that are truly spamtastic, and those decks are the badly designed decks. Rest of the decks that Special Summon only Summon maybe once, twice or thrice a turn, with the rare chances of summoning more.[/b] I don't know about that, since this card would come back under the same conditions of "spam spam spam" we were in when it was banned, odds are that it'll just be used the abusive "spam-spam-spam-Royal activate- gg" way. [b]Bet you 10 bucks that it won't be that way this format. After all, the amount of S/T destruction this format is high, and the format is slowly moving to a more controlling format despite it being an obvious aggro-swarm format. It should be safe for it to come out for a format at least.[/b] My point is, the game has kind of, gone too far down that road of making Special Summons they key mechanic to play most Decks, even down to the casual level. Realistically, is not gonna come back as "anti-meta-only" if it comes back in the current state of the game. [b]Not really looking for "Anti-Meta only", but rather an all-around tech for decks that want to use it.[/b] Inb4Konami's next series will have a new mechanic revolving around extra-Normal Summons and will be treated as Normal Summons from the Extra De-*shot* [/quote] Sure, Special Summoning is an integral part of the game. However, it doesn't mean that a simple check like this card wouldn't be all-mightily devastating to the format. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miror B Posted August 1, 2012 Report Share Posted August 1, 2012 Wanna keep Special Summoning in check? Vanity's Emptiness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Majishan Posted August 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 1, 2012 [quote name='Tentalus Therapist' timestamp='1343767330' post='5993739'] This card was meant to punish Spam-Spam-Spam decks, and it wouldn't be harmful to have it come back for a format. People generally complain that this card is used by Spam-Spam-Spam decks as a mean to control the field. First of all, Spam-Spam-Spam Decks are not designed well and deserve to die, and banning Oppression really doesn't help kill them. In fact, this card could help undermeta decks achieve a level of control over the higher tier decks, especially in decks that can go past this card's effect. This card only saw Red Lights with Six Samurais after STOR, which (again) deserves to die for being spam and S/T control. My reasoning is that this card was never broken, but the fact is that spammy decks that shouldn't have been made like to use this and now everyone considers it broken because of that. It is as simple as that. I could see that people find it annoying (the limit solved that aspect), but I really do not like that people use the [url="http://yugioh.wikia.com/wiki/Scapegoat"]Scapegoat[/url] Effect on this card just because they are butthurt by the decks that use it. It should come back because the format we are playing in likes to spam cards out of nowhere, and that it is very useable by undermeta decks. Because of that, it could cause a shift in tiers and cause a more diverse playing field. [/quote] Even if spam decks were not so popular, shutting down an entire game mechanic for 800lp per summon is just too good. Also we have other ways to deal with spam, The Vanity cards being an example...and they are actually balanced. Shutting down entire game mechanics for little cost was always broken and will always be broken. Its like Cold Wave, the card was always broken because it effectively shuts down a key game mechanic for a 2 turns ....but no one knew how broken it was until it was abused for a few formats. Also this coming back would not do anything good for the meta....sure Under/Anti-Meta decks would get a new toy, but we would just go back to 2010 where spam decks would just spam their cards and flip this for GG. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toffee. Posted August 1, 2012 Report Share Posted August 1, 2012 [quote name='Agro' timestamp='1343767962' post='5993758'] Tier 1: evilfusion.dek;[/quote] >Metagame actually using Tribute Summons http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LUph092Wyec Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lonk Posted August 1, 2012 Report Share Posted August 1, 2012 [quote name='Le Magician' timestamp='1343782296' post='5993946'] Even if spam decks were not so popular, shutting down an entire game mechanic for 800lp per summon is just too good. Also we have other ways to deal with spam, The Vanity cards being an example...and they are actually balanced. Shutting down entire game mechanics for little cost was always broken and will always be broken. Its like Cold Wave, the card was always broken because it effectively shuts down a key game mechanic for a 2 turns ....but no one knew how broken it was until it was abused for a few formats. Also this coming back would not do anything good for the meta....sure Under/Anti-Meta decks would get a new toy, but we would just go back to 2010 where spam decks would just spam their cards and flip this for GG. [/quote] I could think of 10 more worse cards that are around than negating a Special Summon for 800 points. It's an over-glorified situation tbh, and it masks the true problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miror B Posted August 1, 2012 Report Share Posted August 1, 2012 [quote name='Tentalus Therapist' timestamp='1343783239' post='5993956'] I could think of 10 more worse cards that are around than negating a Special Summon for 800 points. It's an over-glorified situation tbh, and it masks the true problems. [/quote] It's not that it negates Special Summons. It's that it takes down an entire mechanic. As said, it was used to spam then ensure game. Not only that, with the ONLY threats to it being backrow hate, it's hard to get around. It's like saying cards are bad because Veiler. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Majishan Posted August 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 1, 2012 [quote name='Tentalus Therapist' timestamp='1343783239' post='5993956'] I could think of 10 more worse cards that are around than negating a Special Summon for 800 points. It's an over-glorified situation tbh, and it masks the true problems. [/quote] If by that you mean the broken cards that get SS'd, then yes they are a problem. But that does not change the fact that shutting down a game mechanic is bad for the game. Spamming is not even the main issue...the issue is what the spamming can lead to. If we did not have broken boss monsters and the game was as balanced as possible, spamming to turn little monsters into bigger monsters is actually a very cool concept and leads to game diversity. But Oppression shuts down that entire mechanic unless I have some form of S/T control. And again....do you really want a format where everyone just gets out their boss monsters and flips this so you can't answer their field? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BehindTheMask Posted August 1, 2012 Report Share Posted August 1, 2012 Make Shi En, flip Opression. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Majishan Posted August 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 1, 2012 [quote name='BehindTheMask' timestamp='1343789767' post='5994069'] Make Shi En, flip Opression. [/quote] Opponent proceeds to scoop phase. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lonk Posted August 1, 2012 Report Share Posted August 1, 2012 [quote name='Le Magician' timestamp='1343783928' post='5993968'] If by that you mean the broken cards that get SS'd, then yes they are a problem. But that does not change the fact that shutting down a game mechanic is bad for the game. Spamming is not even the main issue...the issue is what the spamming can lead to. If we did not have broken boss monsters and the game was as balanced as possible, spamming to turn little monsters into bigger monsters is actually a very cool concept and leads to game diversity. But Oppression shuts down that entire mechanic unless I have some form of S/T control. And again....do you really want a format where everyone just gets out their boss monsters and flips this so you can't answer their field? [/quote] Honestly, I would. It doesn't do a full shutdown of a mechanic as people make it out to be, and I find it pointless to flip after summoning a boss since the person is already in the state of winning the game. Even if one could Special Summon against the boss/swarmed field/whatever, would it really make a difference in who wins and who loses? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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