[TCG] January Banlist

[Dog King]

DNA surgery/zombie world, are pretty strong sides for bujin matches. other than soul drain. I find myself running them in decks that don't need the typing/grave as much.

yeah ive seen a lot of dna surgerys ran in 3s in the new jan 2014 list top 8 decks from different events

[TFMegamanlan]

That does stop most of they're power, but also isn't there some that just say "Bujin" Monster and no Specify Beast-Warrior Bujin?

[Delibirb]

That does stop most of they're power, but also isn't there some that just say "Bujin" Monster and no Specify Beast-Warrior Bujin?

Correct. But not the important ones like Crane, and I believe Ophidian.

 

But remember Centipede is a thing, as is MST and Royal Decree. A good Bujin deck isnt going to let a DNA Surgery stop them easily.

[TFMegamanlan]

im pretty sure in every top 32 there were about atleast 12 other decks that topped, and none of the time it was anything to do with zombies

Most were Evilswarm and that's mostly because they have a favorable match up against Dragons. There were a few others that could survive against Dragons...

[Althemia]

Correct. But not the important ones like Crane, and I believe Ophidian.
 
But remember Centipede is a thing, as is MST and Royal Decree. A good Bujin deck isnt going to let a DNA Surgery stop them easily.

what the hell

DNA Surgery completely wrecks that deck. They have to play cards like Twister etc just to stand a chance if it's flipped against them. Idk how you even consider Centipede an out to DNA Surgery

[Delibirb]

what the hell

DNA Surgery completely wrecks that deck. They have to play cards like Twister etc just to stand a chance if it's flipped against them. Idk how you even consider Centipede an out to DNA Surgery

I give the overreaction a 7. Needed more ad hominem.

 

Yes, I forgot Centipede's requirement of a Beast-Warrior. Regardless, a good Bujin deck is still going to foresee DNA surgeries and take precautions like triple MSTs and 2-3 Decrees and yes, twister, among other things. So in all likelihood, it wont wreck them, just slow them down for a few turns if they dont already have a response.

[Althemia]

I give the overreaction a 7. Needed more ad hominem.
 
Yes, I forgot Centipede's requirement of a Beast-Warrior. Regardless, a good Bujin deck is still going to foresee DNA surgeries and take precautions like triple MSTs and 2-3 Decrees and yes, twister, among other things. So in all likelihood, it wont wreck them, just slow them down for a few turns if they dont already have a response.

It's not an overreaction. DNA Surgery legitimately stops them from playing most of their good cards, which is why Tsukuyomi is such a vital part of the deck. If you do not get a response to it quickly, you will be overrun by just about any good deck in a matter of a turn or 2.

[Delibirb]

It's not an overreaction. DNA Surgery legitimately stops them from playing most of their good cards, which is why Tsukuyomi is such a vital part of the deck. If you do not get a response to it quickly, you will be overrun by just about any good deck in a matter of a turn or 2.

"what the hell"

"Idk how you even consider Centipede an out to DNA Surgery"

Were a bit overboard for forgetting Centipede's requirement. I didnt say it doesnt stop them, I said good Bujins will most likely have responses already because they know it is coming.

[The Hounds Of Anubis]

So they have to dilute the shit out of their deck and actually draw those specific cards in a deck with no draw power?

...So you're saying DNA Surgery doesn't stop them?

[Althemia]

I didnt say it doesnt stop them, I said good Bujins will most likely have responses already because they know it is coming.

Now that's a blanket statement and a half, isn't it? "Good Bujins will most likely have responses already" isn't exactly a viable statement as you are attempting to say that most of the time, anyone who does not have the response to DNA Surgery is a bad player. This isn't the case, as most players will not have the immediate response to it. Why? Because a very small percentage of your deck is an answer. If you have it, of course you will hold it. Taking into account that you play 3x MST and 3x Decree as your answer more than anything, that's 3/20 cards. 15% of your deck is an answer. You can't expect them to always have the answer and most importantly, you cannot judge their level of play by whether they open all the answers or not.

[Delibirb]

Now that's a blanket statement and a half, isn't it? "Good Bujins will most likely have responses already" isn't exactly a viable statement as you are attempting to say that most of the time, anyone who does not have the response to DNA Surgery is a bad player. This isn't the case, as most players will not have the immediate response to it. Why? Because a very small percentage of your deck is an answer. If you have it, of course you will hold it. Taking into account that you play 3x MST and 3x Decree as your answer more than anything, that's 3/20 cards. 15% of your deck is an answer. You can't expect them to always have the answer and most importantly, you cannot judge their level of play by whether they open all the answers or not.

You got all of that from 8 opinionated words of someone you shouldnt actually care about?

 

In all seriousness I didnt say any of that, and of course I know that they wont always have a response nor that you need to run them at all to be considered good. But, looking ahead and making predictions (The point of this thread, discussion and predicitons based on the banlist for next format), the Bujin players that will be topping, who will be considered good, will probably not be terribly fazed when their opponent flips a DNA surgery.

 

Its a very simple prediction that doesnt say anything about any of the other Bujin players who may not be topping, either because they arent planning for DNA surgery or arent drawing the cards they need to deal with it, nor that DNA Surgery isnt a good card against Bujins, when the cards are in your favor.

[Althemia]

You got all of that from 8 opinionated words of someone you shouldnt actually care about?

I don't like people saying stuff that is incorrect because newer people are more likely to pick up on it and believe it as true. I'm not doing it for your sake as much as everyone else's, so that they know why your point can be considered wrong. As such, I provided evidence and wrote extensively to make sure that it cannot be misinterpreted.

So I'm sorry if you have a problem with me attempting to teach people something.

the Bujin players that will be topping, who will be considered good, will probably not be terribly fazed when their opponent flips a DNA surgery.

If I may, I would like to start drawing comparisons to other decks from what you just said.

"The Spellbook players that will be topping, who will be considered good, will probably not be terribly fazed when their opponent flips Anti-Spell Fragrance / Eradicator Epidemic Virus."
"The Mermail players that will be topping, who will be considered good, will probably not be terribly fazed when their opponent flips Macro Cosmos / activates Dimensional Fissure."
"The Geargia players that will be topping, who will be considered good, will probably not be terribly fazed when their opponent flips Deck Devastation Virus."

As you can see, DNA Surgery has something in common with all of these. Potentially not to the same degree, but definitely there are similarities. It stops your opponent from seriously going at you and almost puts them out of the game entirely without drawing into an out. So to think that one of the requirements for being considered good is not being fazed by your opponent stopping you from playing the majority of the game, then I'd say that person's got a pretty good poker face because that's nearly impossible.

[Delibirb]

I don't like people saying stuff that is incorrect because newer people are more likely to pick up on it and believe it as true. I'm not doing it for your sake as much as everyone else's, so that they know why your point can be considered wrong. As such, I provided evidence and wrote extensively to make sure that it cannot be misinterpreted.

So I'm sorry if you have a problem with me attempting to teach people something.

First quickly, I edited my post with a legitmate response.

 

Second, I dont have a problem with that, but I do have a problem with one being clearly frustrated by an obvious opinion. What I said wasnt wrong, or at the very least is not currently, it is my prediction.

[The Hounds Of Anubis]

You got all of that from 8 opinionated words of someone you shouldnt actually care about?
 
In all seriousness I didnt say any of that, and of course I know that they wont always have a response nor that you need to run them at all to be considered good. But, looking ahead and making predictions (The point of this thread, discussion and predicitons based on the banlist for next format), the Bujin players that will be topping, who will be considered good, will probably not be terribly fazed when their opponent flips a DNA surgery.
 
Its a very simple prediction that doesnt say anything about any of the other Bujin players who may not be topping, either because they arent planning for DNA surgery or arent drawing the cards they need to deal with it, nor that DNA Surgery isnt a good card against Bujins, when the cards are in your favor.

What the actual fuck is wrong with you? Of course they'll be fazed by their opponent flipping up DNA Surgery. People side it vs them because it's good against them ffs. What you're saying is akin to saying "A good Dark World player won't even care if his opponent flips up Macro Cosmos." It's that idiotic.

[Delibirb]

What the actual fuck is wrong with you? Of course they'll be fazed by their opponent flipping up DNA Surgery. People side it vs them because it's good against them ffs. What you're saying is akin to saying "A good Dark World player won't even care if his opponent flips up Macro Cosmos." It's that idiotic.

Theres that 10 I was looking for!

 

Im glad you disagree with my opinion. Its important people have differing views. It isnt however to attack people for them.

 

My key words there were "probably" and "terribly", btw.

[TFMegamanlan]

Aren't you all forgetting that they can tech several cards in there Extra that don't need on Beast-Warriors that can destroy Surgery too? I'm still looking at that Iron Wall is effective as is Soul Drain against they're decks.

Judgement of Anubis is starting to like a better card to tech if people start being dumb and run 3 MST, Twister's, Tornados and more... What's next running Dust Tornado?

DNA Change has an effect on the deck, but its not a freaking near-Auto win against Bujin. They still have strong monsters and access to all Level 4 Generic and LIGHT only Xyz.

[The Hounds Of Anubis]

Theres that 10 I was looking for!
 
Im glad you disagree with my opinion. Its important people have differing views. It isnt however to attack people for them.
 
My key words there were "probably" and "terribly", btw.

I will, as you say, "attack" you if your assumption is flat out wrong and/or misguided. You're saying that there is a significant chance (hint: that's what the word probably implies) that a Bujin player isn't affected by DNA Surgery, which is flat out wrong. It seriously cripples the deck and removes almost literally every powerful play from the deck until they get rid of it. It's not a difficult concept.

[Delibirb]

I will, as you say, "attack" you if your assumption is flat out wrong and/or misguided. You're saying that there is a significant chance (hint: that's what the word probably implies) that a Bujin player isn't affected by DNA Surgery, which is flat out wrong. It seriously cripples the deck and removes almost literally every powerful play from the deck until they get rid of it. It's not a difficult concept.

I never said isnt affected. I didnt say DNA surgery isnt a good card against them, in fact I acknowledged above that it is a good anti-bujin card. I am just of the opinion that it may not be good enough, and that the Bujin players will be properly prepared to be able to push past it, if not right away then hopefully for them, quickly. When I used probably, I used it to describe the Bujin players' reactions to seeing it, not their ability to blatantly ignore it.

[The Hounds Of Anubis]

Explain better how it's not good enough.

You can't just say "dies to MST, so it's not good against them", since that's what your entire argument essentially boils down to. It stops all their good plays and forces them to have that MST/Twister. If they don't then they are completely unable to do anything.

[Delibirb]

Explain better how it's not good enough.

You can't just say "dies to MST, so it's not good against them", since that's what your entire argument essentially boils down to. It stops all their good plays and forces them to have that MST/Twister. If they don't then they are completely unable to do anything.

I think you may be trying too hard to disagree with my prediction if that is all you can see I am saying. Sorry if I am just over-explaining things, as opposed to my intended simplifying/justifying.

 

First off, MST is not their only option, its just the first one that comes to mind.

 

Ill repeat that DNA Surgery IS a good anti-bujiin card, but because Bujin players also know this they WILL have responses and, when the results are in, I think the Bujins will come out of that bind a respectable amount of the time. If you disagree with me that is fantastic, and perhaps we will see and you may be correct, thus my PREDICTION would be proven wrong.

[The Hounds Of Anubis]

Congratulations for explaining so well in that post how your whole argument doesn't just boil down to "dies to MST".

You deserve a gold star.

[Delibirb]

Congratulations for explaining so well in that post how your whole argument doesn't just boil down to "dies to MST".

You deserve a gold star.

Edited again, I do that a lot, sorry.

 

When I originally replied I didnt say I was going to further explain. Now I have a bit, and if you still dont get it I really am sorry, but that isnt changing anything.

 

If anyone would prefer to change the topic so this doesnt elevate too high, how about discussing Lonefire at 2 and its implications in Sylvans? Unless thats already been hit with a shovel...

[Dog King]

Most were Evilswarm and that's mostly because they have a favorable match up against Dragons. There were a few others that could survive against Dragons...

it was more fire fist and mermaill

 

anyway what are the top decks next format gonna be

 

im guessing its going to be like fire fists, mermail, bujin the obv ones

but like ive seen a dragon deck top 8 in an 80 duelist tournament using the next format, it like used shrine or whatever

[Althemia]

it was more fire fist and mermaill
 
anyway what are the top decks next format gonna be
 
im guessing its going to be like fire fists, mermail, bujin the obv ones
but like ive seen a dragon deck top 8 in an 80 duelist tournament using the next format, it like used shrine or whatever

Fire Fist
Mermail
Books
Geargia
Potentially Dragons again

Gravekeepers
Harpies
Bujin

[Delibirb]

it was more fire fist and mermaill

 

anyway what are the top decks next format gonna be

 

im guessing its going to be like fire fists, mermail, bujin the obv ones

but like ive seen a dragon deck top 8 in an 80 duelist tournament using the next format, it like used shrine or whatever

Im hoping, once TCG gets Cain and Abel, that Dustons will be top :) But that is less likely due to the spammy nature of some of the other predicted toppers.

 

We can only hope that a third form of Rulers will never make it to the top tables.