Aerion Brightflame Posted January 3, 2014 Report Share Posted January 3, 2014 It's a slippery-slope in the context of helping out the user while, simultaneously hurting the opponent. Monsters that would be natural beaters if it were not for their effects would not have to worry about them, there are a plethora of monsters that can dodge Skill Drain, and against Decks that need to have their monster effects resolve on the field due to their design absolutely die with this card. Even if the player does draw into something like MST, drawing it at the right time remains a problem, and drawing it too late would already spell a loss for that player just because they didn't draw the card during the critical points of the duel. The worst part is that Decks that run Skill Drain would be assisted by other problematic traps and forms of protection that would render the attempt of rewarding the player for interaction moot. Just saying... Isn't that context true of like almost every card that's worth using using? Like MST, Mirror Force, Bottomless, Bear, Plieades, Volca hell even just summoning a 1900 beater whilst they have 1800's out can be viewed as helping the user whilst hurting the opponent. You could name any card, and odds are that context would apply to them. It's not putting a card on a slippery slope, it just means the card does something. Also, a card like this must have a good reason of complaints if people complain this long. It's not like the philosophy of top-tier Decks that, once power creep settles in then people would stop complaining about it. But people do complain about top tier decks. And low tier ones. It's YGO, the playerbase will complain about anything. Certain cards get more complaints than others because they seemingly do unfair things. Not because those cards actually are unfair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wizarus Posted January 3, 2014 Report Share Posted January 3, 2014 There difference is that Skill Drain completely changes the way the game is played permanently the moment it's flipped, and at no cost. Which wouldn't be a problem if it was conditional, but it's not. Similar reason why Final Countdown was hit. It's not top tier, but FC does nothing but promote solitaire games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lonk Posted January 3, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 3, 2014 Just saying... Isn't that context true of like almost every card that's worth using using? Like MST, Mirror Force, Bottomless, Bear, Plieades, Volca hell even just summoning a 1900 beater whilst they have 1800's out can be viewed as helping the user whilst hurting the opponent. You could name any card, and odds are that context would apply to them. It's not putting a card on a slippery slope, it just means the card does something. But people do complain about top tier decks. And low tier ones. It's YGO, the playerbase will complain about anything. Certain cards get more complaints than others because they seemingly do unfair things. Not because those cards actually are unfair. Not really. The examples you either just hurt your opponent or are just integral parts of the game. Skill Drain's original intent was to make sure all the effects on the field are negated, which hurt/help depending on the Deck the user is playing. Also, if I'm not mistaken, the cards that people DO complain about do get list attention, right? Only Deck I can think of that's low tier that people complain about is Dark Worlds, which is more or less filled with fake illusions of unfairness rather than solid images of unfairness. Well, I would like to say Infernities as well, but they aren't exactly low tier. Once a Deck drops from top tier, people usually just stop complaining about it because it is no longer a top Deck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Hounds Of Anubis Posted January 3, 2014 Report Share Posted January 3, 2014 There difference is that Skill Drain completely changes the way the game is played permanently the moment it's flipped, and at no cost. Which wouldn't be a problem if it was conditional, but it's not. Similar reason why Final Countdown was hit. It's not top tier, but FC does nothing but promote solitaire games. 1000 LP is a cost, and a serious one in the decks that play it since they rarely have the board presence to really buffer their life total. It also IS conditional. You have to build your entire deck around it and if that's not conditional then idk what is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wizarus Posted January 3, 2014 Report Share Posted January 3, 2014 1000 LP is a cost, and a serious one in the decks that play it since they rarely have the board presence to really buffer their life total. It also IS conditional. You have to build your entire deck around it and if that's not conditional then idk what is. 1000 LP is not a cost at all, especially with Warning at 1. No one builds their deck around Skill Drain anymore, they use Skill Drain in decks that don't mind it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goddamnit names are a pain Posted January 3, 2014 Report Share Posted January 3, 2014 1000 LP is not a cost at all, especially with Warning at 1. No one builds their deck around Skill Drain anymore, they use Skill Drain in decks that don't mind it. 1000 LP You have 8000. 1/8 lost. Its a cost. I despise Solemn Warning because people also tend to either 1. Win next turn. or 2. Lose next turn. That LP cost is steep. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miror B Posted January 3, 2014 Report Share Posted January 3, 2014 1000 LP is not a cost at all, especially with Warning at 1. No one builds their deck around Skill Drain anymore, they use Skill Drain in decks that don't mind it. Let's run Skill Drain in E-Drags bro Big beaters win games right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wizarus Posted January 4, 2014 Report Share Posted January 4, 2014 Let's run Skill Drain in E-Drags bro Big beaters win games right? You're already beating everything in the game if you're running E-Dragons pre-2014, so what the point of running Skill Drain? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miror B Posted January 4, 2014 Report Share Posted January 4, 2014 You're already beating everything in the game if you're running E-Dragons pre-2014, so what the point of running Skill Drain? *shrugs* They don't mind it, so I use it right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Crouton Posted January 4, 2014 Report Share Posted January 4, 2014 You know, skimming this topic, if Konami listened to YCM instead of Pojo, Yugioh would be the most boring game in existence after Konami kills all the "unfair" and "skilless" cards. Bad design can make a game fun when done right. Skill Drain is right. It forces the opponent to prepare and adapt for a deck-destroying situation, and to conserve cards that can get rid of it. This card isn't at all unfair, and can't be splashed into just any deck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blake Posted January 4, 2014 Report Share Posted January 4, 2014 You're already beating everything in the game if you're running E-Dragons pre-2014, so what the point of running Skill Drain? It's funny cause there was a Druler variant last format that ran Skill Drain in the main. It didn't last too long because Dragunity Rulers and later Mythic Rulers, but it was still a viable way to build the deck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian Posted January 4, 2014 Report Share Posted January 4, 2014 Skill Drain is godly this format. It literally stops all the meta decks and they don't usually have any maindeck'd responses to it other than MST (save Marksman, Centipede, Fate, and perhaps something else I've missed). Even with most decks playing triple MST now, flipping a Skill Drain on your opponent can usually spell game unless they can draw one of them. Not many decks are able to capitalize on this powerful card which gives decks like Darkworlds, T.G.'s, Malefic Valley, and rouge Drain decks (galaxy could be included here too) a fighting chance against the rest of the meta. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Althemia Posted January 4, 2014 Report Share Posted January 4, 2014 Skill Drain is godly this format. It literally stops all the meta decks and they don't usually have any maindeck'd responses to it other than MST (save Marksman, Centipede, Fate, and perhaps something else I've missed).A lot of decks are maining Trap Stun and Seven Tools this format. Those are technically answers if you're a deck that's fast enough like Geargia or Fire Fist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
玄魔の王 Posted January 4, 2014 Report Share Posted January 4, 2014 @Marksman: you flip it and it fizzles. I think you meant Infantry. A lot of decks are maining Trap Stun and Seven Tools this format. Those are technically answers if you're a deck that's fast enough like Geargia or Fire Fist. That's true, but it's also not saying a lot for grind game decks like Bujin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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