OMEGAcat Posted January 9, 2015 Report Share Posted January 9, 2015 http://www.pri.org/stories/2014-09-29/world-actually-becoming-more-peaceful-believe-it-or-not (directed at OP - because they said that the world is becoming more violent) Also, to the topic at hand: Hatred does not cease by hatred, but by love. That is the eternal rule. We shouldnt be hating the Muslim people(or is it Islamic? I seriously have no clue, someone please fill me in(this is not sarcasm, i swear))). Their religion is not the problem. It is the terrorist groups who commit this hateful acts. If you want to be angry, be angry at those causing harm. Islam is the religion, Muslims are the practitioners. On the topic, someone finally wrote up a more succinct version of how I feel about the issue: http://www.hoodedutilitarian.com/2015/01/in-the-wake-of-charlie-hebdo-free-speech-does-not-mean-freedom-from-criticism/#.dpuf Reminder that the majority of Muslims live in Asia and comprise roughly 20% of the world's population. Radical Islamic terrorists make up a smaller percentage of Islam than bigoted Christians do of Christianity. Also can we please understand that physical violence is not the only form of violence. The extremely inflammatory cartoons Charlie Hebdo was creating were a form of violence against Muslims. The murder that it led to is not defensible, but I'm so tired of people defending this as free speech. Just because legally, you are allowed to, doesn't mean you should (friendly reminder that it was once legal to own slaves) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chairman ali Posted January 9, 2015 Report Share Posted January 9, 2015 I think people really need to read this: http://mic.com/articles/107988/the-hero-of-the-charlie-hebdo-shooting-we-re-overlooking Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tentacruel Posted January 9, 2015 Report Share Posted January 9, 2015 I think people really need to read this: http://mic.com/articles/107988/the-hero-of-the-charlie-hebdo-shooting-we-re-overlooking Absolutely. While the violence was in no way justified, the newspaper in question is sounding very similar to /r/atheism levels of retardation. Freedom of Speech? Sure. I will use mine to say how fucking stupid those cartoons are. That man died defending someone's right to mock him, I'd much rather remember him than Charlie whatshisface. Edit: I thought Charlie Hebdo was a person. Never mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slinky Posted January 9, 2015 Report Share Posted January 9, 2015 Update: Police are now in standoffs in 2 seperate areas. One Area has the 2 brothers who are holding hostages including women and children. The second area has a Black man and his white girlfriend (suspects in the police shooting, and are assumed to be the drivers of the getaway car in the magazine shooting as the previous one has been cleared). So, we now have connections between the shooting of the officers and the attack on the magazine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aerion Brightflame Posted January 9, 2015 Report Share Posted January 9, 2015 Further update: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-30752239 They got the two suspects for the magazine attack. Apparently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slinky Posted January 9, 2015 Report Share Posted January 9, 2015 The Black suspect is dead now too. Female is still on the run. Authorities are still expecting more attacks. Current speculation is, that the brothers didn't intend to come out alive, they just wanted to prolong the media coverage as long as they could, and it would have just been over had they suicided at Charlie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spinny Posted January 9, 2015 Report Share Posted January 9, 2015 I find this funny. (Not the fact that people died obviously) But how its all just a vicious cycle of stupidity that manages to worsen itself at every action. What the paper was doing was wrong and there's no two ways about that. They killed the paper , this is also wrong. They outright kill the terrorists, this isn't so wrong, its actually doing the gene pool a favor tbh but it still means more death. Because of how they were killed the Muslims react further, there reputation going down further. Hatred is brought upon Muslims and even the innocent are harmed, and this breaks out into further uncomfortable for even none believers tbh, because of how they dealt with the situation. (This is a prediction now) And now everyone is screaming and the video game nerds are well equipped for the upcoming apocalypse because they saw it all happen in many games in the past. And here i am, laughing at their stupidity, what a nice person I am. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.Rai Posted January 10, 2015 Report Share Posted January 10, 2015 I find this funny. (Not the fact that people died obviously) But how its all just a vicious cycle of stupidity that manages to worsen itself at every action. What the paper was doing was wrong and there's no two ways about that. They killed the paper , this is also wrong. They outright kill the terrorists, this isn't so wrong, its actually doing the gene pool a favor tbh but it still means more death. Because of how they were killed the Muslims react further, there reputation going down further. Hatred is brought upon Muslims and even the innocent are harmed, and this breaks out into further uncomfortable for even none believers tbh, because of how they dealt with the situation. (This is a prediction now) And now everyone is screaming and the video game nerds are well equipped for the upcoming apocalypse because they saw it all happen in many games in the past. And here i am, laughing at their stupidity, what a nice person I am. That was ludicrously speculative, all the way through. Is what the paper did wrong? Arguable, that's part of the debate. to say there's 'no two ways about it' is pretty absolutist. Is satire unacceptable? Is it dangerous? Lots of people would say no. Is extremism genetic? Almost certainly not. To even justify a death in those means, even if it were the death of a terrorist, I'm not comfortable with that. This is a minor point, but this just seems like focusing on the negativity. 'The Muslims react further'. Genuinely don't even know what that means. I'm not sure if you've actually been keeping up with the news, but the feeling in France and many other countries is one of support and solidarity. And certainly the reactions in its wake have been to promote that and dissuade religious and socio-political extremism. Who's screaming? What apocalypse? Who are you laughing at? If you're talking about the social upheaval currently occurring in the Middle East, it's happening right now. It's been happening for years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tentacruel Posted January 10, 2015 Report Share Posted January 10, 2015 I find this funny. (Not the fact that people died obviously) But how its all just a vicious cycle of stupidity that manages to worsen itself at every action. What the paper was doing was wrong and there's no two ways about that. They killed the paper , this is also wrong. They outright kill the terrorists, this isn't so wrong, its actually doing the gene pool a favor tbh but it still means more death. Because of how they were killed the Muslims react further, there reputation going down further. Hatred is brought upon Muslims and even the innocent are harmed, and this breaks out into further uncomfortable for even none believers tbh, because of how they dealt with the situation. (This is a prediction now) And now everyone is screaming and the video game nerds are well equipped for the upcoming apocalypse because they saw it all happen in many games in the past. And here i am, laughing at their stupidity, what a nice person I am. help I am so much smarter than everyone around me Edit: It would appear several hostages were killed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chairman ali Posted January 10, 2015 Report Share Posted January 10, 2015 And now everyone is screaming and the video game nerds are well equipped for the upcoming apocalypse because they saw it all happen in many games in the past. War in the Middle East, Afghanistan, Pakistan, etc. has been going on since... well lets just say 200 years is an understatement. I know the War in the Middle East has been going on since the martyrdom of Prophet Mohammad (PBUH)... it never really stopped. So I'm really unsure what you mean by "nerds are well equipped"... Anyone with history education knows what's going on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OMEGAcat Posted January 10, 2015 Report Share Posted January 10, 2015 Is what the paper did wrong? Arguable, that's part of the debate. to say there's 'no two ways about it' is pretty absolutist. Is satire unacceptable? Is it dangerous? Lots of people would say no. I'm honestly still trying to understand how mocking jews and muslims in a country that is already highly anti-semtic and islamaphobic counts as satire Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slinky Posted January 10, 2015 Report Share Posted January 10, 2015 In addition to that. Is making fun of a religion a bad thing to do? Absolutely not, most comedians do this type of crap at some point in their lives, and it isn't just Islam that gets it, its pretty much everything. So they are really beating a dead horse here. That said, Continually making fun of a specific religion without rest, while not wrong, is still a completely dick move. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dad Posted January 10, 2015 Report Share Posted January 10, 2015 I'm honestly still trying to understand how mocking jews and muslims in a country that is already highly anti-semtic and islamaphobic counts as satire In addition to that. Is making fun of a religion a bad thing to do? Absolutely not, most comedians do this type of crap at some point in their lives, and it isn't just Islam that gets it, its pretty much everything. So they are really beating a dead horse here. That said, Continually making fun of a specific religion without rest, while not wrong, is still a completely dick move. Stop. Hebdo was not making fun of Muslims or their religion. It was making fun of terrorists and politics who were using the religion in a way to oppress people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordCowCowCowCowCowCowCowCow Posted January 10, 2015 Report Share Posted January 10, 2015 Stop. Hebdo was not making fun of Muslims or their religion. It was making fun of terrorists and politics who were using the religion in a way to oppress people. If I remember correctly. Showing an image of the prophet Mohammad is a bad thing to begin with. And there has been multiple instances of the comics degrading the religious figure. Not defending the actions but I'd like to point that out. Though I might be mistaken. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cool Girl Posted January 10, 2015 Report Share Posted January 10, 2015 This is sooo sad! I WAS BORN IN PARIS! Whoever did this needs to let people have their freedom of speech! This sorta of reminds of the Sony hacks where Sony had to pull "The Interview" because of these attacks! This is kinda of the same thing! Hope things get better for my hometown! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blake Posted January 10, 2015 Report Share Posted January 10, 2015 If I remember correctly. Showing an image of the prophet Mohammad is a bad thing to begin with. And there has been multiple instances of the comics degrading the religious figure. Not defending the actions but I'd like to point that out. Though I might be mistaken.I don't know about Hebdo, but I'd like to point out that "do not take the Lord's name in vain" meant "don't so much as speak his name unless it is the most serious of srs bsnss" in the Bible originally. Hence YHWH being how God was written, as opposed to Yahweh. So I'm pretty sure satirical cartoons about Jehovah would fall under the same as picturing Mohammed at all. Granted, this was not held up as well, but the point remains. That's all I've got to say on this. I do disagree wth the portrayals of God, so it's logical to understand rage at the portrayals of Mohammad, but if one's accepted then, logically, both would be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chairman ali Posted January 10, 2015 Report Share Posted January 10, 2015 In addition to that. Is making fun of a religion a bad thing to do? Absolutely not, most comedians do this type of crap at some point in their lives, and it isn't just Islam that gets it, its pretty much everything. So they are really beating a dead horse here. That said, Continually making fun of a specific religion without rest, while not wrong, is still a completely dick move. I don't agree. Why should I make fun of someone if they believe in extraterrestrials? What if they witnessed something I didn't? Should we just respect what the majority thinks is correct and ride with it? It's arrogant and inconsiderate to make fun of someone's belief—be it religious, philosophical, scientific, etc. just because you don't agree with it. I thought people said lets believe in peace and love. Where's the love? You're just trying to spread hatred. Edit: About the "picturing" of Prophet Mohammad (PBUH), it has been brought up in Islamic debates. Most scholars agree on the idea that it is allowed to draw/paint the prophet (pbuh) as long as you're not saying that this is what he ACTUALLY looks like or degrading him (like what Charlie Hebdo did and the Denmark incident that happened a few years ago which led to Muslim countries to stop buying products from Denmark). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slinky Posted January 10, 2015 Report Share Posted January 10, 2015 Believing in aliens has nothing to do with religion.. so.. I don't see your point? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thar Posted January 10, 2015 Report Share Posted January 10, 2015 Believing in aliens has nothing to do with religion.. so.. I don't see your point? Religion is the belief and following of a higher being. If you wanna get technical, aliens are considered higher beings compared to us apes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goddamnit names are a pain Posted January 10, 2015 Report Share Posted January 10, 2015 Religion is the belief and following of a higher being. If you wanna get technical, aliens are considered higher beings compared to us apes. Aliens are also considered foreign peoples in biblical/etc times (and even today, rarely). =D Me being more technical. Hue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thar Posted January 10, 2015 Report Share Posted January 10, 2015 Aliens are also considered foreign peoples in biblical/etc times (and even today, rarely). =D Yes I know, but the context was the extra-terrestrial kind. =D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordCowCowCowCowCowCowCowCow Posted January 10, 2015 Report Share Posted January 10, 2015 inb4 lock Anyway, the point is that mocking someone based on their beliefs, when you have no idea why they hold such beliefs and can't truly say they are wrong...is a bad thing. At least I'd think so. (referring to religion...and aliens, in general here) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chairman ali Posted January 10, 2015 Report Share Posted January 10, 2015 Believing in aliens has nothing to do with religion.. so.. I don't see your point? You don't seem to know how to put anything together. My point wasn't about Aliens and religion. It was about the accepted and unaccepted. inb4 lock Anyway, the point is that mocking someone based on their beliefs, when you have no idea why they hold such beliefs and can't truly say they are wrong...is a bad thing. At least I'd think so. (referring to religion...and aliens, in general here) should've been locked long time ago. This thread just serves as a post count increaser. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agro Posted January 10, 2015 Report Share Posted January 10, 2015 inb4 lock Anyway, the point is that mocking someone based on their beliefs, when you have no idea why they hold such beliefs and can't truly say they are wrong...is a bad thing. At least I'd think so. (referring to religion...and aliens, in general here) unless its mormonism because book of mormon is a funny musical ...what were we talking about? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maeriberii Haan Posted January 10, 2015 Report Share Posted January 10, 2015 unless its mormonism because book of mormon is a funny musical ...what were we talking about? Please do not spam. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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