YCM Member Brawl DX

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

When you put it like that...it does look like an admission of guilt lol

 

Anyway, I look forward to a Hina vs Yui showdown (and obv I hope my nom wins it :3 )

[Tormented]

Seeing as a position is now free I would like to offer my participation in this popularity contest to further boost my already large ego

[Blake]

When you put it like that...it does look like an admission of guilt lol

 

Anyway, I look forward to a Hina vs Yui showdown (and obv I hope my nom wins it :3 )

That is the nature of the Alford Plea, you know.

[mitchermitcher]

It's why I suggested not dropping out if you aren't actually guilty.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

That is the nature of the Alford Plea, you know.

*shrugs*

 

Yes, somewhat unfortunate

 

Keeping the votes private means people don't get shamed into voting on way or the other. What bothered me the most about 2-15 isn't the increased votes, but rather how both Yui and I lost votes, at times yesterday at 3 at a time. 

 

And keeping them public won't change anything either. You don't know who voted in round 1, so how are you gonna decide if someone cheated in round 3? More than likely, what will happen is in close races, people who normally don't care will vote for their friends. 

 

I think Yui and Hina are both cool people who have the best chance at winning this. And you will see increased votes for these high caliber races regardless of private or public. 

 

I didn't admit to cheating, because I don't think cheating occurred. Last time Yui was up, he got 29 votes, his opponent got 7, and there were to abstains

 

That's pretty close to 41. 

[Blake]

Round 1 isn't Round 2. Round 1 had many topics that had more votes than Round 2 has had.

 

Making them public won't tell us who did it in the past, but it allows a sharper lookout in the future. To prevent this from happening again.

 

If the person responsible would make an admission, we could keep votes private. An Alford Plea isn't enough.

 

This does make me wish there was a setting that your vote was set in stone and/or you only get to vote once even if you delete. But I guess, even if we had that, there would be issues of making a mistake funking you over.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

It's why I suggested not dropping out if you aren't actually guilty.

These sorta things aggravate me. I will admit that I changed my vote from Yui to myself for a while yesterday after I got frustrated as a vote jump. That's a 2 pt fluctuation right there. It was petty, and I regret doing it, which is why I changed it back to Yui pretty fast. I don't think I would have won this round, and the math is there to show that. I lucked out last round with an inactive member. I was hoping me leaving the contest would stop people from looking in each other's closets for skeletons because again

 

29+7+2 (Yui last time without me) is basically equal to 41

 

Close races drive out turn out. I think black is flawed in his assumption that there's cheating, and I'd rather get out then let it get muddled. And also cause I wasn't my top choice 

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

Round 1 isn't Round 2. Round 1 had many topics that had more votes than Round 2 has had.

 

Making them public won't tell us who did it in the past, but it allows a sharper lookout in the future. To prevent this from happening again.

 

If the person responsible would make an admission, we could keep votes private. An Alford Plea isn't enough.

 

This does make me wish there was a setting that your vote was set in stone and/or you only get to vote once even if you delete. But I guess, even if we had that, there would be issues of making a mistake funking you over.

Well then you really don't have a case now do you. I don't care about say Rinne or the twins as much as I do about Vla1ne. I didn't feel like voting just to abstain, so I didn't vote in contests outside of the ones I care about

 

Yui and I both retained our support to the most point. As did Hina and Sakai. If you want to find cheating defined a higher voter turn out, you have to consider a co-variance which you're setting to zero in this case. 

 

I'll admit to changing my vote between Yui and Winter and back to Winter which created swings. And I'm pretty sure others did too. Beyond that there was nothing. And before you start purging voter rolls in future rounds, I want to set forth very clearly how you define someone as an infrequent voter. Frankly I don't think what you're doing here is fair to anyone

[Blake]

First round will always yield more because it's newer and exciting. That's how it goes for basically any event or poll, IRL or online.

 

Last I checked, this round capped at 33, with the exception of 2-15 and 2-16 hitting 42 at its high point. With 0 abstains. It is more logical to assume foul play than to assume that one topic suddenly spiked much higher than the others.

 

Resigning then deciding to fight it only makes it more muddled.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

IK

 

:P

 

I might as well scoop and save myself the assbeating tho

 

 

IK

 

:P

 

I might as well scoop and save myself the assbeating tho

 

 

I'm scooping cause, while I fundamentally disagree with what you're doing, I've always maintained that Yui will win. I did not cheat, nor do I think anyone else did. But given you disagree and suddenly want to change the tournament, I'm gonna pull my name out of the hat here cause that basically gets the same result as it would have before you got involved 

First round will always yield more because it's newer and exciting. That's how it goes for basically any event or poll, IRL or online.

 

Last I checked, this round capped at 33, with the exception of 2-15 and 2-16 hitting 42 at its high point. With 0 abstains. It is more logical to assume foul play than to assume that one topic suddenly spiked much higher than the others.

 

Resigning then deciding to fight it only makes it more muddled.

And there was fluctuation in round 1 as well. Some races had as high as 38, others as low as 29

 

the same 10 pt swing we see here. And no, those cases were not Yui vs Me, or me vs yui, or Hina vs Yui. 

 

If Giga or Nai has high turn out who will you blame then? 

 

edit: 

 

Another reason, people either really hate me, or really like me. I was going to reply to Jack's post yesterday where he noted the same. People who really dislike me will be more energized to vote against, and vice versa. That (1) aggravates me (2) gives you reason to go secret police with no underlying justification. And I'd rather not have any part in it. 

 

It doesn't matter if you call me guilty or not, you basically all but spelled it out that you think I am. So funk it, but this won't just happen with this round regardless of how you change the vote settings

[Blake]

Well then you really don't have a case now do you. I don't care about say Rinne or the twins as much as I do about Vla1ne. I didn't feel like voting just to abstain, so I didn't vote in contests outside of the ones I care about

 

Yui and I both retained our support to the most point. As did Hina and Sakai. If you want to find cheating defined a higher voter turn out, you have to consider a co-variance which you're setting to zero in this case. 

 

I'll admit to changing my vote between Yui and Winter and back to Winter which created swings. And I'm pretty sure others did too. Beyond that there was nothing. And before you start purging voter rolls in future rounds, I want to set forth very clearly how you define someone as an infrequent voter. Frankly I don't think what you're doing here is fair to anyone

 

Winter, that is a large margin of difference. Absurdly so when the others are within 29-33 at this time, and within 29-31 earlier, when 2-15 and 2-16 hit 42. It is illogical to assume that just happened.

 

Votes go down by rounds, and the first round had a lot of variance in votes. This trumped even the first round, while this round was fairly uniform. It's suspect.

 

You resigned. I didn't force you to. All I'm doing is making votes public in the future to make it more fair to everyone, if less convenient. 

 

I'm scooping cause, while I fundamentally disagree with what you're doing, I've always maintained that Yui will win. I did not cheat, nor do I think anyone else did. But given you disagree and suddenly want to change the tournament, I'm gonna pull my name out of the hat here cause that basically gets the same result as it would have before you got involved

I'm not changing anything except votes being public or not, which you told me to do.

I'm scooping cause, while I fundamentally disagree with what you're doing, I've always maintained that Yui will win. I did not cheat, nor do I think anyone else did. But given you disagree and suddenly want to change the tournament, I'm gonna pull my name out of the hat here cause that basically gets the same result as it would have before you got involved 

 

And there was fluctuation in round 1 as well. Some races had as high as 39, others as low as 29

 

the same 10 pt swing we see here. And no, those cases were not Yui vs Me, or me vs yui, or Hina vs Yui.

you are ignoring that literally every other topic was uniform

 

IF you resigned, and you say you scoop, and that you don't want it muddled, then why are you still pressing this? I haven't changed anything except votes being public or not. I didn't force your hand. All I did was try to keep things fair.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

 

Winter, that is a large margin of difference. Absurdly so when the others are within 29-33 at this time, and within 29-31 earlier, when 2-15 and 2-16 hit 42. It is illogical to assume that just happened.

 

Votes go down by rounds, and the first round had a lot of variance in votes. This trumped even the first round, while this round was fairly uniform. It's suspect.

 

You resigned. I didn't force you to. All I'm doing is making votes public in the future to make it more fair to everyone, if less convenient. 

 

 

I'm not changing anything except votes being public or not, which you told me to do.

you are ignoring that literally every other topic was uniform

 

IF you resigned, and you say you scoop, and that you don't want it muddled, then why are you still pressing this? I haven't changed anything except votes being public or not. I didn't force your hand. All I did was try to keep things fair.

 

Votes should have been made public from the start. Cow pretty much schooled me on this when it came up last with people voting and then not voting in rounds for the FE poll. It doesn't mean new votes or suppression. It should have been visible from the start, or not visible at all the entire way. Regardless, turnout does fluctuate. 

 

It's not a huge swing from 33 to 41 (you claim 42, but I never saw that). You threw two of the highest vote getters from round 1 into this 15/16 and then you expect turn out to drop?

 

That'd only be the case if Yui and Hina weren't so far above their cut in round 1. The way I see it, most of the people who voted for me or Yui or Hina in round 2, decide to show up for round 2

 

I care, because you're all but saying I rigged this (to lose) when I said from the start I would lose. That pisses me off. But it's w/e

[Blake]

Votes should have been made public from the start. Cow pretty much schooled me on this when it came up last with people voting and then not voting in rounds for the FE poll. It doesn't mean new votes or suppression. It should have been visible from the start, or not visible at all the entire way. Regardless, turnout does fluctuate. 

 

It's not a huge swing from 33 to 41 (you claim 42, but I never saw that). You threw two of the highest vote getters from round 1 into this 15/16 and then you expect turn out to drop?

 

That'd only be the case if Yui and Hina weren't so far above their cut in round 1. The way I see it, most of the people who voted for me or Yui or Hina in round 2, decide to show up for round 2

 

I care, because you're all but saying I rigged this (to lose) when I said from the start I would lose. That pisses me off. But it's w/e

I'm going to tell you the same thing I told Striker.

"Then why didn’t you speak up sooner? We’re halfway into the second round, you could have easily said something round 1 when others asked about it. Don’t be a jackass."

 

You don't get to say "I knew better" if you don't open your mouth.

 

I have evidence of 42.

 

Fusion was also high. Fusion is not dominating this round by any means. Additionally, at the time this was taken, the highest votes was a 32, with others being 29-31. That's a huge difference for a round 2 match that changed drastically overnight.

 

I'm not putting blame on you. I gave your statement, and I specificed not to pin the blame on you. You took an Alford Plea at the moment, and I have to announce someone dropping out. Like Mitch said, it's your actions that make you look suspicious. I even tried to tell you that the vote would decide if the four of you dipped out, and you still chose to resign at that time.

 

That is suspicious. I don't have to pain a picture to make it look that way. I reported it as unbiased as I could.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

I'm going to tell you the same thing I told Striker.

"Then why didn’t you speak up sooner? We’re halfway into the second round, you could have easily said something round 1 when others asked about it. Don’t be a jackass."

 

You don't get to say "I knew better" if you don't open your mouth.

 

I have evidence of 42.

 

Fusion was also high. Fusion is not dominating this round by any means. Additionally, at the time this was taken, the highest votes was a 32, with others being 29-31. That's a huge difference for a round 2 match that changed drastically overnight.

 

I'm not putting blame on you. I gave your statement, and I specificed not to pin the blame on you. You took an Alford Plea at the moment, and I have to announce someone dropping out. Like Mitch said, it's your actions that make you look suspicious. I even tried to tell you that the vote would decide if the four of you dipped out, and you still chose to resign at that time.

 

That is suspicious. I don't have to pain a picture to make it look that way. I reported it as unbiased as I could.

You went to bed early, when I went to bed at 10ish it was the same way it is now. Yui 3 pts ahead, but like 19/16. I cause a fluctuation when I switched my vote after seeing Yui go from a tied race to +7 yesterday early. Even that would be "significant" by the crude measures you're using to claim there's been "cheating" 

 

The only time the margin ever really changed was this morning from Yui +3 to Yui +1 and yesterday after Polaris and Jack voted, likely for me, bringing it down from Yui +5 to Yui +3

 

The fact remains that your entire claim rests on the idea that between a person who nearly won the modship and an active member of RP, me and Hina, that we could not have retained our votes from round one. 

 

I don't think me changing my vote was cheating, petty maybe, but I did changed it back eventually. I'm uncomfortable with you changing how you're calculating votes midway through because now you have no control group to compare it to. Assuming monotonic turnout is flawed and will just hurt the tournament. 

 

In order for there to be cheating with the fairly constant margin, atleast three people would have had to cheat. It didn't funking happen. 

 

Edit:

 

Yui back to a 3 pt lead, so crazy, someone must be cheating even after he won...or you're just being paranoid and stupid black

[Blake]

You went to bed early, when I went to bed at 10ish it was the same way it is now. Yui 3 pts ahead, but like 19/16. I cause a fluctuation when I switched my vote after seeing Yui go from a tied race to +7 yesterday early. Even that would be "significant" by the crude measures you're using to claim there's been "cheating" 

 

The only time the margin ever really changed was this morning from Yui +3 to Yui +1 and yesterday after Polaris and Jack voted, likely for me, bringing it down from Yui +5 to Yui +3

 

The fact remains that your entire claim rests on the idea that between a person who nearly won the modship and an active member of RP, me and Hina, that we could not have retained our votes from round one. 

 

I don't think me changing my vote was cheating, petty maybe, but I did change it back eventually. I'm uncomfortable with you changing how you're calculating votes midway through because now you have no control group to compare it to. Assuming monotonic turnout is flawed and will just hurt the tournament. 

Why would you know I went to bed early? I came back to YCM before I went to bed last night, I just  didn't realize that I was still anonymously logged in on my phone. I was here at 12~ my time, which is a little under 11 hours ago. I checked the threads and thing looked kosher. I woke up, it no longer looked kosher.

 

Your assumption relies on the fact that hype doesn't die between rounds, and that the hype being retained would only apply to Yui and Hina, as every other turnout is less than before. You require mroe assumptions than my idea that someone is trying to funk sheet up.

 

A. no one is saying you changing your vote once was cheating, the fact that you keep mentioning it is the only suspect part.

B. I'm not changing calculation of votes. I'm changing if they're public or not. Stop trying to force an issue.

C. Assuming that such a large fluctuation is normal compared to literally every other thread is illogical.

 

If you said you're gonna scoop, then just drop it already.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

Why would you know I went to bed early? I came back to YCM before I went to bed last night, I just  didn't realize that I was still anonymously logged in on my phone. I was here at 12~ my time, which is a little under 11 hours ago. I checked the threads and thing looked kosher. I woke up, it no longer looked kosher.

 

Your assumption relies on the fact that hype doesn't die between rounds, and that the hype being retained would only apply to Yui and Hina, as every other turnout is less than before. You require mroe assumptions than my idea that someone is trying to funk sheet up.

 

A. no one is saying you changing your vote once was cheating, the fact that you keep mentioning it is the only suspect part.

B. I'm not changing calculation of votes. I'm changing if they're public or not. Stop trying to force an issue.

C. Assuming that such a large fluctuation is normal compared to literally every other thread is illogical.

 

If you said you're gonna scoop, then just drop it already.

Remember your status saying you were worried something big and bad was coming down and that you would respond later? I was certainly up after that

 

The vote margin was Yui +3 when you left, it's Yui +3 now. If someone was unfairly calling in votes, vote margin would not be conserved. 

 

I'm assuming that YCM's near Mod, YCM's most controversial person, and Hina in a race will attract attention from people who cared enough to vote in round 1. Rates are also similar between other races in R1 and 2

 

I resigned because from the start I maintained I would lose to Yui, and from the start he has held a slight, but existent, edge over me. All my friends have voted. The person I want to win is either Hina or Vla1ne or Polaris, given I'm already going to lose, there's no reason to let you screw things up based on some nonobjective sense of Kosher

 

Yes, votes should be public from the start, that's what I used in FE to track who voted and make sure no rando votes happened. You did not do that that. Round 3 might be public, and if someone who doesn't post votes, you have no right to call them out, because you have no control

 

Changing public/private does affect how people vote, and how you measure it. 

 

Cut your losses, I certainly am. And keep the YMB private

 

Edit: The only reason I brought up the vote changing is cause I don't wanna walk into a perjury trap you set for me. "I didn't cheat, ok did you change your vote, yeh, well that's cheating" 

[Blake]

Remember your status saying you were worried something big and bad was coming down and that you would respond later? I was certainly up after that

 

The vote margin was Yui +3 when you left, it's Yui +3 now. If someone was unfairly calling in votes, vote margin would not be conserved. 

 

I'm assuming that YCM's near Mod, YCM's most controversial person, and Hina in a race will attract attention from people who cared enough to vote in round 1. Rates are also similar between other races in R1 and 2

 

I resigned because from the start I maintained I would lose to Yui, and from the start he has held a slight, but existent, edge over me. All my friends have voted. The person I want to win is either Hina or Vla1ne or Polaris, given I'm already going to lose, there's no reason to let you screw things up based on some nonobjective sense of Kosher

 

Yes, votes should be public from the start, that's what I used in FE to track who voted and make sure no rando votes happened. You did not do that that. Round 3 might be public, and if someone who doesn't post votes, you have no right to call them out, because you have no control

 

Changing public/private does affect how people vote, and how you measure it. 

 

Cut your losses, I certainly am. And keep the YMB private

 

Edit: The only reason I brought up the vote changing is cause I don't wanna walk into a perjury trap you set for me. "I didn't cheat, ok did you change your vote, yeh, well that's cheating" 

that status was at 6:40 for me

 

You keep ignoring that this would only apply to this thread while the rest of the threads have a much lower turnout.

 

You didn't say anyting before mid round 2 about votes being public being better. As such, you have no right to claim you knew it was better now. There was discourse you could have commented on and chose not to.

 

If there are obvious outliers, I can and will. Hopefully it doesn't come to that point, but this was a fear I had from the start. and lo and behold someone had ot go and do the wrong thing, as is the conclusion with fewer assumptions.

 

It doesn't change how I measure it. The funk are you on about?

 

It's going public. If you want to admit you rigged it so that we can move on in private, fine. But if you're innocent, leave it. You're not helping anything, not even your own case, just making it worse.

 

I didn't set a trap. There is no trap. Changing your vote isn't cheating.

 

I'm telling you to drop it now, not as a mod, but as the host of the YMB. This is going in circles, at best.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

Making it public will only force people to choose between friends and have everyone know that choice. It's not a binary choice. Given that neither of us had the foresight to make it public in round 1, you have literally no idea who is an irregular voter. Basically you're giving yourself powers to moderate every close or controversial race. My case is already sunk (as I've noted for the 10 millionth time, Yui was always going to win this), I'm more concerned about you using this an excuse to mess with future races. 

 

Your action of making things public will change how people vote. And guess what, that changes the measured result. And I'm telling you this as a host of YMB, you're making things worse for no reason by changing things half way through 

[Blake]

Making it public will only force people to choose between friends and have everyone know that choice. It's not a binary choice. Given that neither of us had the foresight to make it public in round 1, you have literally no idea who is an irregular voter. Basically you're giving yourself powers to moderate every close or controversial race. My case is already sunk (as I've noted for the 10 millionth time, Yui was always going to win this), I'm more concerned about you using this an excuse to mess with future races. 

Why would I mess with them? Do you really think me partial like that?

 

If you have doubts about me as a host, go for it. But I don't believe I've given a reason for you to feel that way.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

Why would I mess with them? Do you really think me partial like that?

 

If you have doubts about me as a host, go for it. But I don't believe I've given a reason for you to feel that way.

Stop misunderstanding, I don't think you got involve here to throw the race to any one person. I think the idea of anyone dictating what's a regular voter vs not is suspect at best cause there's not clear framework for that. 

 

I was wrong when I got angry at Birdie for voting in FE in the last round, but not in the recent rounds. It's not fair, wasn't then, isn't now. I no longer have a dog in this race. I have nothing to gain, so please don't do this

[Blake]

I'm not going to police anything except for what is a clear outlier. There is an easy way to play around that, but I'm doing what I can to keep it most fair for the participants. That's all there is to this.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

There's nothing "clear" about the term "clear outlier"

 

Basically anyone can vote in round 3 and you'd only be able to judge round 4 onward. Or are you gonna aggressively PM everyone who votes and be like why did you vote for such and such?

 

How the hell can't you see the problems with your idea

[Blake]

If a thread has 10 votes more than the others, there's a clear problem. If someone shows up after months of not posting, there's a clear problem.

 

No idea is perfect. You're looking for a perfect solution to a human problem. That's not realistic. I'm doing the best I can with what I have.

 

I'm asking you to drop it.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

Fine, noting my opposition to public votes, unless you can make round 1 and 2 public too

 

Beyond that, carry on

[Blake]

 

Round 3 is up.

 

Death Metal has a BYE.