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byakkformat (in addition to the March 2012 list)

byak

By byak
in Yu-Gi-Oh! TCG/OCG Card Discussion

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Brinolovania Newbie

Brinolovania

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[quote name='byakklon Omega' timestamp='1330569430' post='5848980']
really though I'd like some logical arguments against some of the choices
[/quote]kk, I'm gonna try this.

1.Should Debris really be at three? As mentioned earlier, Dandy is still around, and it's more dangerous with Lonefire back at two. Also, with Reaper, Trooper, and random level fours for Xyz stuff, it does still seem spammable at three.

2.I'd say Marshmallon shouldn't be unlimited, because the only decks it'll promote are stall/burn decks that are stupid and decrease player interaction and are bad for the game and stuff.

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byak Newbie

byak

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[quote name='Mu-12' timestamp='1330570165' post='5849009']
Six Sam United's not the problem, Gateway is, and that stayed limited.
[/quote]
[quote name='BrokenHeart15' timestamp='1330569995' post='5849001']
Why's Six Same United not there?
[/quote]

Six Samurai United is in fact a problem, but I'd rather just keep Gateway banned to see how the deck goes.

[quote name='Pacmanexus' timestamp='1330569841' post='5848992']
kk, I'm gonna try this.

1.Should Debris really be at three? As mentioned earlier, Dandy is still around, and it's more dangerous with Lonefire back at two. Also, with Reaper, Trooper, and random level fours for Xyz stuff, it does still seem spammable at three.

2.I'd say Marshmallon shouldn't be unlimited, because the only decks it'll promote are stall/burn decks that are stupid and decrease player interaction and are bad for the game and stuff.
[/quote]

Debris Dragon can get wrecked by basically any hand trap in the game + Fiendish Chain and Book. While it has access to Black Rose Dragon which I admit is good, it doesn't actually matter that much anymore, and Trishula is banned as well which is one of the reasons why Debris Dragon was so good in the first place. Debris Dragon also promotes Xyz Summons or something idk.

Marshmallon's already going to two which doesn't really cause that much of an impact, and to be honest neither would it going to three. It's pointless at two and it's not going to see much play either way.

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byak Newbie

byak

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[quote name='Ieyasu Tokugawa' timestamp='1330570679' post='5849042']
Send 1 card to the Graveyard.
Gain 2 cards.
+0 obvs.
This topic is getting amazing.
[/quote]

I would assume he's summoning Shi En in that scenario, in which case it would become a +0 since Shi En is a -1 summon.

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Brinolovania Newbie

Brinolovania

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[quote name='byakklon Omega' timestamp='1330570575' post='5849032']
Debris Dragon can get wrecked by basically any hand trap in the game + Fiendish Chain and Book. While it has access to Black Rose Dragon which I admit is good, it doesn't actually matter that much anymore, and Trishula is banned as well which is one of the reasons why Debris Dragon was so good in the first place. Debris Dragon also promotes Xyz Summons or something idk.

Marshmallon's already going to two which doesn't really cause that much of an impact, and to be honest neither would it going to three. It's pointless at two and it's not going to see much play either way.
[/quote]Rat dies to hand traps and Fiendish too. Except for Maxx, they kill Dragonfly too. Really, that whole point is the "it can be countered" logic that sucks. Also, Black Rose isn't quite as dangerous, but normal summoning a field nuke is normal summoning a field nuke. Or a Utopia or Chain or whatever.

True, the impact isn't giant, but my point is that the only decks it helps are terrible for the game.

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byak Newbie

byak

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[quote name='Ieyasu Tokugawa' timestamp='1330570892' post='5849060']
Oh yes summoning is a -1. I am sooooo stupid.

Edit: @Byak: The card itself is a +1 without Synchros. Shi-En is just the bonus after summoning the monsters.
[/quote]

But what makes it a problem is that Shi En becomes a +0 summon

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Lonk Newbie

Lonk

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[quote name='byakklon Omega' timestamp='1330564336' post='5848764']
there's too many abuse engines
[/quote]

Can you explain which engines are actually abusive? Then, I will make a failure attempt to counter that reasoning. To be honest, Leviair @0 pretty much kills the only abusible form of spamming Laggias.

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Toffee. Newbie

Toffee.

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[quote name='Mu-12' timestamp='1330557052' post='5848442']
There's a reason why byakk won last YCM Awards as best TCGer.[/quote]
Yes, because Me and Byakk were tied, and I voted for Byakk in order to break said tie, and give him the victory.

[quote name='byakklon Omega' timestamp='1330570575' post='5849032']
Six Samurai United is in fact a problem, but I'd rather just keep Gateway banned to see how the deck goes.[/quote]
Problem with Gateway, is the fact it doesn't have a Once-Per-Turn clause, and can use counts from [i]ANYWHERE[/i] on the field :/

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Ieyasu Tokugawa Newbie

Ieyasu Tokugawa

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[quote name='~~Xiahou Dun~~' timestamp='1330571291' post='5849088']
And for the record, I said at most because Kageki + Kagemusha + Six Samurai = a net total of -1.

If you already had something out at the time with one counter on SSU, and you decide to go into Shi En, that right there is a -2 (because you already played SSU), and then using it nets you a +-0.
[/quote]
...
I'm done.

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byak Newbie

byak

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[quote name='Pacmanexus' timestamp='1330571074' post='5849075']
Rat dies to hand traps and Fiendish too. Except for Maxx, they kill Dragonfly too. Really, that whole point is the "it can be countered" logic that sucks. Also, Black Rose isn't quite as dangerous, but normal summoning a field nuke is normal summoning a field nuke. Or a Utopia or Chain or whatever.

True, the impact isn't giant, but my point is that the only decks it helps are terrible for the game.
[/quote]

have you ever been Maxx "C"'d when going Debris -> Dandy? it's a horrible feeling.

also another reason why Debris would be at 3 is to throw some new life into the metagame. The banlist was designed to nerf the top 3 decks, but in addition to that you need to bring other decks up to their level for a varied metagame. Debris opens up a lot of deck ideas and adds life to the metagame, as well as punishes players who overextend anyway.

Marshmallon would help decks that are terrible for the game but those decks aren't remotely good in the first place.

[quote name='Koloktos' timestamp='1330571232' post='5849084']
Can you explain which engines are actually abusive? Then, I will make a failure attempt to counter that reasoning. To be honest, Leviair @0 pretty much kills the only abusible form of spamming Laggias.
[/quote]

Evols are a big contributer, sporting an arsenal of Evo-Force + Najasho, Westlo + Book/Tsuku, Vulcano, etc.

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