Cards I think should be banned

[Cute Rotten Yoshika]

Wooooooarrrrgh! of course you call monsters vs dragons, that doesnt mean the logic of "call spells" doesnt apply anymore. dragons ruin most paradigms by being dragons. this wont stop veiler, veiler will stop this. every single one of those other effects is better handled by masquerade. or competent backrow. jesus are you even trying anymore? were you ever trying?

[Trebuchet MS]

I use all 3 so Shocky can't ultimately stop all of them. If they call Spells, I'll pop it w/ a Monster eff, attack or Trap. If they call Traps, I'll use a Spell/Monster. If they call Monster, I'll use a Spell/Trap. Plus Divine Wrath is still a Counter Trap which means they can't chain a non Counter Trap to it.

My argument is that if you auto-lose because of a Shocky, then I'm saying it might be because your deck's unbalanced and relies too much on one type which is what Shock Master was made to Counter.

 

 

My Crystal Beast Deck (it's been updated from the one here) can handle a Shock Master. I'll either A. Pop it with Scrap Dragon, Bounce it with Chidori, or run it over with a powered-up Monster, B. Book of Moon it, or Dark Hole it, C. Kill it with Bottomless, Torritential, or Divine Wrath it.


Yep, also siding some cards that pop cards help too. Like Raigeki Break, or things like that.

 

Crystal Beasts with not-so-Chainable Traps? Wouldn't that clog up your backrow a bit if you're "balancing" all card types?

[The Warden]

Okay you diseased little mind, are you high, or stupid? Or both?

 

Shock Ruller is not overhyped, he is a disgusting degenerate card that had no place in the game, at, ALL. He was either a near one-sided Skill Drain, or a Spell or Trap specific Cold Wave. Do you really think that he has a place in the Sept format? Do you? If so, then you are clearly unparalled in stupidity. The point of this banlist was to cut down on the dumb, hence the widespread banning of the top deck's power cards, as well as cutting back on the staples in order to justify losing Heavy Storm.

 

What would happen if he were to still be around? You keep whining about counters for him, so what do you do when BTH is @1, Compuls is @1, Torrential is @1, Dark Hole is @1 & Book of Moon is @1. How far do you get when the total number of outs for him is 5? But oh no, in your perfect world you always have the counters don't you? No. That's not how this game fecking works. You can never always have the counters, it's statistically impossible. You cannot always be prepared for whatever your opponent throws your way.

 

And tell me buttercup, how will your crummy little CB deck make their Xyz or their Synchros when Shock is on the field turn 1 and declaring monsters. Pegasus won't activate, and neither will Carbuncle. And too bad all their support relies on their gimmick, since big bad Shockie just stopped the most efficient way to do it beyond ramming your own monsters. Wanna know why I used this example? Because first turn is when you're most likely to see Shock. Most Rank 4 spam decks are fully capable of getting Shock to the field Turn 1, and then it's all downhill from there. Even more so in our current format, since Spells and Traps are in decline.

 

The only other time you see Shock is late game when your resources are pretty tapped, ensuring game for the owner. Cause that's all Shock ever did. He's designed to stun your opponent whilst doing nothing to you, at all. That's why he was called Shock Lock. He's completely degenerate, and offers nothing good for this game since he doesn't hurt you and just promotes unfair OTKs.

[Mugendramon]

Okay you diseased little mind, are you high, or stupid? Or both?

 

Shock Ruller is not overhyped, he is a disgusting degenerate card that had no place in the game, at, ALL. He was either a near one-sided Skill Drain, or a Spell or Trap specific Cold Wave. Do you really think that he has a place in the Sept format? Do you? If so, then you are clearly unparalled in stupidity. The point of this banlist was to cut down on the dumb, hence the widespread banning of the top deck's power cards, as well as cutting back on the staples in order to justify losing Heavy Storm.

 

What would happen if he were to still be around? You keep whining about counters for him, so what do you do when BTH is @1, Compuls is @1, Torrential is @1, Dark Hole is @1 & Book of Moon is @1. How far do you get when the total number of outs for him is 5? But oh no, in your perfect world you always have the counters don't you? No. That's not how this game fecking works. You can never always have the counters, it's statistically impossible. You cannot always be prepared for whatever your opponent throws your way.

 

And tell me buttercup, how will your crummy little CB deck make their Xyz or their Synchros when Shock is on the field turn 1 and declaring monsters. Pegasus won't activate, and neither will Carbuncle. And too bad all their support relies on their gimmick, since big bad Shockie just stopped the most efficient way to do it beyond ramming your own monsters. Wanna know why I used this example? Because first turn is when you're most likely to see Shock. Most Rank 4 spam decks are fully capable of getting Shock to the field Turn 1, and then it's all downhill from there. Even more so in our current format, since Spells and Traps are in decline.

 

The only other time you see Shock is late game when your resources are pretty tapped, ensuring game for the owner. Cause that's all Shock ever did. He's designed to stun your opponent whilst doing nothing to you, at all. That's why he was called Shock Lock. He's completely degenerate, and offers nothing good for this game since he doesn't hurt you and just promotes unfair OTKs.

 

Well someone's butthurt. True as their words may be.

[Toffee.]

Well someone's butthurt. True as their words may be.

Blind, please, Shock is in no way a balanced card.

[The Warden]

Well yeah it's butthurt, because people who have never been on the receiving end of N16 don't know what it's like to put up with it.

[TFMegamanlan]

I was on the receiving end of it, except that I actually beat him. Oh yea, how does your "Big Bad 1st turn Shocky" work when I'm not only using my "gimmicky" effects?
A Pegasus and a Crystal Release breaks over him easily so thanks for wasting your resources.
If your deck can't handle a simple problem as No. 16, then your deck isn't worth winning any games.

[Toffee.]

A Pegasus and a Crystal Release breaks over him easily so thanks for wasting your resources.

Jar Robber breaks over your Pot of Greed so thanks for wasting your draw engine.

If your deck can't handle a simple problem as No. 16, then your deck isn't worth winning any games.

This is terrible reasoning.
Yes, you got lucky and beat over Shock Master. This does not once disprove anything, since Shock is still busted.

[The Warden]

I was on the receiving end of it, except that I actually beat him. Oh yea, how does your "Big Bad 1st turn Shocky" work when I'm not only using my "gimmicky" effects?
A Pegasus and a Crystal Release breaks over him easily so thanks for wasting your resources.
If your deck can't handle a simple problem as No. 16, then your deck isn't worth winning any games.

 

See, this just proves my point on your paramount ignorance. You got lucky, that's it. You CAN'T always have the out. You can't always have the answer, it's impossible. N16 is not a simple problem, and the logic that "You can't beat it, so your deck sucks" just proves how bad you are. A deck can have a hard counter yes, but when one card can hard counter EVERYTHING is when we have a problem.

[TFMegamanlan]

I didn't play against it once and got lucky, I played against it several times (I think at least 10 times) and I beat it every time except once because it was late game and BLS + Judgement were out too.

To be honest, now it seems like most people want to just ban all Draw cards or cards that just so happened to be effective because it can mess up their deck. To me I don't see No. 16 as a problem, you guys see it as a problem because it can actually effectively crush your decks. Mine can respond to Shock Master much more effectively.
Should we ban Vanity's Emptyness as it does the exact same thing except with Special Summons? Or Mistake because it shuts down Draws effectively? What about Royal Decree? All of these cards have very similar if not the same advantages/disadvantages No. 16 has but harder. So why don't we ban those cards too then?

[Toffee.]

Hey guys, Magic Jammer exists. So this means Raigeki is a balanced card, because every single duel I was able to negate it.

[Trebuchet MS]

A Pegasus and a Crystal Release breaks over him easily so thanks for wasting your resources.

First Turn Shockies call Monster Effects or Spells, normally. Try again.

[The Warden]

By the sounds of it, yes you did. But what you're ignoring is that one card can single-handedly shut down one-third of the game for no cost.

 

It doesn't hurt you since like Oppression/Emptiness, you do all your stuff before activating it, then you get to watch your opponent squirm. Do you think that's fair? DO you think it's fair that at the beck and call of any Rank 4 deck is a card that says "no" to one-third of the game? No, it's not. That's why Oppression was banned, because it got to say "no" to an important part of the game. That's why Cold Wave was banned as well, and if you haven't ntoiced, Shock is even worse than Cold Wave.

 

Now tell me, without saying "It can be countered or run down", how Shock Ruler is a justified existence.

[goddamnit names are a pain]

I've been on both ends of Shock Master. Annoying? Yes. 

I didn't often lose to Shock Master because of two things:

One, my opponents were idiots. And when I played it, I was an idiot too. (Declared stuff before I used it for that turn).

And I had many ways to get out of Shock Master. But then again, I played decks that liked to do random crap, got lucky too much, and made me think I was a good player. Wait, doesn't this seem a certain person on this thread?
I am not as appalled as the people here are about NO 16, but he does suck in some ways.

[TFMegamanlan]

Cold Wave wasn't banned for a VERY long time nor was Royal Opression until not 1 Deck but several decks found ways to easily abuse the cards. I mean come on, Shocky had toys which could abuse him that was really about it except for a dedicated deck.

So why shouldn't we ban Jinzo or Amplifier because that's just OP then?
Or how about Spell Canceller? That shuts down Spells.
What about Plazma or Splendid Venus?

And what about No.11? He just steals for free too.
I play another game where it hurts when you have to face a Card that makes effects useless, but in that game we deal with the problem not just decide to ban a card because we now find the card was actually good especially if the card has ways to counter it.

In fact I remember this being the arguments over why MST shouldn't be limited back in 5D's time or Dark Hole shouldn't be banned and Call of the Haunted shouldn't be limited/banned. People were crying that it would be way to powerful and can wipe out too much and is completely too powerful and look where we are now.

[goddamnit names are a pain]

In fact I remember this being the arguments over why MST shouldn't be limited back in 5D's time or Dark Hole shouldn't be banned and Call of the Haunted shouldn't be limited/banned. People were crying that it would be way to powerful and can wipe out too much and is completely too powerful and look where we are now.

Let's face facts. Whoever said that was an idiot.

[TFMegamanlan]

Regardless in my opinion, Shocky isn't as OP as everyone thinks. But to me I'd prefer it'd be limited then Banned. That's something that won't change.
And also my deck isn't like any Crystal Beast deck most people have seen. It works very well for me.

Regardless, the biggest thing I want to see off the banlist is Monster Reborn.

[goddamnit names are a pain]

Regardless in my opinion, Shocky isn't as OP as everyone thinks. But to me I'd prefer it'd be limited then Banned. That's something that won't change.
And also my deck isn't like any Crystal Beast deck most people have seen. It works very well for me.

Regardless, the biggest thing I want to see off the banlist is Monster Reborn.

Monster Reborn was like a miracle worker out of nowhere. I am neutral towards it. Also, I don't know if you play on DN in or not, but feel free to come and prove how strong your Crystal Beasts are against me. No, I don't run Dragon Rulers.

 

And I agree, some people are blowing it out of promotion, and should fill out a butthurt report accordingly. But it is still OP, and OP gets hit. I think banned was a little too much, but then again, most people only play one of the card. The only step to stopping it being spammed was to ban it.

[TFMegamanlan]

I do play DN but I can't get on it right now. If I could I'd play you though.

Reborn is the thing my deck would love the most.

My entire argument is that there are a lot of counters to No. 16 (not just a few with the compared cards) and while I agree that it may have been more balanced if there was more of a cost but still I think the card isn't the be-all end-all that most people here are claiming it is...

[Alastar Rainford]

Why unban monster reborn when every archetype has grave control now and days...keep it banned,honestly though on topic of OP...only thing I see for January banlist is sixth sence @0,heroes are fine w/o stratos,I am sure dragon rulers will be limited...after that really nothing.As is I have had more fun this format than most,counting Diva-Dad.

Oh and Shock stays 0
Be funny if the look at OCG for ideas XD. Limit Tishy j/k

[TFMegamanlan]

"Most" Decks don't have Grave control. Just the dumb Dragons and decks like Mermail and a little bit of Prophecy. Most decks that are not Top Tier don't have really good Grave control.

Rulers will not be limited, Semi'd maybe but not limited just yet.

And you don't think Return from the DD will get banned too?

[Alastar Rainford]

Noble knights
Zombies
Madolches
E Dragons
Heroes
Fire Fist
Spellbooks
Crystal Beast
Asire
Synchro based
Xyz based decks
Ninjas
Sharks
Rocks
Plants
Dragons
Hieratics
Symbols
Gimmicks
Cydra
Psychics
Fire Fists
Hazy Flames

Basically every deck this format has grave control. Please tell me one that doesn't.

[TFMegamanlan]

Your crazy if you think Crystal Beasts actually have Grave control. They have 2 cards that directly affect the Grave and neither SS at all. Abundance is a Field wipe more then Grave Control.
I actually play the deck and I know very well it has close to no Grave Control. (And only stupid CB players play Call of the Haunted. It only messes up your Backrow)

[Dementuo]

Your crazy if you think Crystal Beasts actually have Grave control. They have 2 cards that directly affect the Grave and neither SS at all. Abundance is a Field wipe more then Grave Control.
I actually play the deck and I know very well it has close to no Grave Control. (And only stupid CB players play Call of the Haunted. It only messes up your Backrow)

 

 

Noble knights
Zombies
Madolches
E Dragons
Heroes
Fire Fist
Spellbooks
Crystal Beast
Asire
Synchro based
Xyz based decks
Ninjas
Sharks
Rocks
Plants
Dragons
Hieratics
Symbols
Gimmicks
Cydra
Psychics
Hazy Flames

Bujin

Mermail

Basically every deck this format has grave control. Please tell me one that doesn't.

Congrats on knocking one off the list. Now you have only 23 more decks to go!

22 if you don't count Dragons, since there's no way to argue they don't have grave control.

[Alastar Rainford]

But first he says hey have none,then he states they have 2.