TCG Banlist March 31, 2017

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

You can play around vanity the same way you're gonna have to play around ASF, Dracotraps, and now imperial order. By maining BR removal cards and having MD outs.

 

IMO, should have gone to 3 before 0

[Darj]

You do realize how stupid that would be, right?

 

How would it be stupid? Konami is not unfamiliar with erratas anymore. If they already nerf-errata'd old cards, there shouldn't be any issue with emergency-errata'ing new ones. I understand the stances against erratas and that retrains are an acceptable option as well, but it appears Konami doesn't mind nor care about the implications of errata'ing cards, so yeah.

 

Besides, I am aware an emergency errata was and is highly unlikely, but I can still wish for it, right?

 

 

Not funny, it makes sense. Someone else put it best; with Emptiness at 3 it's a card you can build and play around expecting to see often, but at 1 it becomes that random sack that you would be stupid to try and play around yet there's nothing you can do once it hits. Either have it at 3 or ban it, though much better to keep a complete shut-out card banned than anything.

 

IDK, I'm of the opinion that players should at least side some cards against backrow. Otherwise they expose themselves to auto-losing to floodgates like, well, Emptiness. I don't mind it being gone, won't miss it and understand how less floodgates is good for the game, but I do find funny how TCG has this antagonism against floodgates while OCG still keeps stuff like Skill Drain at 3.

[Zauls]

zoo is still the best deck

 

Rat semi doesn't kill the deck at all

 

Never said the Rat semi killed the deck, but it won't be as dominant. Will still be tier 1, but the playing field has leveled out. Also, I'm pretty sure more 60-card decks topped Prague than Pure/Kaiju Zoo, and 60-card Paleo won the event, so you could even argue that they were at least fairly evenly matched anyway and this tips the balance in favour of 60-card decks.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

Well OCG likes a format with more freedoms and more pitfalls.

 

TCG is aiming to simplify the game seemingly

 

Assuming Zoos gonna run IF now

[Tinkerer]

This list makes a lot of sense tbh. I guess the "biggest" hits are the Maxx C and the Ratpier ones.

 

I personally don't like 1 particular aspect of this list though: even weaker turn 2. I wasn't one who enjoyed Maxx C, but it being a factor to help against players making large T1 boards was nice. Similar thing with Interrupted Kaiju Slumber.

 

Other than that, I wouldn't have expected a huge Zoo hit (considering how they're probably still milking it), but a semi-limit should lower Rat's splashability (rather than its use in the Zoodiac deck) by a tad. I'm fine with it. They'll be killed off next list anyway.

 

Tyrant Neptune... This was obviously preemptive as they can't ban a card that hasn't been released yet. My thoughts on it are kinda like this: if they're hitting Kaijus, they can't just keep consistently searchable/summonable "Superboss"-type cards around either. As for which card is to blame (Tyrant, Nightingale, or IF)... I really don't care that much tbh.

[Chaosix]

zoo is still the best deck

 

Rat semi doesn't kill the deck at all

Yes, yes it does kill zoo. The entire deck was so good because you could summon 1 rat then summon 2 more to go into emeral, and then go into other various combos. Now that you cant summon the emeral, you cant really do anything other than drident.

[VCR_CAT]

How would it be stupid? Konami is not unfamiliar with erratas anymore. If they already nerf-errata'd old cards, there shouldn't be any issue with emergency-errata'ing new ones. I understand the stances against erratas and that retrains are an acceptable option as well, but it appears Konami doesn't mind nor care about the implications of errata'ing cards, so yeah.

 

Besides, I am aware an emergency errata was and is highly unlikely, but I can still wish for it, right?

 

The erratas have only happened for old, banned cards long out of print. Doing an errata on a perfectly fine card that's already been recently released but doing so for a different region is just dumb. It makes no sense, and it isn't required at all. Neptune's the card that's going to get busted by something else, if not Nightengale, so if they feel they need to hit something, make it the old card that's only used for these kind of plays anyways.

 

 

IDK, I'm of the opinion that players should at least side some cards against backrow. Otherwise they expose themselves to auto-losing to floodgates like, well, Emptiness. I don't mind it being gone, won't miss it and understand how less floodgates is good for the game, but I do find funny how TCG has this antagonism against floodgates while OCG still keeps stuff like Skill Drain at 3.

 

 

I believe you of all people should remember the mantra of "Just because there are outs doesn't make it fine alone"? People do side for backrow, but you don't always see cards you can't search, now do you.

 

 

As for why Zoos weren't hit as much, remember that MACR hasn't released yet, and the OCG did a similar list before its release as well; they just hit different cards, and the hit against Ratpier hopefully means that they'll be able to dethrone Zoodiacs without outright killing the deck like the OCG did.

[Kaiji]

Never said the Rat semi killed the deck, but it won't be as dominant. Will still be tier 1, but the playing field has leveled out. Also, I'm pretty sure more 60-card decks topped Prague than Pure/Kaiju Zoo, and 60-card Paleo won the event, so you could even argue that they were at least fairly evenly matched anyway and this tips the balance in favour of 60-card decks.

js zoo is more than capable of playing 60 cards as any additional card played is siding against paleo and noid

[Darj]

I believe you of all people should remember the mantra of "Just because there are outs doesn't make it fine alone"? People do side for backrow, but you don't always see cards you can't search, now do you.

 

Yes, I know that argument well. But with floodgates around, and that being something players can't control, they got to be ready for them.

And again, I understand how less floodgates is in a way good for the game; I mainly found funny the contrast on floodgates between OCG and TCG, not the ban of floodgates.

 

The erratas have only happened for old, banned cards long out of print. Doing an errata on a perfectly fine card that's already been recently released but doing so for a different region is just dumb. It makes no sense, and it isn't required at all. Neptune's the card that's going to get busted by something else, if not Nightengale, so if they feel they need to hit something, make it the old card that's only used for these kind of plays anyways.

 

I wouldn't call Independent Nightingale a "perfectly fine" card when it's abused by Neptune. Really, a Seraphinite clause, or a "this card gains these effects when Fusion Summoned" clause as Parenthesis mentioned in another thread, would have kept the card in check just fine.

 

They could just call it a misprint, like the misprinted Neo Deadalus that lacked their Nomi clauses :v

 

Also, inb4 Nightingale is abused by the copying effect of Supreme King Servant Dragon Starving Venom xD

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

As for why Zoos weren't hit as much, remember that MACR hasn't released yet, and the OCG did a similar list before its release as well; they just hit different cards, and the hit against Ratpier hopefully means that they'll be able to dethrone Zoodiacs without outright killing the deck like the OCG did.

Zoos are not dead in OCG

[Delibirb]

Zoos are not dead in OCG

And Rainbow Dragon is good in Crystal Beasts.

 

They may very well still be used as an engine, in 60 card decks or alongside other cards like True Dracos, but on their own, they cannot hold out against the competition anymore, with any reasonable consistency or effectiveness. You're in denial, as per usual, and it's fairly unecessary here. True Dracos were always cooler anyway, and are somewhat more versatile.

[Blake]

Yes, yes it does kill zoo. The entire deck was so good because you could summon 1 rat then summon 2 more to go into emeral, and then go into other various combos. Now that you cant summon the emeral, you cant really do anything other than drident.

lol

 

Viper variant exists, rat is still a cheap advantage card, you're sticking your head in the sand if you think it's dead

 

"Oh no the main combo is gone it no longer functions!!"

 

See how poor that is?

And Rainbow Dragon is good in Crystal Beasts.

 

They may very well still be used as an engine, in 60 card decks or alongside other cards like True Dracos, but on their own, they cannot hold out against the competition anymore, with any reasonable consistency or effectiveness. You're in denial, as per usual, and it's fairly unecessary here. True Dracos were always cooler anyway, and are somewhat more versatile.

zoo as a deck on its own was always kinda just a meme, it's always been an engine

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

And Rainbow Dragon is good in Crystal Beasts.

 

They may very well still be used as an engine, in 60 card decks or alongside other cards like True Dracos, but on their own, they cannot hold out against the competition anymore, with any reasonable consistency or effectiveness. You're in denial, as per usual, and it's fairly unnecessary here. True Dracos were always cooler anyway, and are somewhat more versatile.

I was unaware of Crystal Beast w/ or w/o Rainbow Dragon winning multiple regionals sized tournaments

 

I'm not in denial. It's a draw/search/fielding engine. It mills it's own Avarice (From the limited rat). It makes it's own Radiant off one card. 

 

Your narrow minded, as per usual, and it's fairly unnecessary here. 

 

---

 

True Draco is a separate topic. We're talking solely the merits of Zoos in OCG

[~~~~]

Wait so the list takes effect on March 31st...

 

 

...could this be forshadowing for the TCG banlist to return to its list per 6 months as if TCG were having troubles with getting used to the OCG 3 month change when it happened this could make sense (also means the next list would be September 31st.)

 

At least rat at 2 doesn't seem that bad for TCG (at test it doesn't mean your facing 3 Drident) also as funny as vanity's being banned we still have 3 Dimension Barrier and the now unbanned Imperial Order to stop our spells.

Triple Drident? who tf have you been playing against? Drident has a HOPT on the 1-card Xyz Summon.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

Triple Drident? who tf have you been playing against? Drident has a HOPT on the 1-card Xyz Summon.

You could Lyca Viper for double? Think he means they have 3 drancia if you kill 1

[~~~~]

You could Lyca Viper for double? Think he means they have 3 drancia if you kill 1

You could summon 4 Level 4s, overlay into Drident 1, Summon another 4 Level 4s and overlay into Drident 2, and then Summon any Zoodiac and make Drident 3.

 

Then get Slumber'd

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

You could summon 4 Level 4s, overlay into Drident 1, Summon another 4 Level 4s and overlay into Drident 2, and then Summon any Zoodiac and make Drident 3.

 

Then get Slumber'd

8 lv4's in one turn? Calm down boi, this isn't pepe

[TF2_The_Scout]

Why did Rescue Cat get banned in the first place? I wasn't here for that format.

[Darj]

Why did Rescue Cat get banned in the first place? I wasn't here for that format.

 

IIRC due to lack of hard OPT or other restrictions, it could be revived repeatedly and swarm the field with Beasts that then turned into Synchros.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

 

IIRC due to lack of hard OPT or other restrictions, it could be revived repeatedly and swarm the field with Beasts that then turned into Synchros.

 

 

Why did Rescue Cat get banned in the first place? I wasn't here for that format.

Not really, Uniflora loop didn't really have that much to do with it.

 

It didn't negate the effect of monster it summoned, so you could use things like bellum to eat out two card, or panther to copy 2 cards

[Βyakuya]

This banlist was different than what we mostly expected for sure. Though Kirin and Vanitys had it coming. Middle fingers to them as they go down to card game hell.

 

Instead of a Top nerf and death of Norden, we get a Rat semi. Obviously this neuters their Emeral play and requires more input to end with a potent play, but it's a fair hit that promotes Zoo to be more hybrid based. The pure and other similar variants will have mildly harder times, likely using up Barrage + Invoker at once to end with a play, but we might see more shift to hybrids like Metal Zoo who can deal with the hit more better since Zoo is not too crucial in it, yet very potent. IF along with Barrage, Tenki, & Tops untouched will allows to retain their low-card, high-advantage, but requires more thought into resource management.

 

I can definitely see why Maxx "C" was hit again. On one hand you can prevent unstoppable T1 boards from occurring by punishing them for extra moves by drawing cards, but on the other side it's very annoying to deal with and pressures a lot to make weaker boards or suffer consequences next turn. It's a card that has been getting more potent this format, and hitting this is fair enough; forcing you to choose the right time to drop it.

[Delibirb]

I was unaware of Crystal Beast w/ or w/o Rainbow Dragon winning multiple regionals sized tournaments

 

I'm not in denial. It's a draw/search/fielding engine. It mills it's own Avarice (From the limited rat). It makes it's own Radiant off one card. 

 

Your narrow minded, as per usual, and it's fairly unnecessary here. 

 

---

 

True Draco is a separate topic. We're talking solely the merits of Zoos in OCG

You are denying that zoos were killed in OCG. They cannot stand on their own anymore. They can do other things to facilitate other decks doing well, but with no Drident, no Barrage, and 1 Rat, they exist only as an engine for other decks now.

 

I'm narrow minded? I'm afraid to see what an open minded person is to you.

 

True Draco needs to be taken into account when discussing "the merits of Zoos in OCG," because they are one of their primary competitors.

 

Regardless, this is the TCG list topic so none of this is relevant here.

 

I'm happy with everything except for lack of Drident hit, even just to 1 or 2, and Imperial order, about which I am not necessarily upset, but hesitant.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

The problem with vanity and cards like it are usually not vanities fault.

 

A game, in my opinion, should have a steady exchange of advantage. Advantage lost by vanity, advantage gained by it's removal. Vanity put both players on a statis lock where to advance, you largely had to remove vanity (yes, exceptions exist like Macro-Vanity or Yosenju)

 

If a deck is too strong, ie. Vanity makes it impossible or near impossible to out a field. That field is the problem. Not vanity. Hit that deck. 

 

Vanity and cards like it have always been the canary in the coal mine. TCG felt the proper way to deal with a gas leak was to shoot the canary. It's a sad day for YGO, and just more validation I need that OCG is the format I should play 

You are denying that zoos were killed in OCG. They cannot stand on their own anymore. They can do other things to facilitate other decks doing well, but with no Drident, no Barrage, and 1 Rat, they exist only as an engine for other decks now.

 

I'm narrow minded? I'm afraid to see what an open minded person is to you.

 

True Draco needs to be taken into account when discussing "the merits of Zoos in OCG," because they are one of their primary competitors.

 

Regardless, this is the TCG list topic so none of this is relevant here.

 

I'm happy with everything except for lack of Drident hit, even just to 1 or 2, and Imperial order, about which I am not necessarily upset, but hesitant.

 

 

April List applied, master Rules also applied

 

Shot & chaser

 

True Draco weren't a competitor lol, True Draco competed with 12 hand traps as to which would be shoved in w/ a zoodiac engine

[Delibirb]

The problem with vanity and cards like it are usually not vanities fault.

 

A game, in my opinion, should have a steady exchange of advantage. Advantage lost by vanity, advantage gained by it's removal. Vanity put both players on a statis lock where to advance, you largely had to remove vanity (yes, exceptions exist like Macro-Vanity or Yosenju)

 

If a deck is too strong, ie. Vanity makes it impossible or near impossible to out a field. That field is the problem. Not vanity. Hit that deck. 

 

Vanity and cards like it have always been the canary in the coal mine. TCG felt the proper way to deal with a gas leak was to shoot the canary. It's a sad day for YGO, and just more validation I need that OCG is the format I should play 

 

 

April List applied, master Rules also applied

 

Shot & chaser

 

True Draco weren't a competitor lol, True Draco competed with 12 hand traps as to which would be shoved in w/ a zoodiac engine

What did it win? What was its record? How big was the tournament? What else topped?

 

An image does nothing.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

What did it win? What was its record? How big was the tournament? What else topped?

 

An image does nothing.

20th Trade Market Cup

 

Preliminary Swiss Draw 4th Round + Finals Tournament 4 Battle Participants

 

4-1

 

Not Sure

 

Dinos, True Draco

 

False: Could be a three person tourney, unplayable is tunnel vision. They were always an engine. Either stuffed w/ 12 Hand Traps or Stuffed w/ 12 True Draco Cards

 

Between those two decks, 90+% percent of the meta was accounted for in OCG's Jan List