Canadian Posted February 10, 2013 Report Share Posted February 10, 2013 Just a curious thought. If Konami has enough foresight (fingers crossed), do you think they would touch consistent loops / FTKs? I mean they did with the Gishki Hand Loop last format (and M7 wasn't even released this format), but there are going to be 3 more this format: 1. The Harpie FTK. A 2 card FTK that burns you just enough for game. Very consistent and incredibly searchable. How to hit it? Well, my thoughts were to either Limit Ancient Fairy Dragon or ban the Bombardment Bird. Fairy Dragon will always have loops involving Divine Wind. Its had them since it's release. The fact that you can use Power Tool to search Symbols of Heritage afterwards has no effect on the fact that you can still spam them out. On the either side, Bombardment Bird is used for nothing other than OTK's and has a very inconsistent and unfair OTK with Chain Material and Fusion Gate looping even a single copy to burn for game. 2. Infinite Six Samurai Counters Daigusto Emeral is being released this format and thus, the full power of Infinite Counters via Gateway comes back. Looping Kizan's forever to spam out Ouroboros and have a Trishula-esque FTK / OTK at any point of the game all while being incredibly searchable is hardly fair. How to hit it? Ban Gateway of the Six or Limit Kizan. Both cards are valid hits, and if left untouched will be even less fun to play against then they already are. Even Maxx "C" can't stop this deck unless you draw into Veiler. I like Banning Gateway more as it has always been a problem card and is very one-sided. You think Whirlwind or Factory are broken? Well this card makes them all look like Code A Ancient Ruins. Limiting Kizan will only decrease the consistency of the deck while removing the loop factor. I hope they take the Chaos Dragon route and hit the power card (see: Future Fusion) this time though. And it is entirely possible they would not hit anything just so we can play around with it next format (I doubt it though, Konami doesn't like loops). 3. Evigishki Mind Augus Loop A bullshit deckout that revolves around looping cards like One Day of Peace, Card Destruction, and Hand Destruction. How to hit it? Limit Mind Augus. At least with this card limited, you wont be able to loop 2 copies forever. Some people advocate for cards like One Day of Peace to be limited and Card Destruction to be banned. While I fully support those ideas, I am only talking about how to take out the Augus loop. If other broken cards get hit in the process as well, than that is a bonus! I don't think anyone who has played against this deck would disagree about how to hit this deck. I have also seem some suggestions as to banning Aquamirror, which I would also like to happen as it would get rid of all of the Gishki loops, but that would completely destroy the deck which I just can't see Konami doing. The card is terrible in design (as are a lot of things nowadays), but the deck right now is not good enough to warrant this kind of action. The only thing that does need attention are the loops. So there are my thoughts on the three stupid loops that you should be ready for in the upcoming format. Do you think Konami will take pre-emptive action again this Banlist? Or do you think we are going to sit around with these decks until they do well enough for Konami to care about their sales? Also, if you think of other ways to hit certain cards to deal with the previous issues, or you would just like to comment on the ones already mentioned, please feel free to share your ideas. ~ Canadian. EDIT: Since posting this, I have had some more suggestions come up like banning Daigusto Emeral, banning Chain Material, and even banning Royal Magical Library (lol) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dementuo Posted February 10, 2013 Report Share Posted February 10, 2013 For #3 just ban Royal Magical Library and be done with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ihop Posted February 10, 2013 Report Share Posted February 10, 2013 Banning Chain Material seems by far the best idea to hit the Dancer FTK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sora1499 Posted February 10, 2013 Report Share Posted February 10, 2013 Banning Blaze Fenix seems to be the most appropriate. It's been a power player in FTKs for a long time now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toffee. Posted February 10, 2013 Report Share Posted February 10, 2013 ...Why not just limit Divine Wind?Though, to be fair, Bombing Bird is just ridiculous :/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian Posted February 10, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 10, 2013 Banning Chain Material seems by far the best idea to hit the Dancer FTK. Banning Chain Material does not stop the Dancer FTK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Love of Ghibli Posted February 10, 2013 Report Share Posted February 10, 2013 Ban the giant flaming bird for the first one. Divine wind just won me games against Wind-ups, sworns, and Dino-rabbit so yeah it should stay. I'm curious on proposed solutions never just get rid of the problem card? Ban the bird, Ban gateway (it was evil at inception), and while I've never been looped with Augus before ban One Day of Peace. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian Posted February 10, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 10, 2013 Some people advocate for cards like One Day of Peace to be limited and Card Destruction to be banned. While I fully support those ideas, I am only talking about how to take out the Augus loop. If other broken cards get hit in the process as well, than that is a bonus! and while I've never been looped with Augus before ban One Day of Peace. :( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~British Soul~ Posted February 10, 2013 Report Share Posted February 10, 2013 I wouldn't mind seeing Blaze Fenix go to be honest, the same with Gateway. Kill those 2 badly designed cards for all I care. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Not-so-Radiant Arin Posted February 10, 2013 Report Share Posted February 10, 2013 In an ideal world, this is all great. But, yeah........this is Konami we're talking about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Judαs Posted February 10, 2013 Report Share Posted February 10, 2013 Banning Chain Material seems by far the best idea to hit the Dancer FTK. Chain Material is a different FTK. Harpie Dancer also uses Blaze Fenix, but it is not the same FTK. -- Blaze Fenix should be banned, Aquamirror should be limited I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legend Zero Posted February 10, 2013 Report Share Posted February 10, 2013 Divine wind just won me games against Wind-ups, sworns, and Dino-rabbit so yeah it should stay.Can somebody explain the logic in this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Love of Ghibli Posted February 10, 2013 Report Share Posted February 10, 2013 Can somebody explain the logic in this? What's the illogical part? I won games because of that card or that I said it should stay because I like it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sora1499 Posted February 10, 2013 Report Share Posted February 10, 2013 [quote name="Beginning446" post="6141061" timestamp="1360519760"]What's the illogical part? I won games because of that card or that I said it should stay because I like it?[/quote] Well, you're practically admitting that its broken by saying that you won against top tier decks solely because of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Love of Ghibli Posted February 10, 2013 Report Share Posted February 10, 2013 Well, you're practically admitting that its broken by saying that you won against top tier decks solely because of it. Its a field spell in that doesn't protect itself and requires you to do something to activate its effect. No one plays it outside of decks dedicated to it, which I guess now includes this OTK FTK thing so I wouldn't say its broken. I would say that I was fortunate that no one had the MST when they needed it. If the major damage dealer in some combo is a giant burning bird then just ban the giant burning bird. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bringerofcake Posted February 10, 2013 Report Share Posted February 10, 2013 Limit Fenix and Augus, ban Chain Material. The former and latter are only used in OTKs, and it's not like they're selling the first ZeXal tins anymore. EDIT: On another note, why are 2/3 of Bomber/Grieger's extra deck monsters OTK machines? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sleepy Posted February 10, 2013 Report Share Posted February 10, 2013 Its a field spell in that doesn't protect itself and requires you to do something to activate its effect. No one plays it outside of decks dedicated to it, which I guess now includes this OTK FTK thing so I wouldn't say its broken. I would say that I was fortunate that no one had the MST when they needed it. If the major damage dealer in some combo is a giant burning bird then just ban the giant burning bird. Sorry to barg in, but that doesn't sound too right. No one plays Judgment Dragon outside of decks that can use it. No one plays DAD outside DARK decks. No one plays Inzektor Hornet outside of decks that can use Inzektors. Regardless of how much versatility or splashability it might have, it's best use is still it's best use, and if that one use is a problem, well... then that use is a problem. Just wanted to point out that bit of the post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildflame Posted February 10, 2013 Report Share Posted February 10, 2013 Even a Semi on Fenix would stop the FTK :/ (although people would find another way too loop with Dancer + Divine Wind). So I say: 1- Limit Fenix (don't see it happening) 2- Ban Gateway (don't see it happening) 3- Limit Augus (probable) Gateway is evil, but being a Limited, unsearchable card makes combos with it much more inconsistant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agro Posted February 10, 2013 Report Share Posted February 10, 2013 They won't hit the Harpie FTK this format. Just fact. Mind Augus will probably be hit. I don't think they'll hit Gateway, even if they should. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeppeli Gyro Supreme Posted February 10, 2013 Report Share Posted February 10, 2013 Gateway isn't just evil, it's been broken since its very first appearance. I would be very happy to see it gone forever. Six Sams have enough support without it, they don't been to become even more of a horrible deck to play against. I could see Bombardment Bird being limited, and hopefully Chain Material too. As for the Augus loop, I've never experienced it, so I can't say what would be the best way to stop it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blake Posted February 10, 2013 Report Share Posted February 10, 2013 1. Neither will get hit, but Fenix deserves a ban. 2. Sams won't be touched, but hitting Kizan just seems silly. 3. Augus will probably be limited, but loops exist until Aquamirror is outright banned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guuu1234 Posted February 11, 2013 Report Share Posted February 11, 2013 I thought loops were only hit when there is a decent chance that they would see major competitive play? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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