Nekroz of Unicore

[Maeriberii Haan]

Djinn Lock's problem is that it forces people to run shitty cards just to get over it.

 

I mean when funking bull blader gets run in 2015 you know something is wrong.

 

Also, that talk about luck is still very out of topic even if we stretch the definition of on-topicness, which is my main gripe.

[玄魔の王]

Djinn Lock's problem is that it forces people to run shitty cards just to get over it.

 

I mean when f***ing bull blader gets run in 2015 you know something is wrong.

And by being forced to run bad cards, they lose slots for the good ones, to say nothing of what happens games where you don't even draw said cards. Also, I'd say Book of Eclipse is worse than Bull Blader.

 

But yes, this is what was meant by "warping the format around itself".

[Maeriberii Haan]

Eclipse has more utility than Bull, but is less accessible.

 

Bull's pretty much just there to kill Claus and that's it.

[BlackBeartic]

It's funny how book of eclipse is pretty much used ONLY for breaking djinn lock.

 

It's kinda scary really. It's interesting to see everyone's take on this though.

 

If neks are really the worst best deck in ages i'm very scared to know what it was like 10 years ago.

[Queen of the Abyss]

It's funny how book of eclipse is pretty much used ONLY for breaking djinn lock.

 

It's kinda scary really. It's interesting to see everyone's take on this though.

 

If neks are really the worst best deck in ages i'm very scared to know what it was like 10 years ago.

Frog FTK, Wind-Ups at full force (Shock Lock and Hand Loop), Gishki at full force, Dragon Rulers, DAD Return (FTK included), Airblade Turbo. I survived the latter 2. I can tell you, Nekroz, outside of the Djinn Lock, would not survive either

 

OT: I feel the Djinn Lock really was just an excuse for Nekroz to get over what they couldn't get over or as a way to quickly get the mirror over. It was always ridic, but I wouldn't say from a legit standpoint that it was relatively good. It was more or less good in the Towers sense of good.

[Sleepy]

Even with the shifts on topics going on, I think it is still a fairly interesting thread to read, and as said above: There is a linear thought process behind the subjects popping out. So hopefully this doesn't get locked because of that.

 

Rituals are inherently a wasteful mechanic. Though they could have been cushioned all this time by adding flexibility to them on a card by card basis.

Let us be honest, most of the cards back in the beginning weren't thought out right, if at all. Fusions from LOB sucked, Rituals were vanillas with meh stats that were near impossible to bring out, and we got a ton more useless vanillas than we should have, among which you could see how Tribute Summon was mishandled without a care. I mean Summoned Skull was the only worthwhile one, and double tributes were too taxing to play most of the time, but even if they hadn't been Blue-Eyes would have been the go-to without much thought. Not to mention even single Tributes were thrown out the window of the game when removal made it not worthwhile to invest in them down the road.

The game IRL wasn't even made to be played at the beginning, just "cool like the show" for the most part.

 

By flexibility I mean making Ritual Spells not vanillas from the beginning. Either by giving a benefit to the Summon like how Nekroz Ritual Spells do nowadays, or making them as easy to use as any Normal Spell with un-related effects to the mechanic, with the plus of using it as a proper Ritual Spell IF the chance arises. Then the Ritual Monsters as hand traps is something I've been talking about since the 5Ds era, and they finally did a test at that concept with Nekroz. Overall Nekroz aren't really unfair. I believe they are the best Rituals have ever been in the game even with a few flaws like the power of other support and whatnot

 

Yes they are inherently worse than the other mechanics we have, but they can still improve from here like all others. 

Casual vs Competitive is eternal. I'm more of a casual but I really get the competitive mindset, and personally feel at peace with it nowadays because the gap between rogue and competitive is not a bottomless pit. Even when I do get creamed by BA or Nekroz, I'm more so like "awesome, that was an interesting anti-counter measure", and really, the decks are powerful but even THEN their true power works better in competitive matches where side deck happens, otherwise at your locals you can best them occasionally with some creativity. I beat a BA deck the other day pretty badly with Zombies.

[Darj]

I will stick to commenting on the card in order to stay more on topic.

 

Personally, my only "complain" (so to speak, since I'm not really salty nor raging about it or whatever) on this card is its field effect, and I think of it as an effect that Nekroz (Necloths) didn't deserve, as it enables them to counter certain monster floodgates that would otherwise disrupt if not outright lock them. My main example is against Verz, or rather, Ophion: in some formats, this archetype has shown up as a rogue, and yet sometimes effective, anti-Meta deck; and arguably they would have been an option against Necloths, if it wasn't for Unicore, who not only happens the be summonable under Ophion's lock as a Level4, but also stops its effect so they can follow up with a higher-Level Ritual. Granted, Necloths could still try get around it with, let's say, Clausolas, but I believe they would have to go a bit out of their way to do so (eg. attack Ophion with Clausolas and proceed with their plays on MP2 once the lock is removed), give up potential Rank4 plays along a 'Ju, among other inconveniences.

 

Another, and slightly relevant, example is against Shekhinaga: A Shaddoll player cannot rely too much on this monster against Necloths, since they can look for Unicore, drop it and follow up with Trishula and whatnot. Sure, Shaddoll players got the El-Shaddoll Fusion chain trick to enable Shekhinaga to resolve, but this comes with its drawbacks, such as requiring said Fusion Spell and Fusion materials available, while forcing you to move your game forward with a Fusion Summon when you could have reserved the resources for another situation. And yes, I know Shaddolls have Anomalilith for addressing Necloths, but this doesn't change the fact that Unicore stops Shekhinaga, who would have been a decent Fusion choice when Anomalilith wasn't available.

 

Regarding the other traits of the card (Rank4 plays with 'Jus, grave recycling, Arc Light synergy, etc.), they are really good, but I'm fine with them; its the field effect what I find to be a bit too much, because of its impact on ED floodgates.

[Azuriena]

Granted, Necloths could still try get around it with, let's say, Clausolas, but I believe they would have to go a bit out of their way to do so (eg. attack Ophion with Clausolas and proceed with their plays on MP2 once the lock is removed), give up potential Rank4 plays along a 'Ju, among other inconveniences.

 

Why is attacking with Clausolas necessary?

[(GigaDrillBreaker)]

To be honest, saying that it negates floogates is not reasonable argument, as the general consensus is that floodgates are not healthy.

 

Furthermore, Evilswarm are not a deck relevant enough to use as a complaint for a card. They are not some clever tier 2-3. They are legitimately horrible, as their owner merit only works against Nekroz.

[玄魔の王]

To be honest, saying that it negates floogates is not reasonable argument, as the general consensus is that floodgates are not healthy.

 

Furthermore, Evilswarm are not a deck relevant enough to use as a complaint for a card. They are not some clever tier 2-3. They are legitimately horrible, as their owner merit only works against Nekroz.

People are still divided on floodgates, with some people defending them.

 

I think Black previously stated that Evilswarm are one of the most disgusting decks in recent memory because of the sheer amount of flood-gating they do, and their mind-numbingly simple stratey ("Summon Ophion, sit on it").

 

The real issue with Unicore specifically is the interaction between it, Arc Light and Kaleidoscope, with the latter card being the biggest player in that scenario.

[Expelsword]

Chess is a game of perfect information. All the pieces are visible on the board, and the opponent gets to see the other player's move before making their own. You cannot "hide your pieces" forever since eventually a good chess player will catch on to your strategy.

 

It was a joke:

https://youtu.be/tXb9L8LW4XI?t=143

[Progenitor]

I don't hate Nekroz. Moreso I'm dissapointed by them. Konami finally decided to put some more effort into making a good Ritual based deck. They could have gone so many directions with it. They could have really racked their brains and attempted to make something fun and interesting. So they started at step one. What's the biggest problem with Rituals? Consistency. The rituals themselves tend to clog, the spells are sometimes difficult to get, and when the stars aline and you have both you still need fodder that doesn't give you a -60 on summon. So they went to work. The ritual spells can fetch their own fodder from interesting places, and can search themselves on a blank field to help get out of a pinch. The Rituals all have the ablitiy to not be completely dead in the hand. Some help with consistency, some offer protection. Our card in question helps recycle. It seemed like Konami nailed step one with flying colors.

 

But that's where it ended. There's no creativity. Gishki already did the consistency thing by making their Discard Searchers Salvage targets and also fill offering requirements. Konami offered little else to the table besides just making this deck so incredibly consistent it hurts. And it's because it's so damn consistent that it abuses the hell out of the generic ritual support that helps with consistency.

 

Konami focused far too much time and effort on step one and had no idea where to go from there, so instead of backtracking and putting a bit more though into it, they just wrapped it all up and called it a deck. I forget who it was, but someone on this forum recently made a ritual based archetype called Etherial (Etherium? I don't quite remember. I'll link it if I can find it). They looked similar to Nekroz, but they were all about cycling FIELD spells to summon your rituals and give them bonus effects based on which field you used so long as that field was active. It wasn't as stupidly consistent as Nekroz, but it was INTERESTING. It was INOVATIVE. It was CREATIVE. And most importantly, it looked FUN AS HELL TO PLAY.

 

Nekroz aren't fun. When you can search forever and get out your Trish, or your Claus, or Unicore, and you just do the same things over and over again because you can, it's not fun. It grows stale. Yeah they win, but I don't find satisfaction in winning like that. Hell I have at least x2 the fun playing freaking Clownblade, and I hate the fact that the engine exists.

 

Thank you for listening to my rank about how dissapointed I am that Konami really didn't put for the effort required to create something truly special and cool. Have a nice day.

[Blake]

>hating Clownblade

 

Casual Pleb Scum Mouth-Breather

 

But really, Valk isn't interesting? Sure, it draws cards, but the means to which it does so means that the deck has implications that encourage active extra thought.

 

You can call it autopilot, but it really isn't, as, like every other deck, it still has to adapt on the fly.

 

Originality is such a poor argument when you're talking about an archetype of DT Arc 1 homages. And they do just enough to all of them, with only Brio being a bit "huh?". Even then, not really.

 

Archetypes of searching like this does not mean it's uninteresting of fun. If anything, that means it's more fun to figure out what you can do with the deck beyond the core given to you.

 

It's fine not to enjoy a deck, but hating on an homage deck for being "unoriginal" is dumb.

 

And Gishki aren't consistent like that.They just have stupid interactions with existing cards and a stupid ritual spell. Making searchers that double as full tributes isn't all there was to it, especially when the deck took off due to Ptolemy and Hieratics. Don't give Gishki praise.

[Expelsword]

I was disappointed in that Konami decided to rehash WATER Rituals again, and Trishula again (Orobouros? What's that?) Like, for real, Ice Barriers are one of the biggest jokes of all time, except for Trishula and Brionac, and Gishki are one of the most annoying OTK decks around.

 

When I first saw them, I was expecting an awesome Saint Seiya thing.

I got that, but what wasn't so awesome was how everyone and their mother was playing them, and with each play they made (Kaleidoscope-Herald, Mirrors replacing themselves, Shirt boy filling the entire cost AND giving you something new) they had so many resources that it felt impossible to slow them down.

 

Unicore itself wasn't much of a problem to kill though, a LOT of Extra monsters are just plain bigger than 2300.

[Progenitor]

You no what? Credit where credit is due

Valk is a breath of fresh air. When you actually use it to extend plays and such and not hide behind it, you really start to see the potential the archetype had. But why just Valk? Why not some of the others? Valk is one of the few cards in the deck that promotes inginuity and creativeness to extend comboes and strengthen fields. If there was more Valk and less auto in the deck I would be fine with it.

 

And don't get me wrong. I absolutely adore the flavor behind Nekroz. I think it's one off the coolest flavors we've gotten in a long time. But I think that only means to strengthen the dissapointment I have for the lack of creativeness the deck has put into it. Yeah there is some neat stuff you can pull off like that Exe-Beatle Quasar combo, but that's not the deck. That's the deck synergizing with outside sources. Like I said the deck is just very stale. Of course it isn't completely autopilot based. It wouldn't win anything if it was. But everything is short and sweet. It's hard to be super explosive, and so the deck just falls into Responding to your opponent and slapping them in the face, pass, repeat most duels.

[(GigaDrillBreaker)]

I ain't reading all that, but I read a bit of what Black said, so I am going to talk about why Valkyrus is one of my favorite boss designs.

 

Valkyrus, unlike trishula, takes a more defensive role in-game, using his draw effect to make up for any advantage potentially lost over the course of the turn while also having powerful synergies with Shurit, Exa, Great Sorcerer, and outside techs such Shaddolls. Rather than tearing apart your opponent's advantage like Trishula, he allows you to maintain your own. He helps clear the field in the mirror match, and is good in threes due to his Swift Scarecrow-like effect.

 

This all could be interpreted together as too good, but I really like Valkyrus for what it is: a way to let Nekroz go for more than a few turns.

[Dog King]

wow such long posts

also this format isnt that great

not as bad as tele dad, 3 gateway, frogtk or inz/windup/rabbit/chaosdrags tho

prob missed 1 or 2 aswell

[Darj]

Why is attacking with Clausolas necessary?

 

It was just an example. They can also attack with a 'ju, Denko, or whatever; I just mentioned Clausolas because he could remove Ophion on its own if absolutely necessary.

 

To be honest, saying that it negates floogates is not reasonable argument, as the general consensus is that floodgates are not healthy.

 

Furthermore, Evilswarm are not a deck relevant enough to use as a complaint for a card. They are not some clever tier 2-3. They are legitimately horrible, as their owner merit only works against Nekroz.

 

And yet Unicore is a floodgate itself... so that makes Unicore's field effect healthy or not? I don't know myself.

 

And yes, I know Verz aren't relevant, but personally I find unfair how Unicore just so happens to conveniently play around Ophion, or Shekhinaga and other ED floodgates that would normally mess with Necloths for that matter. So, it's just a nitpick, that's all. While I do wish Verz were capable of countering Necloths just so they could have risen as a "meta call" deck at the past Necloth formats and mess with the tops (as they once did during the D-Ruler/Spellbook format), I am not really upset/sad/whatever about it. Besides, I'm not even complaining about Unicore (as I stated at the beginning of the post), nor saying that it's "omg broken, limit/ban it" only because of its interaction with ED floodgates; its other perks are certainly more noteworthy.

[Azuriena]

Konami focused far too much time and effort on step one and had no idea where to go from there, so instead of backtracking and putting a bit more though into it, they just wrapped it all up and called it a deck. I forget who it was, but someone on this forum recently made a ritual based archetype called Etherial (Etherium? I don't quite remember. I'll link it if I can find it). They looked similar to Nekroz, but they were all about cycling FIELD spells to summon your rituals and give them bonus effects based on which field you used so long as that field was active. It wasn't as stupidly consistent as Nekroz, but it was INTERESTING. It was INOVATIVE. It was CREATIVE. And most importantly, it looked FUN AS HELL TO PLAY.

 

[spoiler=Spoiler]

 

 

 

It was just an example. They can also attack with a 'ju, Denko, or whatever; I just mentioned Clausolas because he could remove Ophion on its own if absolutely necessary.

 

What I meant was that Clausolas already negates Ophion's effect, so you can go ahead and do what you would've done had you used Unicore instead. No need to waste a Battle Phase or "go a bit out of their way," even with Clausolas (although no R4, etc. is still true).

 

Though yeah, Clausolas can single-handedly deal with Ophion, unlike Unicore.

[Sunshine Jesse]

stuff

Man, all I want from Konami nowadays is consistent decks and flavor.

 

I don't personally dislike anything about Nekroz now that the Djinn lock is gone. Hell, I might actually run them. I've been playing this game for a long-ass time and am personally impressed by how well-designed things seem in comparison nowadays, even if the main effects might be a bit mundane.

 

on-topic: card is good; extra deck is for losers

[Darj]

What I meant was that Clausolas already negates Ophion's effect, so you can go ahead and do what you would've done had you used Unicore instead. No need to waste a Battle Phase or "go a bit out of their way," even with Clausolas (although no R4, etc. is still true).

 

Though yeah, Clausolas can single-handedly deal with Ophion, unlike Unicore.

 

You are right. I completely forgot about Clausolas' negation effect.