Thomas★Zero Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 So as we all know this is going to be a strong staple card in link format for the obvious reason of links. Specially when you can generate things like Firewall Dragon from the get go (if activated during the opponents End Phase) to combo piecing a Link Spider with either a Proxy Dragon to make Decode Talker or Gaia Saber the Lightning Shadow to have a Left and Right Link with 2600 ATK. In all it makes you wonder with the banlist that should be coming this month will hit scapegoat or keep it to allow the Link Format to flourish even further. Plus I have the earliest TCG version of this cards being Starter Deck Joey from 2003 :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blake Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 it's still funking sheet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLASTERZ Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 WAIT ONE TURN OH NO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azuh Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 #goatformat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragulas Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 For the time being, it also grant access to missus radiant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(GigaDrillBreaker) Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 Waiting a turn hasn't been something a deck could realistically afford to do since... Karakuri, I believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eshai Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 I mean it's not really "waiting a turn". You can just set it and do all of your other shenanigans. If your opponent is going to kill you, sacrifice a token. Who cares. Next turn the shenanigans continue. It's not a big problem to wait a turn if the prior turn wasn't wasted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blake Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 I mean it's not really "waiting a turn". You can just set it and do all of your other shenanigans. If your opponent is going to kill you, sacrifice a token. Who cares. Next turn the shenanigans continue. It's not a big problem to wait a turn if the prior turn wasn't wasted.It is waiting a turn. It's dead whenever you draw it, due to the restriction placed on it. That means it's a -1 until your opponent's turn, for an effect that's only good during your turn. It's like traps but worse, in that regard. If you can make plays that don't rely on scapegoat, scapegoat is winmoar, and it would often be better to just draw another card that actually aids your deck.If you can't make plays that don't rely on scapegoat, your deck is awful or you plain bricked, and scapegoat's phantom -1 isn't helping. it's bad, people Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordCowCowCowCowCowCowCowCow Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 Does the "cannot summon other monsters the turn you activate this card" mean you can't summon something and then play this after? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blake Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 Does the "cannot summon other monsters the turn you activate this card" mean you can't summon something and then play this after?yes it does It would say "for the rest of this turn" otherwise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordCowCowCowCowCowCowCowCow Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 So I can't even meme by playing Cannon Soldier, this, and doing 2000 damage. 0/10 trash card only good as a coaster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaiji Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 WHY IS THIS A THREAD BEFORE GOFU AT 3 POST STRUCTURE AND POST CODT SMH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~~~~ Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 smh, people forgetting to also ignore the downside of hippo tokens Super Hippo Canival needs a limit, now! or maybe they should just ban Ppal Hip Hippo. Such broken synergy between those two cards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sleepy Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 The waiting of a turn is a harsh drawback if you wanna use it in top tier decks, but it isn't a deal breaker on its own IMO. The other thing that's interestingly enough an issue, is that it summons 4.Decks aren't always expected to have that space if you have more than 1 monster on the field. This is almost only live after a field wipe and set backrow might not live that long un-targeted and un-activated every nowadays. Another added bonus is how Links have ways of not allowing Tokens. Effect Monsters, non-Token vanillas, or monsters of a certain Level or Type/Attribute that might simply not be available at all in the game in terms of what effects exist that can produce Tokens. If Gofu is any indication, this isn't a deal breaker on its own either though. There card at first sight might seem like a cheap way to bring out Links, but it is surprisingly packed with drawbacks. It really shined the most during Goat Control days because we are talking about limited S/T removal options and a format ruled by your Normal Summons and grinding out slow plays. Goat was pretty much always live. I don't think "winmore" is the right word for this though. The card would shine more (and was even originally design for) a comeback. In the old days you'd bait backrow removal, or get saved of some damage after a monster wipe. It was potentially a few turns of walling or a potential Restrict. Still, if it gets the option of activating it during the opponent's End Phase and having the chance to become a Missus Raidant + Proxy Dragon on its own, I'd say some deck out there ought to find a use for it..... It's not "trash" but it is true the current best decks don't have any use for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(GigaDrillBreaker) Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 The waiting of a turn is a harsh drawback if you wanna use it in top tier decks, but it isn't a deal breaker on its own IMO. The other thing that's interestingly enough an issue, is that it summons 4.Decks aren't always expected to have that space if you have more than 1 monster on the field. This is almost only live after a field wipe and set backrow might not live that long un-targeted and un-activated every nowadays. Another added bonus is how Links have ways of not allowing Tokens. Effect Monsters, non-Token vanillas, or monsters of a certain Level or Type/Attribute that might simply not be available at all in the game in terms of what effects exist that can produce Tokens. If Gofu is any indication, this isn't a deal breaker on its own either though. There card at first sight might seem like a cheap way to bring out Links, but it is surprisingly packed with drawbacks. It really shined the most during Goat Control days because we are talking about limited S/T removal options and a format ruled by your Normal Summons and grinding out slow plays. Goat was pretty much always live. I don't think "winmore" is the right word for this though. The card would shine more (and was even originally design for) a comeback. In the old days you'd bait backrow removal, or get saved of some damage after a monster wipe. It was potentially a few turns of walling or a potential Restrict. Still, if it gets the option of activating it during the opponent's End Phase and having the chance to become a Missus Raidant + Proxy Dragon on its own, I'd say some deck out there ought to find a use for it..... It's not "trash" but it is true the current best decks don't have any use for it.Goat control was over a decade ago, and it is a completely different game. Waiting a turn absolutely does kill it, as black previously explained. Cards like Gofu give you the advantage immediately, so it is actually useful. Anything you summon with the sheep effectively took an entire turn cycle to summon. That simply isn't worth the risk of what is a dead draw at the worst, and an extremely delayed marginal advantage at best. The payout really isn't that high. Creating 4 monsters isn't terribly difficult at this point of in the game, and pretty much any other way you would do so doesn't take 37 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sleepy Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 Goat control was over a decade ago, and it is a completely different game. Waiting a turn absolutely does kill it, as black previously explained. Cards like Gofu give you the advantage immediately, so it is actually useful. Anything you summon with the sheep effectively took an entire turn cycle to summon. That simply isn't worth the risk of what is a dead draw at the worst, and an extremely delayed marginal advantage at best. The payout really isn't that high. Creating 4 monsters isn't terribly difficult at this point of in the game, and pretty much any other way you would do so doesn't take 37 years. I don't disagree the card is bad, I just disagree it is all about its speed. I think it being fixed at 4 tokens is also a factor many decks dislike because ever since Special Summons are needed to play, you are not likely to have only 1 monster out so this card has issues even in decks that'd like trying it out. Pretty much all decks nowadays will always have at least 2 Main Monster Zones occupied even if they'd like a random extra Link there.... Also, it isn't a good idea to depend on the Goats so even if they could technically do something, it becomes an inconsistency overall, and no serious deck likes that. The card could say "up to 4" and it'd be a huge improvement to be teched IMO. Again, don't get me wrong, I AGREE the card is not gonna see any play right now. I understand Goat Control is not today, I was just talking about the OG idea behind the card, and it wasn't all my post was about.I recall this card popping out at random as recently as the Dragon Ruler days, but it just has further issues like decks that are popular nowadays not mixing in with it very well. Not just in speed (as much of a factor as it is) but also in how much their style contradicts the Goats' way of doing things. P.D. I guess right now the card IS as bad as to being called trash for the current landscape after having elaborated more on this... but guys, don't just go saying "it's funking trash" and leave.... hate it when the season comes when you guys start doing that..... You might be right but I'm genuinely interested in reading more details about it..... please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blake Posted August 2, 2017 Report Share Posted August 2, 2017 no one wants to have this conversation for the umpteenth time people have been hyping it from the announcement of links and it doesn't change that it's bad or that the reasons are nothing new Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VampireofDarkness Posted August 2, 2017 Report Share Posted August 2, 2017 I feel like if you need to summon a Link THAT bad, just run Gofu ffs. I see it in the OCG and it is cute, but it's like when they ran Barian Force and we didn't for the reasons that I'm sure Winter would put if he were here. In the same case, it doesn't translate, my friends. Even when Gofu is Limited and Zoo is murdered, I don't see it happening here honestly. Try again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragulas Posted August 2, 2017 Report Share Posted August 2, 2017 For link purposes, it may be decent on paper because how much fodder it offers, but the summon restriction makes it very slow and no different than a Trap at this point , gofu is and will be the better choince (until it gets hit). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
notcleverusername Posted August 2, 2017 Report Share Posted August 2, 2017 Honestly this topic wouldn't be as irritating if it weren't like the 3rd+ time it's come upAt least 1 of those previous times was already in a YCM topicCard economy is just the easiest way to measure card effectiveness, it's not the only oneAnd although Links are probably the best mechanic ever at converting empty economy into real advantage, Scapegoat's other measures are greater drawbacks than its economy advantage Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaiji Posted August 2, 2017 Report Share Posted August 2, 2017 we didn't for the reasons that I'm sure Winter would put if he were here. someone who owns 0 OCG cards and has access to the same info we all do is somehow the OCG arbiter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~~~~ Posted August 2, 2017 Report Share Posted August 2, 2017 Maybe the elephant in the room (referred to in the topic title) is that it summons Sheep Tokens not Goat Tokens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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