itt every card has a life point cost

[Dog King]

so what if every card had a life point cost

weaker cards have a minimum of 100 lp cost to activate effs while better cards like staple spells and traps have about a 300-1000 cost

stuff like special summoning a cydra you would have to pay too and for stuff like gale you would have to pay a second cost to half lp

activating continuous spells and traps would have costs too and maybe another small one at the end of each of your turns

 

this way long loops wouldnt exist and lp would matter much more.

 

what do you think the game would be like?

[Astolfo]

on a half-srs note, Flint Lock to see if you can outgain LP as compared to the cost you'd pay, and thus be able to outlast your opponent through sheer LP that your opponent wouldn't be able to reach since he'd have to pay off?

[Enguin Enguin Enguin Enguin]

 

You basically want this quite stupid card to become part of the rules.

[Dog King]

not really

you can normal summon without a cost

but different cards have different amounts that you need to pay

so to flip mirror force you may need to pay 600 while for sakuretsu armor its 200

and so on

 

this way lp does matter and the more.you have it the more better cards you will be able to use

[Cosmo.]

Aroma will become Meta, if this rule existed

[Yui]

So you want to run original Psychics then?  That was literally their shtick; effect monsters and spells cost LP to do stuff, then traps and synchros regained your LP.  And to be blunt, even when they were brand new, they weren't all that great compared to some other stuff.

[Darj]

Not going to lie: I like this idea, and I think it could do well to the game. Stronger cards/effects would be more taxing, while weaker ones would be cheaper, so you would have to learn to balance your LP as a resource, and build decks depending on what you can afford. For instance: go all out with expensive staples, or be more conservative and main weaker but cheaper cards instead?

 

However... I don't know about other TCGs, but as far as I know, doesn't MTG handles some kind of "mana system" that works similarly to this? Or rather, this new rule is akin to MTG's mana system? I think that this idea could be more successful if it was revamped as, rather than draining LP, draining points from, let's say, a "mana meter", that may or may not replenish gradually over time (+ X mana every turn). This way, at least you wouldn't risking your LP that becomes more valuable the less you have of it, and the duration of the duels wouldn't be compromised by the constant LP consumption.

[Just Crouton]

I like it.

 

8000 LP is lot to start with, so this makes it not look like as huge a number.

[Forest Fire]

I like it.

 

8000 LP is lot to start with, so this makes it not look like as huge a number.

See how much you'd like it if you actually had to do it. Come back here when you're ready to admit it's stupid, unnecessary, etc. 

 

The game does not need this, even if it did, there's no way Konami's doing it. That pretty much closes the topic there.

[Slinky]

[Dog King]

See how much you'd like it if you actually had to do it. Come back here when you're ready to admit it's stupid, unnecessary, etc. 

 

The game does not need this, even if it did, there's no way Konami's doing it. That pretty much closes the topic there.

you are missing the whole point of this thtead

it would be impossible to create this now because then like 5000 cards would need erratas

 

this is more of an idea of how the game would of been if life points actually mattered

this is an irrelevant and stupid post

obv if the card game started off with every card having a cost then cards like those would have never been made

and again i dont care if armoge would be the best deck at this moment, this is a discussion if the card game was much more lp based and cards were created around that

[Expelsword]

This would make so, so many cards that are decent horrible.

[Forest Fire]

this is more of an idea of how the game would of been if life points actually mattered

TIL life points don't matter in Yugioh, even though the main way through which you win in it is by making your opponent go down to 0 life points. Yep life points don't matter. At all. In fact we should just do away with the whole idea of life points.

 

This would make so, so many most cards that are decent horrible.

fixed that for you.

[Tinkerer]

Hm... Intriguing. Pure healing cards would actually be useful and burn decks/Exodia would barely have grounds to work due to the backburn.

 

It's kinda like the Speed Spell mechanics in the 5Ds games. They allowed cards that were way too powerful on their own to have a substantial cost to balance them.

 

Ultimately, I think that the banlist would be smaller, players and decks would have to find a balance, power creep might be slower, etc. Also, the most powerful decks would probably be player-made ones due to people finding unique card interactions at low costs.

[Blake]

TIL life points don't matter in Yugioh, even though the main way through which you win in it is by making your opponent go down to 0 life points. Yep life points don't matter. At all. In fact we should just do away with the whole idea of life points.

Hold up now, because you're showing your ass while not understanding the context, at all.

 

"Life Points don't matter" applies to the mindset of "If your LP are > 0, >800, or >1000, etc. you can win", with the amount being format/matchup dependant, and it has been/is true in a lot of cases.

 

While Clownblade variants needs LP to play (aka LP matter), given the drawback of Trick Clown, but a deck like Nekroz generally plays by "if I have 1 LP I'm alive", given triple Valkyrus. This has changed to a degree, given the mirror match and potentially being dead once you hit 4800 LP, but the idea remains.

 

Cards like Soul Charge (well, triple soul charge did, limited not as much), JD/Michael, Trick Clown, Dark Contracts (sometimes), and so on make LP matter, as you can just get rushed and be out of ability to use your power cards to recover. Upstart Goblin thrives when your/your opp's LP amount don't matter, as it's a near-costless 37 card deck. Not every deck needs it, but it's a very real option.

 

The idea the OP offered is a way to make LP matter. Why? All activations of cards and/or effects (latter seems overkill, honestly) have a cost that attempts to make LP more relevant. You cannot simply play a card and

 

This doubles as a resource system, but unlike most games, you start with high resources and steadily dip into lower resources. Obviously, Life Gain would be better, but straight life gain wouldn't be good, even then. However, cards like Thought Ruler would be more valuable, and cards like E-HERO Steam Healer would make more sense.

 

This is a case where you just needed to understand the phrase, as it's actually a decently common one in the YGO community.

[Forest Fire]

Hold up now, because you're showing your ass while not understanding the context, at all.

 

"Life Points don't matter" applies to the mindset of "If your LP are > 0, >800, or >1000, etc. you can win", with the amount being format/matchup dependant, and it has been/is true in a lot of cases.

 

While Clownblade variants needs LP to play (aka LP matter), given the drawback of Trick Clown, but a deck like Nekroz generally plays by "if I have 1 LP I'm alive", given triple Valkyrus. This has changed to a degree, given the mirror match and potentially being dead once you hit 4800 LP, but the idea remains.

 

Cards like Soul Charge (well, triple soul charge did, limited not as much), JD/Michael, Trick Clown, Dark Contracts (sometimes), and so on make LP matter, as you can just get rushed and be out of ability to use your power cards to recover. Upstart Goblin thrives when your/your opp's LP amount don't matter, as it's a near-costless 37 card deck. Not every deck needs it, but it's a very real option.

 

The idea the OP offered is a way to make LP matter. Why? All activations of cards and/or effects (latter seems overkill, honestly) have a cost that attempts to make LP more relevant. You cannot simply play a card and

 

This doubles as a resource system, but unlike most games, you start with high resources and steadily dip into lower resources. Obviously, Life Gain would be better, but straight life gain wouldn't be good, even then. However, cards like Thought Ruler would be more valuable, and cards like E-HERO Steam Healer would make more sense.

 

This is a case where you just needed to understand the phrase, as it's actually a decently common one in the YGO community.

tfw i was being sarcastic about life points not mattering.

[(GigaDrillBreaker)]

tfw i was being sarcastic about life points not mattering.

Next time you are being "sarcastic" don't use said sarcasm to accomplish nothing but being rude.

 

Anyway, as for adding a cost system to YGO, I think it would be an awesome change. Definitely makes upstart a more interesting card, like triple soul charge format.

[Forest Fire]

Next time you are being "sarcastic"

TIL life points don't matter in Yugioh

totally not able to be inferred as being sarcastic, esp when followed by:

even though the main way through which you win in it is by making your opponent go down to 0 life points.

totally

completely

utterly

 

This would make so, so many most cards that are decent horrible.

fixed that for you.

 

[Blake]

tfw i was being sarcastic about life points not mattering.

And your sardonic post was ill informed, only used as an attempt to tear down an argument that you lacked the knowledge to adequately tackle. "I was joking" is not an adequate defense for reprehensible actions.

 

As for the idea, I think it's cute. I think it would actually cause a lot of issues if HEALTH was the resource, considering what cards like Red-Eyes Flare Metal Dragon and Odd-Eyes Gravity Dragon already do for evne 500 LP restrictions. And Chain Energy, but that's less relevant.

 

Cards like Soul Charge already have dead draw potential, and this would make cards that are, honestly, plain good and not broken like Tricklown a lot worse, by the sheer fact that it now has to compete with other cards. Granted, it can be subverted with cards like Trapeze Magician and Hat Tricker, but it makes the card a lot worse.

 

It would add a lot of depth to the game, but you have to remember that the game has to be fun, and while I'd definitely love to test an idea like this, we really lack the means to do so. Yes, I realize it's a theory-oh, but it's a neat Theory-Oh.

[AGATHODAIMON BANGTAIL COW]

Also, I'd like to note Machismo was (very likely, like a 95% chance) joking when he said that. It's not a "Machismo is never serious" thing, but after reading many of his posts you just know. So you're just making a scene about yourself because of a joke, and you're not being funny.

 

OT: While it would make healing better than it is now (since if you're the pwotagonist who just topdecked Infernity Archfiend or whatever with just 100 Life Points, you can't do anything special with it really), I don't think healing would become actually good, especially if these healing cards also had a Life Point cost for some weird reason. As in Draining Shield might turn from somewhat bad to ok-ish, but wouldn't if it had even a 200 Life Point cost. T-Roar, Valk, and other stalling cards would too since preventing Life Point loss > Life Point gain, mostly because current Life Point gain cards are rather weak; Draining Shield (again) is one of the best healing cards, and that's mostly because it negates an attack. In the Healing Spell department, Dian Keto and Poison of the Old Man are -1 cards that may not give you enough to let you live through the one attack that would normally win the game, much less enough to let you survive one more turn. With T-Roar being as potent as it is, and basically being @18 in the form of various other cards that do similar things, healing would need to heal by a lot to be decent. Under this system, healing also has a chance at being more viable just by being readily available; if you can search Dian Keto without losing out by not spending that search on something much better than it, it would make for a nice-ish 1-of in the rare-ish case where you're barely alive, but can't make a comeback because you're only barely alive. Still, it'd be better for a better Dian Keto (Poison does this, and can instead be Ookazi, but 1200 is hardly a difference from 1000, plus it might not even matter due to innate Life Point costs).

 

While it's interesting, it's also pretty dangerous. You start with 8k Life Points, which is a huge number, but not huge enough when the numbers out to hurt it are also kinda big too, and there can be quite a few of them beating up your number in a turn. I feel that if it were implemented, it would either not be of any concern (making the whole thing about healing being better moot) and/or it would make yourself more likely to lose if you're left unguarded, since you're getting closer into whatever kill zones the opponent has just by playing the game. Cards like Raigeki and other quick nukes would feel a lot more unfair since you can leverage the payments your opponent made from extending at even a reasonable rate into a win just one turn shorter. It might not be as bad if we had more Life Points, or if it was much harder for a field to suddenly have enough monsters to make a humongous dent in someone's Life Points. Oh, and then what was already said a post above.

[Wildflame]

Not sure if I want even shorter games. Maybe if the initial LP were higher...

[mitchermitcher]

I have no idea why I thought of this when I saw the thread title but, what if in addition to the life point cost, decks could be smaller, like 30 cards or so? Would that help make things interesting or would it not really help?

 

Since you know, games will be even shorter than usual, why not make decks smaller too?

[Dog King]

idk about this whole duels would be shorter thing

 

if anything, if it was done right, duels would actually end up longer

[Sunshine Jesse]

This is a very interesting concept. It wouldn't be a generic resource system even, because you'd start with everything you need.

 

I particularly like how overextending would result in a nigh-automatic loss instead of a gradual one.

 

It does leave me with a few questions and concerns, though.

 

Would life points mattering more even be good? It sounds nice to make a game mechanic that's largely irrelevant in a lot of decks be more important, but in the context of this change, is increasing the amount of times where you literally can't do anything really a good idea?

 

What would costs be based on? Would some cards have a deliberately lower cost to give them an edge over alternatives, perhaps based on type, attribute, etc?

 

Would the costs be part of the card's effect? Or would they be a new value printed on some of the empty space that cards have now?

 

My biggest problem with this idea is that it'd result in a wildly different game. Not because I don't like change, but mindsets on how to play correctly would be entirely different than they are now, making it difficult to theorize and even more difficult to test. I wouldn't be opposed to testing in the context of a single format, but this idea, by nature, is incredibly difficult to even so much as think about- it'd just change TOO much. It might not be a good thing to discuss, especially since this forum doesn't seem to be able to spew much beyond "deck x would be meta with this change" despite it being mostly irrelevant to the discussion. It's definitely worth talking about, but SO MUCH would be different that it'd be nigh-impossible to come to any sort of conclusion.

 

I personally think it'd slow down the game too much, but that's just based on how I'd play in the beginning.

[Sleepy]

I'll read the opinions of other people more carefully after posting this comment, promise.

 

I don't particularly like the idea in the sense that the resource system is more of an ultimatum.

The kind of resource systems I'm used to in card games are those that limit the amount of plays you can make every turn, and said systems either steadily unlock more of your potential actions over time or replenish themselves after all players have had a turn and it's come full circle... or both.

 

I understand though that slowing the game down like my previous paragraph implies is not the only way people like this game. We do have a lot of cards nowadays that indicate that giving costs scattered around cards needed in a given format can add an extra risk factor and make LP matter, even if it isn't a cost for every single card played. Also, there is a change in the pace of the game in the form of your LP being smaller: You might still be able to make the same plays, but your opponent always has it easier to hurt you the more you swing towards lower LP. Plus, very late-game there might happen that time when you no longer can use certain cards because of this same reason (first thing that comes to mind is Soul Charge for this scenario).

 

That last point though is one of the reasons I wouldn't really like the concept that thoroughly engraved into the game. If you are in need to bounce back in those scenarios and everything costs something, then you just can't bounce back if said cost restriction is applying to your entire resources.

The idea is definitely possible and interesting, as it has been said by some people, and some might even like that risk factor more, but I think the way things are leave more room for variety as in, you can have decks themed around very low LP no problem, and the idea can still be made if an archetype or even a full-fledged format were to be planned with that mindset being noted.

 

 

The system also would add on very quickly. Advanced Summon methods require a lot of teamwork from materials and Tributes, so even if the cost would be something like (100 LP per Summon x Level/Rank or just [ x ] amount for Sets), I've seen 7 Summons in a single turn as not something out of this world in order to make a push back with your play. I can't help but think of Quasar costing around 3600 LP on its own. I guess in a way that balances it more (even though it wasn't really a seen as a problem card to the game's community as far as I know).