Yu-Gi-Oh! Rulings Questions

[Azuriena]

1. Can Rune-Eyes pendulum dragon attack directly for 1 (and only 1) of its attacks if it gains its multi attack effect, or must all of the attacks be on monsters?

 

2. Is there a rulings page for that style of effect somewhere that I can read?

 

edit: Its not that I don't believe people here, its just would be nice to have it explained in detail.

 

Even if Rune-Eye's multi-attack effect is applied, it can still attack your opponent once. But if you attack a monster, you cannot attack your opponent afterwards. It has already declared its 1 attack per Battle Phase, so any additional attacks it makes from that point must be on monsters.

 

The following Q&A doesn't really explain anything, but it's an official source.

 

http://www.db.yugioh-card.com/yugiohdb/faq_search.action?ope=5&fid=14693&keyword=&tag=-1

Q: If my Dark Matter Dragon's multi-attack effect is being applied and it attacks, can it attack both my opponent and their monsters?

A: In the case that your Dark Matter Dragon has attacked your opponent, it cannot make attacks on monsters due to its own effect (even if the attack was negated). Also, if your Dark Matter Dragon makes its first attack on a monster, its second attack can only be on a monster. (It cannot attack your opponent.)

[I Hate Snatch Steal]

[spoiler=question 1]

If

http://yugioh.wikia.com/wiki/D/D/D_Oblivion_King_Abyss_Ragnarok

special summons:

http://yugioh.wikia.com/wiki/D/D/D_Rebel_King_Leonidas

with its pendulum effect, does Leonidas's effect prevent the resulting 1000 damage? If not, is it because according to the rulings page:" Special Summoning the targeted monster is considered the last thing to happen when the Pendulum Effect resolves. (Special Summoning the targeted monster and taking damage are considered to happen simultaneously." ?

 

 

 

[spoiler=question 2]

I'm looking for a ruling precedent on something to use for a created card's effect, but I can't think of an exact card combo that exemplifies it. Performages might have something that sets this precedent, but I'm not sure if they do or not since I don't know them well.

The question is, "If a card effect states "Special Summon 1 monster [from somewhere], then take [some amount of] damage" such that the last thing it happen is just the damage being inflicted, in other words responding to the summon misses timing, and that effect is used to special summon D/D/D Rebel King Leonidas or Performage Trapeze magician, would the damage be negated?

 

Off the top of my head I'm not sure if this situation ever happens with the official card pool.

 

 

 

Feel free to respond even if you only know the answer to 1 of the questions.

[Progenitor]

http://yugioh.wikia.com/wiki/Problem-Solving_Card_Text

Sause for my responses.

Question 1:

"and if you do" is one of the 3 clauses that denote simultaneous resolution, so the special summon and the burn happen at the same time. In this case, it plays out exactly the same as if the monster hitting the board was the last thing to happen. Therefore, you would take damage normally from summoning Leo with CEO.

 

Question 2:

Yes. Since the summon has already occurred and resolved before moving onto the burn part of the effect (assuming a "then" clause for sequential Action Structure), then any continuous conditions the monster would impose are already in effect. In the case of Leo, "you can't take Effect Damage" is a continuous condition imposed on you that does not activate, and thus it works exactly like you described.

[Miror B]

Question 2:

Yes. Since the summon has already occurred and resolved before moving onto the burn part of the effect (assuming a "then" clause for sequential Action Structure), then any continuous conditions the monster would impose are already in effect. In the case of Leo, "you can't take Effect Damage" is a continuous condition imposed on you that does not activate, and thus it works exactly like you described.

As far as I've always been aware, continuous effects do not apply mid card effect, meaning it would work the same as the Ragnarok situation.

[Progenitor]

Ah, you're correct. I dug a little deeper using Jinzo as an example, and found out that, while the effect CAN interrupt a chain, it CANNOT interrupt an effect that is still resolving. the hypothetical situation is if you use a trap to special summon Jinzo, then the trap has another effect after the "then". Using the list of rulings, Jinzo's trap stopping condition does not take effect until the card that summoned it has resolved completely.

 

So in the given scenario, Leo's condition does not start being applied until after the effect has resolved completely, and thus you WOULD still take the 1000.

[Dragulas]

Ah, you're correct. I dug a little deeper using Jinzo as an example, and found out that, while the effect CAN interrupt a chain, it CANNOT interrupt an effect that is still resolving. the hypothetical situation is if you use a trap to special summon Jinzo, then the trap has another effect after the "then". Using the list of rulings, Jinzo's trap stopping condition does not take effect until the card that summoned it has resolved completely.

So in the given scenario, Leo's condition does not start being applied until after the effect has resolved completely, and thus you WOULD still take the 1000.

Not entirely true, in the jinzo example he cant stop a then, and if you part of the effect because its effect is supposed to stop somthing that already happened (the activaion or the effect of a trap). The action leonidas can prevent hasnt happend yet, it comes at the moment its summoned. Continous effects start applying at the very moment they hit the field, regardless if an effect or a chain is still resolving

 

Leonidas does prevent the damage the same way d arc can revert it if she was the one being summoned.

[Progenitor]

Not entirely true, in the jinzo example he cant stop a then, and if you part of the effect because its effect is supposed to stop somthing that already happened (the activaion or the effect of a trap). The action leonidas can prevent hasnt happend yet, it comes at the moment its summoned. Continous effects start applying at the very moment they hit the field, regardless if an effect or a chain is still resolving

 

Leonidas does prevent the damage the same way d arc can revert it if she was the one being summoned.

 

No.  All continuous effects are subject to the same stipulations.  Did you forget Jinzo has 2 continuous effects?

 

 Negate all Trap Card effects on the field.

 

therefore, if, hypothetically, Jinzo was special summoned by a trap whose effect was:

 

[...] Special Summon that monster, then you take 1000 damage

 

Would Jinzo be able to stop the resolution?  The answer is no.  Jinzo's continuous condition that I just pointed out cannot interupt and already resolving effect, however it can be applied to all other effects in the chain.  So while Jinzo wouldn't be able to stop the burn from this hypothetical trap, it would negate the effects of all other traps in the chain.

 

That same logic applies to Leo.  If the burn happens during the same effect, even after a "then" clause, Leo cannot apply its condition to the effect that summoned it, but can apply it to any other effects in the chain.

 

For an example, what if Jinzo is special summoned by Rope of Life?  If it works the way you describe, then Jinzo would NOT gain 800 attack.  However:

 

Rope of Life: You can use "Rope of Life" to Special Summon "Jinzo" and "Jinzo"'s ATK will increase by 800 points.

http://yugioh.wikia.com/wiki/Card_Rulings:Jinzo

[Miror B]

Would Jinzo be able to stop the resolution?  The answer is no.  Jinzo's continuous condition that I just pointed out cannot interupt and already resolving effect, however it can be applied to all other effects in the chain.  So while Jinzo wouldn't be able to stop the burn from this hypothetical trap, it would negate the effects of all other traps in the chain.

 

That same logic applies to Leo.  If the burn happens during the same effect, even after a "then" clause, Leo cannot apply its condition to the effect that summoned it, but can apply it to any other effects in the chain.

 

For an example, what if Jinzo is special summoned by Rope of Life?  If it works the way you describe, then Jinzo would NOT gain 800 attack.  However:

 

http://yugioh.wikia.com/wiki/Card_Rulings:Jinzo

Gonna pop in and say replace Rope of Life with Acid Trap Hole, as Rope of Life uses the "and" conjunction (simultaneous) while Acid Trap Hole uses the "then" conjunction (sequentially).

 

Ruling is also on your link under the previously official rulings.

[Progenitor]

Those rulings are unofficial, though not nessisarily incorrect so long as they conform to the update in PSCT. Note Acud Trap Hole is also on the list. Though that's a minor point in the grand scheme of things. Since ROL's PSCT is "and if you do" then the ruling no longer applies, but since Acid was done with "then", it still works.

 

Thanks for catching that though

[Dragulas]

I apologize for being a noob (guess we always learn something new). checked the situation on devpro, which can still serve as a reference at least, you do take damage.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

If I have victory dragon in my deck, and I lose game 1&2 can I demand rights to a game three?

[Progenitor]

If I have victory dragon in my deck, and I lose game 1&2 can I demand rights to a game three?

[TF2_The_Scout]

Are flip summons considered as summons or as changing battle position?

[Dragulas]

Are flip summons considered as summons or as changing battle position?

Both

[Skulblaka98]

1. Can Rune-Eyes pendulum dragon attack directly for 1 (and only 1) of its attacks if it gains its multi attack effect, or must all of the attacks be on monsters?

 

2. Is there a rulings page for that style of effect somewhere that I can read?

 

edit: Its not that I don't believe people here, its just would be nice to have it explained in detail.

 

 

Note the wording: this card can make up to 2 attacks on monsters during each Battle Phase.  It doesn't say in addition to its normal attack for that turn.  It literally replaces how its attacks for that turn work to coincide with the effect.  Therefore, for that turn, it can only make attacks on monsters, since all of the attacks must follow that condition.

 

Now if the effect was worded:

 

 

 

 

Then it would work how you think it should, but since that all attacks are replaced, then the most recent conditions are always applied.

 

1. Rune-Eyes can either attack monsters using its effect, or attack the opponent as per normal. It cannot do both. However, even if you activate its effect, you are not restricted from attacking directly.

 

2. Assorted rulings for Chimeratech Overdragon and Asura Priest. (Note: Asura Priest vs Magic Cylinger [uDE] is incorrect.)

 

[spoiler=question 1]

If

http://yugioh.wikia.com/wiki/D/D/D_Oblivion_King_Abyss_Ragnarok

special summons:

http://yugioh.wikia.com/wiki/D/D/D_Rebel_King_Leonidas

with its pendulum effect, does Leonidas's effect prevent the resulting 1000 damage? If not, is it because according to the rulings page:" Special Summoning the targeted monster is considered the last thing to happen when the Pendulum Effect resolves. (Special Summoning the targeted monster and taking damage are considered to happen simultaneously." ?

 

 

 

[spoiler=question 2]

I'm looking for a ruling precedent on something to use for a created card's effect, but I can't think of an exact card combo that exemplifies it. Performages might have something that sets this precedent, but I'm not sure if they do or not since I don't know them well.

The question is, "If a card effect states "Special Summon 1 monster [from somewhere], then take [some amount of] damage" such that the last thing it happen is just the damage being inflicted, in other words responding to the summon misses timing, and that effect is used to special summon D/D/D Rebel King Leonidas or Performage Trapeze magician, would the damage be negated?

 

Off the top of my head I'm not sure if this situation ever happens with the official card pool.

 

 

 

Feel free to respond even if you only know the answer to 1 of the questions.

 

 

As far as I've always been aware, continuous effects do not apply mid card effect, meaning it would work the same as the Ragnarok situation.

 

 

Ah, you're correct. I dug a little deeper using Jinzo as an example, and found out that, while the effect CAN interrupt a chain, it CANNOT interrupt an effect that is still resolving. the hypothetical situation is if you use a trap to special summon Jinzo, then the trap has another effect after the "then". Using the list of rulings, Jinzo's trap stopping condition does not take effect until the card that summoned it has resolved completely.

 

So in the given scenario, Leo's condition does not start being applied until after the effect has resolved completely, and thus you WOULD still take the 1000.

 

 

No.  All continuous effects are subject to the same stipulations.  Did you forget Jinzo has 2 continuous effects?

 

 

therefore, if, hypothetically, Jinzo was special summoned by a trap whose effect was:

 

 

Would Jinzo be able to stop the resolution?  The answer is no.  Jinzo's continuous condition that I just pointed out cannot interupt and already resolving effect, however it can be applied to all other effects in the chain.  So while Jinzo wouldn't be able to stop the burn from this hypothetical trap, it would negate the effects of all other traps in the chain.

 

That same logic applies to Leo.  If the burn happens during the same effect, even after a "then" clause, Leo cannot apply its condition to the effect that summoned it, but can apply it to any other effects in the chain.

 

For an example, what if Jinzo is special summoned by Rope of Life?  If it works the way you describe, then Jinzo would NOT gain 800 attack.  However:

 

http://yugioh.wikia.com/wiki/Card_Rulings:Jinzo

 

This is a can of worms. It is possible for continuous effects to be applied whilst an effect is resolving; however, we need to keep in mind that card rulings are issued on a card-by-card basis, and any trends noticed by us when reading them are not explicity stated as game mechanics.

 

Jinzo is a bad example to draw comparison from, as you cannot negate part of an effect. Enraged Muka Muka vs Acid Trap Hole is the oldest ruling I can think of that is relevant. It's better to ask about the specific scenarios you encounter. To answer the original question, the damage will be inflicted as normal. Here are some interesting threads for those interested:

 

http://www.pojo.biz/board/showthread.php?t=1159907

http://forum.duelingnetwork.com/index.php?/topic/172915-nobledragon-magician-vs-wisdom-eye-magician/

[TF2_The_Scout]

Can I activate 2 Double Summons to gain 3 Normal Summons? I'm pretty sure that the answer is no.

[Miror B]

Can I activate 2 Double Summons to gain 3 Normal Summons? I'm pretty sure that the answer is no.

Both old and new text make it clear you only get a second Normal Summon and not a third.

[Synchronized]

Question:

 

Let's just say my board is Mithra the Thunder Vassal (which I've SS'd using its effect) and an Eidos, which I've Normal Summoned. I activate Eidos' effect when it's summoned, then Tribute both of them for Ether.  Then, I activate Mithra's effect to gain an additional Tribute summon this turn.  I can then tribute the Ether to summon something else, correct?

 

The way it's worded and the way I've always assumed is that Eidos' and Mithra's effects are separate and both provide an additional summon, but only once per copy (meaning obviously multiples don't stack).

 

Could someone clarify this?

[Slinky]

The effect doesn't stack. The effect can only be gained once per turn regardless if more than 1 card is attempting to give the effect.

[Synchronized]

See I'm having multiple judges tell me otherwise that it does stack because they are separate effects

[Progenitor]

See the thing is, NIETHER effect says the key phrase "additional tribute summon". Instead they BOTH are phrased "1 Tribute Summon in addition to your NS/Set"

The best way to think about this is to compare it to a similar scenario: the difference between additional attack, and a second attack. If you equip 2 Powered Jerseies onto a U.A, that monster is NOT able to attack 3 times. Why? Because jersey gives a SECOND attack, rather than an ADDITIONAL attack.

Same kinda deal here. They both give you a SINGLE tribute summon that can be used in addition to the NS/Set. They both give you the SAME TYPE of resource, and that resource can only be gained once per turn.

 

My allusion is not 100% correct, but hopefully it's close enough so you understand what I mean. You can use this resource to help:

https://ygorganization.com/doublesummonlist/

Basically, under no circumstances can you gain 2 effects of the same group in the same turn. Both Mithra and Eidos are Group 2. Since they are part of the same group, you can't gain both in 1 turn.

[Expelsword]

If I activate Into the Void twice in one turn, and have Scarm, Malebranche of the Burning Abyss in my hand, after I discard my hand for the first Into the Void, can I "discard my hand" of zero before using Scarm to add a monster to my hand, or will I be forced to discard my card if I choose to use Scarm's effect?

[mr. waifu]

Burgesstoma Ruling Question:

Chain 1: Random Trap Card

Chain 2: Random Burgesstoma Trap in Grave

Chain 3: Mystical Space Typhoon OR Dark Bribe

 

If he destroys by trap, can I still summon my precious burger?

[Azuriena]

If I activate Into the Void twice in one turn, and have Scarm, Malebranche of the Burning Abyss in my hand, after I discard my hand for the first Into the Void, can I "discard my hand" of zero before using Scarm to add a monster to my hand, or will I be forced to discard my card if I choose to use Scarm's effect?

 

Yep. If you apply both your Into the Void's effects during the End Phase before Scarm's, you won't have to discard the monster added by Scarm.

 

Burgesstoma Ruling Question:

Chain 1: Random Trap Card

Chain 2: Random Burgesstoma Trap in Grave

Chain 3: Mystical Space Typhoon OR Dark Bribe

 

If he destroys by trap, can I still summon my precious burger?

 

You will still Summon it. A Trap Card being activated is the trigger for your burger's Graveyard effect. It does not matter what happens to the Trap Card afterwards.

 

Your opponent cannot activate Dark Bribe in this scenario. It can only be activated in response to the activation of your opponent's Spell/Trap Card, not just a Trap effect. It is not activated in response to that Trap Card if it is not activated in the Chain Link directly after it.

 

(If your opponent wants to prevent your burger's Summon, they should just Chain the MST or Dark Bribe to your original Trap.)

[ÆƵ–]

Can I use Igknight Unite targeting itself?