Link Summon - Decoder Talker (FIRST EVER MONSTER)

[Blake]

Well, I think I might need to rephrase "killed off" to: "more expensive". Though people with their decks "killed off" can think of that way when it comes to thinking about this mechanic .

The new cost is literally trade in temujin + ???? to open the gates.

 

It's slightly more expensive, but D/D probably has a better chance of living than anything not named Zoo.

[Pchi]

Shouldn't have to. It's a summoning method, not a cost. Unless otherwise specified, they would be able to.

That's what common sense would dictate, but I found really strange is that they didn't include anything about Tokens or Pendulums on their mini-FAQ, seeing as newbies could get easily confused by those mechanics' interactions.

[Sleepy]

I'm worried that the mechanic might end up failing at slowing down the game, and instead ended up shifting the spam focus to Links.

Just like Evilfusion, I'm not entirely sure about restricting all levels of gameplay in the community and virtually all decks released within the last decade or so.

 

Then again, the mechanic itself is pretty interesting, and if it DOES end up slowing down the game, it might be the only way Yugioh can keep on going because the speed and power of decks is/was/has been honestly ridiculous. Your third turn in any given duel shouldn't be "late game" according to my personal taste.

Plus the power the bosses.... Infinity, Quasar, Treatoad, etc. Generic negation.

 

 

I wanna be hopeful and think Konami won't waste this chance it has to slow down the game (or at the very least having decks jump through more hoops and Extra Deck slots to get to their plays). 

[~~~~]

I'm worried that the mechanic might end up failing at slowing down the game, and instead ended up shifting the spam focus to Links.

Yeah I feel this way too. I don't really think Links will change much in terms of how people play the game.

[Azuriena]

Shouldn't have to. It's a summoning method, not a cost. Unless otherwise specified, they would be able to.

 

It is a cost as is defined in this game. You can Synchro Summon using Tokens for the same reason that you can, as a cost, Tribute or banish them, but not send them to the Graveyard (or return them to the hand or Deck):

 

You use a regular monster as Synchro Material, and as a result, it is sent to the Graveyard. You Tribute a regular monster, and as a result, it is sent to the Graveyard. You banish a regular monster, and as a result, it is moved to where banished cards reside. For Tokens in all these cases, they as a result simply leave the field instead of being moved anywhere. And if Macro Cosmos is applying its effect, any card used as Synchro Material or Tributed this way is as a result banished instead of going to the Graveyard.

 

But when you send a card to the Graveyard as a cost, you do exactly that. It isn't sent to the Graveyard as a result of you doing something to it, like using it as Synchro Material or Tributing it. You just send it to the Graveyard. That is the actual action that you are to perform to pay this cost, whereas in the other cases, you pay the cost just by using the card as Synchro Material, by Tributing it, or by banishing it, and as a result, it is moved to the appropriate place. If you can't fulfill "sending the card to the Graveyard" because the card is a Token or because Macro Cosmos is applying its effect, you can't attempt to do it at all.

 

(I'm sure that you in particular already know this, just that "it's not a cost" isn't the right explanation.)

[Maeriberii Haan]

It won't slow the game in the long run if they go with the direction of chaining Link monster summons one after the other like what Xyz Spam do, since design wise that can still easily happen. Although, Link Monsters innately supports laddering, which gives me hope that the game's focus will shift to that instead.

 

Honestly, the rule change really only hurts pure synchrocentric once we're in a state with enough Link Monsters to allow decks to play. No matter how we look at it, needing to lose at least 3 potential synchro materials for a Link monster good enough to facilitate their combo is devastating. Xyz wouldn't have that much problem since a lot of them are quite disposable, pretty much the reasoning why Zoodiac will still be strong as hell (although no more force strix spam for RR i guess lol). Most Fusion decks would be able to adapt to the rule change with ease, and Pendulums basically got a slap in the wrist.

 

With how generic Decode Talker, Missus Radiant, and that spider thing, it sets some precedence on how accessible would the Link monsters be.

 

Oh anyway on another note, Brilliant Fusion is still good with this rule. Most disposable fusion ever with a good attribute and the fact you can use its extra NS first anyway, the only change now would be that it's only usable as your first ED summon unless you already got a Link going.

[Kaiji]

Literally all the cool engines in the past will find some way to be good since by themselves they function as "1 card X" which can fulfill link 2s already and make link 3 easier to summon.

 

Brilliant Fusion send Dragonpulse, use Lazuli to add it back who UP / WOKE etc

still lose out on seraphinite tho but searchable scales thumbs up emoji

 

3rd Eye Technology ©

[~~~~]

 

It is a cost as is defined in this game. You can Synchro Summon using Tokens for the same reason that you can, as a cost, Tribute or banish them, but not send them to the Graveyard (or return them to the hand or Deck):

 

You use a regular monster as Synchro Material, and as a result, it is sent to the Graveyard. You Tribute a regular monster, and as a result, it is sent to the Graveyard. You banish a regular monster, and as a result, it is moved to where banished cards reside. For Tokens in all these cases, they as a result simply leave the field instead of being moved anywhere. And if Macro Cosmos is applying its effect, any card used as Synchro Material or Tributed this way is as a result banished instead of going to the Graveyard.

 

But when you send a card to the Graveyard as a cost, you do exactly that. It isn't sent to the Graveyard as a result of you doing something to it, like using it as Synchro Material or Tributing it. You just send it to the Graveyard. That is the actual action that you are to perform to pay this cost, whereas in the other cases, you pay the cost just by using the card as Synchro Material, by Tributing it, or by banishing it, and as a result, it is moved to the appropriate place. If you can't fulfill "sending the card to the Graveyard" because the card is a Token or because Macro Cosmos is applying its effect, you can't attempt to do it at all.

 

(I'm sure that you in particular already know this, just that "it's not a cost" isn't the right explanation.)

Actually in the context of what the YGOrg article said "You can Link Summon something from your Extra Deck by sending the same number of monsters that meet the material requirements written in the card’s effect box, whose total numbers equal to the LINK number, from the field to the Graveyard", Black's statement is the right explanation. Black isn't explaining why the Link Materials can be tokens or Pendulums, he's explaining how we know they can be tokens or Pendulums. He's comparing the wording of how Link Monsters deal with their materials to how Synchro Materials deal with theirs -  and contrasting them both with cards like Emergency Provisions which have a cost of sending cards to the Graveyard. He is explaining the difference in context when a Yugioh card has "send to the graveyard" as a cost vs when an article says Synchro or Link Materials are sent to the Graveyard. 

[Azuriena]

Actually in the context of what the YGOrg article said "You can Link Summon something from your Extra Deck by sending the same number of monsters that meet the material requirements written in the card’s effect box, whose total numbers equal to the LINK number, from the field to the Graveyard", Black's statement is the right explanation. Black isn't explaining why the Link Materials can be tokens or Pendulums, he's explaining how we know they can be tokens or Pendulums. He's comparing the wording of how Link Monsters deal with their materials to how Synchro Materials deal with theirs -  and contrasting them both with cards like Emergency Provisions which have a cost of sending cards to the Graveyard. He is explaining the difference in context when a Yugioh card has "send to the graveyard" as a cost vs when an article says Synchro or Link Materials are sent to the Graveyard. 

 

The way to explain that is by saying "The article simplifies the process of a Link Summon and doesn't clarify that you send those monsters to the Graveyard as a result of you paying the cost of using them for the Summon, rather than the cost itself being sending those monsters to the Graveyard," not "It's a Summoning method, not a cost." It is a cost.

 

Note that the rulebook also says you Synchro Summon by sending the appropriate monsters to the Graveyard. That isn't incorrect; in a vacuum, you send Synchro Materials to the Graveyard. But that doesn't mean you're required to be able to send monsters to the Graveyard to use them as Synchro Material. This is pretty much your point though; the rulebook and article does not word the sending of the monsters to the Graveyard as a cost. But using them for a Synchro or Link Summon is a cost. And although I believe that the card text vs rulebook/article thing is your point, I don't think it was Black's because of how he says "It's a Summoning method," which just implies it works because it's not written explicitly on the card, that it's just a game mechanic, and thus isn't a cost. That's not the reason, and it's also not what you're trying to say here, I think.

 

I wasn't telling Black how to explain "why the Link Materials can be Tokens or Pendulum Monsters" (or even "how we know they can be Tokens or Pendulum Monsters"), because I haven't even said or implied that that is the case.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

Normal Spell Card (1) Pay 800 LP, then Target 1 face-up monster your opponent controls that can be Normal Summoned/Set; Take control of that Target until the End Phase.

 

Brain Control is better now?

[Sunshine Jesse]

I sure am looking forward to everything good about this mechanic being ruined within 2 or 3 sets.

[notcleverusername]

I sure am looking forward to everything good about this mechanic being ruined within 2 or 3 sets.

Have some faith, maybe it will take 4 sets! If they're really good about it, maybe even 5!

 

Normal Spell Card (1) Pay 800 LP, then Target 1 face-up monster your opponent controls that can be Normal Summoned/Set; Take control of that Target until the End Phase.

 

Brain Control is better now?

P sure the relative buff to Main Deck-focus will be only temporary, and in any case reasonable chance that Main Deck bosses will either be immune (True Draco) or can't be Normal Summoned (Ultimate Conductor Tyranno).

 

There's definitely many ways that Link Monsters could end up doing nothing at all to the speed of the game.

And, at the end of the day, it is also true that if you can spam a shitton of monsters, then you can probably spam Links in addition to whatever you were normally going to spam.

In that sense I don't actually expect Link Monsters to necessarily do that much to the speed of the game. However, it does give Kinamo more leverage to control future power creep, since weaker or harder to summon Link Monsters will serve to check faster and more consistent decks even if it doesn't necessarily stop them from being the best.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

Have some faith, maybe it will take 4 sets! If they're really good about it, maybe even 5!

 

P sure the relative buff to Main Deck-focus will be only temporary, and in any case reasonable chance that Main Deck bosses will either be immune (True Draco) or can't be Normal Summoned (Ultimate Conductor Tyranno).

 

There's definitely many ways that Link Monsters could end up doing nothing at all to the speed of the game.

And, at the end of the day, it is also true that if you can spam a shitton of monsters, then you can probably spam Links in addition to whatever you were normally going to spam.

In that sense I don't actually expect Link Monsters to necessarily do that much to the speed of the game. However, it does give Kinamo more leverage to control future power creep, since weaker or harder to summon Link Monsters will serve to check faster and more consistent decks even if it doesn't necessarily stop them from being the best.

I was honestly counting on people sitting on cards like Stratos and such 

 

I guess we'll see

[shadowsapex]

Aaa, I figured out why Link monsters don't have defense stats. If you switch a Link monster to defense mode, the arrows won't point the right ways.

 

In any case Synchro summoning does not sent the synchro materials as cost. If you negate a synchro summon-

Well this might be better to explain with fusion summoning. Fusion cards say "use as fusion material", and they're never as cost. Ritual summons don't send as cost. It just seems like a precedence that summoning methods don't send to a specific place and don't send as cost.

[Atypical-Abbie]

It only took Pendulums to get ruined in like one set, they were underwhealming at first, then Qliphorts came and showed everyone not to mess around with them. Ugh, Qliphorts, feels like ages ago now.

Aaa, I figured out why Link monsters don't have defense stats. If you switch a Link monster to defense mode, the arrows won't point the right ways.

Of course, though really, we all know it's because Konami likes to be as convoluted as possible.

[Arimetal]

Normal Spell Card (1) Pay 800 LP, then Target 1 face-up monster your opponent controls that can be Normal Summoned/Set; Take control of that Target until the End Phase.

 

Brain Control is better now?

For once I have to step in and say this is by all means false. People will most likely move focus on easy monster spam to make a link so they can move into bigger plays. It's a rather simple concept I think. People have played ED spam for years now so they will continue focus on that the same way they always have, just with some added steps.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

For once I have to step in and say this is by all means false. People will most likely move focus on easy monster spam to make a link so they can move into bigger plays. It's a rather simple concept I think. People have played ED spam for years now so they will continue focus on that the same way they always have, just with some added steps.

You'd need to create multiple links, and links provide a weak underbody for players to cripple the entire ED

 

It'll be better than what it is now

[Lee Cheng Men]

Wait a second! If the Link Monsters can't change into face-down, does that means my "Ghostrick" got nerfed horribly?!

[Atypical-Abbie]

Wait a second! If the Link Monsters can't change into face-down, does that means my "Ghostrick" got nerfed horribly?!

Yeah, I was thinking about that too. They are also gonna suffer from the ED rule, since they tend to have more than one up at a time to actually do anything. Sigh, Ghostrick were never meant to be playable.

[Zauls]

Not sure if this has been mentioned yet, but its pretty damn important so I thought I'd clear it up...

 

Any monster that is Special Summoned from the Extra Deck by "improper" means (ie not the usual method of summoning the card type) should NOT have to go into the Extra Monster Zone. This affects lots of relevant cards including Ultimaya, ABC Dragon Buster and Bahamut Shark. These cards do not use Synchro, Fusion or Xyz summoning to summon themselves/their targets, so should bypass this rule. This is an assumption and is not confirmed, but it should end up being the case, since summoning Extra Deck monsters through other means (like Call of the Haunted) means they go into the Main Monster Zone.

 

tl;dr Ultimaya and Bahamut Shark hardly got nerfed at all and ABCs are the best deck.

[~~~~]

Not sure if this has been mentioned yet, but its pretty damn important so I thought I'd clear it up...

 

Any monster that is Special Summoned from the Extra Deck by "improper" means (ie not the usual method of summoning the card type) should NOT have to go into the Extra Monster Zone. This affects lots of relevant cards including Ultimaya, ABC Dragon Buster and Bahamut Shark. These cards do not use Synchro, Fusion or Xyz summoning to summon themselves/their targets, so should bypass this rule. This is an assumption and is not confirmed, but it should end up being the case, since summoning Extra Deck monsters through other means (like Call of the Haunted) means they go into the Main Monster Zone.

 

tl;dr Ultimaya and Bahamut Shark hardly got nerfed at all and ABCs are the best deck.

I think you might be on the money with Ultimaya and Bahamut, but ABC Dragon Buster's correct summoning method is banishing the 3 a b anc c from grave, so surely that would still go the the EMZ

[Blake]

Not sure if this has been mentioned yet, but its pretty damn important so I thought I'd clear it up...

 

Any monster that is Special Summoned from the Extra Deck by "improper" means (ie not the usual method of summoning the card type) should NOT have to go into the Extra Monster Zone. This affects lots of relevant cards including Ultimaya, ABC Dragon Buster and Bahamut Shark. These cards do not use Synchro, Fusion or Xyz summoning to summon themselves/their targets, so should bypass this rule. This is an assumption and is not confirmed, but it should end up being the case, since summoning Extra Deck monsters through other means (like Call of the Haunted) means they go into the Main Monster Zone.

 

tl;dr Ultimaya and Bahamut Shark hardly got nerfed at all and ABCs are the best deck.

 

Best deck is still Zoo

 

ABC is still a deck with slow startup for late game brokenness. Aka Madolche 2016. Not a best deck.

[Delibirb]

I wonder if Relinquished.dek might become reasonable with all of this.

[Dad]

Well I was ready to play the game again, but this killed it for me.  Ah well.

[ihop]

My main takeaway from this is that it solves the problem of where to put the funking Pendulum scales - I always used to put them both next to eachother in a top corner but that wasn't allowed at big events like nats and there was never room to put them where they belonged.