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Mr. Hyde

By Mr. Hyde
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(GigaDrillBreaker) Enthusiast

(GigaDrillBreaker)

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Tbh bastion is kinda bad character design, but isn't broken at all. Tracer beats him, Roadhog beats him, Junkrat beats him, Genji beats him, Hanzo beats him, and Zarya can pivot his DPS into a team kill if you time the shield right.

 

Yes, he is incredibly strong, but there is just so much counterplay. Overwatch is a game that heavily emphasizes changing characters. No, a Reinhardt isn't going to beat bastion, but two of the other tanks will, and chances are your team already has a counter.

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VCR_CAT Apprentice

VCR_CAT

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I should clarify: I was a jerk with them, not saying the characters are jerk characters. I played Tracer like a TF2 Scout (probably not the best way to play Tracer, but it's the closest videogame equivalent that I was good at) which is to say I was annoying af.

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Cherz Newbie

Cherz

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Eh, Bastion can still be flushed out of corners though. Like, Dva ult forces his ass to unmount and move, allowing your team to storm the corner, and her defense matrix can negate his dps for 3 seconds, letting a hanzo/WM/anyone deal with him. If you don't wanna go Dva go widowmaker and take shots at him from unexpected positions. He can't shoot you and your team. Peek out, take a shot, go behind cover and charge another. If he isn't watching you you'll kill him, if he is your team can kill him. Hanzo does the same thing. Bastion isn't even that bad. Its just about counterpicking the Bastion.

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(GigaDrillBreaker) Enthusiast

(GigaDrillBreaker)

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I should clarify: I was a jerk with them, not saying the characters are jerk characters. I played Tracer like a TF2 Scout (probably not the best way to play Tracer, but it's the closest videogame equivalent that I was good at) which is to say I was annoying af.

When tracer isn't emptying clips into heads and just melting through the enemy team, she operates like a mosquito. She just keeps popping up bothering the team, and every time you think you swatted her she turns out to be totally fine.

 

It is fantastic.
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Thar Rookie

Thar

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When tracer isn't emptying clips into heads and just melting through the enemy team, she operates like a mosquito. She just keeps popping up bothering the team, and every time you think you swatted her she turns out to be totally fine.

 

It is fantastic.

 

That E move of hers is literally "oh sheet you got me- lol jk"

 

She's an absolute nightmare to snipers.

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(GigaDrillBreaker) Enthusiast

(GigaDrillBreaker)

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That E move of hers is literally "oh sheet you got me- lol jk"

 

She's an absolute nightmare to snipers.

While playing as tracer, if you get hit by a flashbang hold e. The first hit from fan the hammer will unstun you and you recall before the rest hit.

 

Then you get to execute the mccree who has no idea what just happened.
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Progenitor Newbie

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Tbh bastion is kinda bad character design, but isn't broken at all. Tracer beats him, Roadhog beats him, Junkrat beats him, Genji beats him, Hanzo beats him, and Zarya can pivot his DPS into a team kill if you time the shield right.

 

Yes, he is incredibly strong, but there is just so much counterplay. Overwatch is a game that heavily emphasizes changing characters. No, a Reinhardt isn't going to beat bastion, but two of the other tanks will, and chances are your team already has a counter.

 

Tracer beats him if she has ult.  congrats you killed one person.  Yeah she can blink around and be annoying but if that bastion lands like 3-4 headshots you're dead.

Roadhog beats him only depending on how much damage your opening shot did.  Your only course of action is Shot > Hook > Shot > Melee.  If that doesn't kill, you're dead.

Junkrat can beat him with proper angles, but if he's anywhere in bastion's line of sight rather than getting trick shots around the corner he's gonna have a bad time.

I already explained why Genji only beats an inattentive bastion

Hanzo beats him if he's set up in a corner.  You have to get a scatter arrow behind him.  otherwise he just doesn't do enough damage.  Widow does that job a bit better.

Zarya can only make one of the aformentioned heroes kill him a but more consistently.  she can't do anything by herself or even with a mercy.

 

 

Eh, Bastion can still be flushed out of corners though. Like, Dva ult forces his ass to unmount and move, allowing your team to storm the corner, and her defense matrix can negate his dps for 3 seconds, letting a hanzo/WM/anyone deal with him. If you don't wanna go Dva go widowmaker and take shots at him from unexpected positions. He can't shoot you and your team. Peek out, take a shot, go behind cover and charge another. If he isn't watching you you'll kill him, if he is your team can kill him. Hanzo does the same thing. Bastion isn't even that bad. Its just about counterpicking the Bastion.

 

This is exactly my point.  Bastion does not have a hard counter.  Chances are, no matter where he sets up, he's gonna get at least 2-3 kills before people realize where he is and either kill him or force him to move.  It takes Ults to flush him out.  It takes upwards of 3 people working in unison to overwhelm him.

 

but that's the same for every other hero in the game, except it's practically required for bastion.

 

Every character in OW has another character that literally just shits on them.  that's what hard counters are.  The problem is that bastion has no hard counters.  no one that really just doesn't even care that he's there.  At best he has a couple 50/50 encounters.  D Va is the closest thing to one.  Her high armor allows her to more effectively tank through bastion's damage, and her AT Field thingy allows her to stall until he has to reload, then attempt to take him out while your team backs you up.  But even then, D Va has such a massive crit spot that bastion can still kinda mow her down, while she doesn't do nearly enough damage to be a real threat.

 

His design isn't the dreadful part though, it's the numbers.  Bastion can fire 35 rounds per second in his turret mode and each round does 4-15 damage based on range.  Thats a damage range of 140-525 per second.  His ammo supply is 200 rounds.  That means he can fire continuously for 5.71 seconds, which means he can do 800-3000 damage per magazine.

 

THATS ABSOLUTELY LUDICROUS.  When would you ever need that much damage?!  and that doesn't even take into account headshots. assuming perfect headshot aimbot that's 1600-6000 damage per magazine.  I don't understand why a slight damage nerf is so out of the question.  no other hero period can even come close to that much, and it's not even an ult.

 

AND on top of THAT, he has armor in his health pool, and he can self heal.  why not?  Honestly I think it's completely fair to not have the highest DPS character be a bit risky to stay stationary in one spot forever and not have to go look for a health pack on occasion, which gives your team a chance to pounce on him.  That almost sounds like an interesting character.  But nah he's fine where he is.

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(GigaDrillBreaker) Enthusiast

(GigaDrillBreaker)

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You have a lot of numbers, but I honestly think you are overestimating just how effective he is. Bastions have their place in competitive play, yes, but they are far from overwhelming. Compared to actually broken heroes like pre-nerf mccree and widow, bastion is plagued by a huge variety of counterplay options, while also being severely hindered by lack of mobility.

 

I hate to pull the "git gud" card, but every player has their own strengths and weaknesses, and it seems you really just need to practice against him, maybe in a custom game against a friend, so you are more accustomed to the lines of counterplay. When the game was first released, tons of people shared your sentiment, and many players first picking up the game do as well, but once you have it all figured out bastion really isn't a balancing threat at all.

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Progenitor Newbie

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Guys, just be glad Bastion didn't keep his shield.

lol right?

 

You have a lot of numbers, but I honestly think you are overestimating just how effective he is. Bastions have their place in competitive play, yes, but they are far from overwhelming. Compared to actually broken heroes like pre-nerf mccree and widow, bastion is plagued by a huge variety of counterplay options, while also being severely hindered by lack of mobility.

 

I hate to pull the "git gud" card, but every player has their own strengths and weaknesses, and it seems you really just need to practice against him, maybe in a custom game against a friend, so you are more accustomed to the lines of counterplay. When the game was first released, tons of people shared your sentiment, and many players first picking up the game do as well, but once you have it all figured out bastion really isn't a balancing threat at all.

No, believe me I do my research fairly extensively.  I'm trying to say that Bastion's numbers and design are counter-intuitive to how OW seems to be built, were every hero has at least one difficult matchup.  Bastion is one of those few, if not the only one, where no single hero is able to give him a hard time.  Instead, he's one of the few heroes that can give everyone a tough time.

 

Sure, a coordinated team can very easily outplay him.  That was never in question.  My point is, why do you need a coordinated team to take out one player?  That's the main gist of it.  Lowering his damage output or swaping his self heal for something more creative would both completely change how I view the character, cuz it means Roadhog will actually have time to fire 3 times instead of just 2, which will definitely kill bastion instead of being a 50/50, or in the latter option will force him to stop being stationary at certain points in order to seek out heals before trying to set up again, which gives more mobile heroes like Tracer, Genji, and McCree a chance to pounce while he's vulnerable.  I don't think that's too much to ask

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Thar Rookie

Thar

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If our schedules weren't so jumbled up and... well... if more people had it on PC, we could totally pull off a YCM group team via Skype call.

 

Anyway, been dominating with 76 recently. Junkrat's been fun to use too, though it's nice to lay back and snipe once in a while.

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(GigaDrillBreaker) Enthusiast

(GigaDrillBreaker)

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after playing for a while i can now say that i'm a D.Va main. As an offensive i main Tracer, as a Support i main Zenyatta for offense and Symmetra for defense and as defensive i'm a Mein

I would play a lot more D.Va if she wasn't so damn terrible.

 

At least I get to spam mlg airhorn sounds in voice chat whenever I have a good ult.
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Chaosix Newbie

Chaosix

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I would play a lot more D.Va if she wasn't so damn terrible.

what do you mean, terrible? you just aren't doing it right.

 

At least I get to spam mlg airhorn sounds in voice chat whenever I have a good ult.

"good ult", what do you mean "good ult", there cant be good ones if there aren't any bad ones.

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